John Deere 4300 Shaking When Engaging HST (forward or reverse)

[Kinjun]

Note: I initially posted this in a general forum. A member recommended I post to this forum instead. Not sure how to delete my prior form. Apologies for the poor form.

Also, I'm currently in the process of replacing the tensioner for the pedal assembly. It was stuck in the "compressed" position. Another poster recommended that I replace the fluids, filters and screen. I'm beginning that activity today.

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First time poster here. Glad to join the community.

I have a John Deere 4300 HST that came with a house we purchased earlier this year (February of 2021). It has about 2700 hours on it and I spend approximately 8 hours a week working on it as something "else" happens (little stuff so far, like losing pins in the pedal assembly, etc..). This past week we had our first snowfall. I used the tractor and the snow blower attachment it came with. Worked well. I went out to use the tractor earlier this week to blow more snow. It starts fine and idles well. When I press the HST pedals (forward or reverse) the Tractor tractor shakes violently (vibrations are below the pedals) and creeps slowly in the direction I'm pressing. I contacted the prior owner and asked if he's had this problem before. He responded with the action to cover the tractor with a tarp and let it "warm up" for 30 mins. I tried the warming up for 30 minutes last night to no avail. I'm now using the tarp method he recommended. I'll followup with wether it worked or not.

I searched for a few days on these and other forums. I can't find any reference to the issue I'm experiencing. Many hits come up with break linkage checks for stuck breaks and such. Hoping someone might have experience with this particular issue and can help point me in the right direction.

Advanced apologies if I'm posting in the wrong area. Happy to adjust.

Thank you.

 

[beenthere]

What temps are you storing the 4300? I take it not in a garage or shed.

Suspect water freezing, but don't know your location or if you have such temps (per suggestion that you tarp it to get it warmed up).

Add some more info for us.

You have a good tractor.. but maintenance to this point may be your problem. Hopefully correctable easily. Fluid and filter change may clear up oil flow without any ice headaches).

Go looking for a service tech manual for your 4300.

Welcome to TBN. This is a good place to be with tractor problems.
No apologies needed, and look forward to getting you fixed up.

 

[plastikosmd]

Funny, I do the same thing in the cold
Shake and move slow!

good luck op
Will be following let us know what u find
I’d wait for a warm day and try again?
Also curious as to temps

 

[Kinjun]

Update:

I moved the tractor into a heated shop. Temps are 65 - 70 degrees. After sitting for a few days, the same behavior occurred. Although, it was a bit more mild. I’ll attempt to post the video of the behavior here:

Since then, I followed the recommended steps mentioned. I went ahead and did a complete fluid change, both the transmission and engine. I also replaced the dampener and the brake springs (one was missing, so I went ahead and took care of it. The shaking and noise is gone! The issue was resolved following the fluid change. Much appreciation for all of the help.

As I've put things back together, I'm now experiencing some lurching. The pedals stick at times and will bounce between forward and reverse for a few seconds. It literally feels like you're riding a bull. Can't be good, so I'm looking into that issue today. I think I put something together wrong. I'm now researching postings about "stuck pedals", "creep" and linkage assembly.

I'll keep you posted.

 

[beenthere]

And the complete fluid change included cleaning the screen?

Sounds like you are getting to the problem with what has been done so far.

 

[Kinjun]

Yes, cleaned the screen as well.

 

[plastikosmd]

Good work
Keep us in loop

 

[footer200]

In the video when you are pressing the forward pedal it looks like the reverse pedal is depressed to the floor?? Sounds like the Hydro static flow is trying to do forward and reverse at the same time. With the tractor off do both pedal depress and come back up completely?
The park brake is released for sure? What year is the 4300 I see it has the hand brake on the left. My 2001 4300 has the park brake on the center console below the key.

 

[Bavarian]

Let me guess, your hydro fluid looked like coffee and cream?

 

[super55]

The shudder should go away if your run the tractor at a higher RPM. This is because right now at a low RPM your hydraulic charge pump isn't pumping enough fluid to the transmission. When you press it rapidly all the way down the squash plates are opening fully and there's not enough fluid going through. The lack of charge pressure will cause bucking as you mentioned.

Also as Footer said check the linkage and make sure return the pedals are returning properly.

Hydro transmissions and low rpms typically don't play well together. I typically just keep my 4400 hydro at PTO rpms.

 

[beenthere]

Then (according to what super55 writes) sounds like the hydraulic charge pump is a (or the) problem.

Have never experienced the HST chatter on my 4300 at low RPM and usually 1500 rpm's is where I operate.. except when rotary cutting or other PTO attachments (save for the turboSaw that is cutting stumps low at low rpm).
At low rpm and cold tranny oil, low rpm will sometimes cause a hydraulic whine (sing) that a few rpm boost up will cause to go away.

The chatter sound on the video sounds like something locked up.. parking brake holding, reverse pedal in wrong position, internal tranny fail, ??

So far, not a good description of the problem from the OP. Hoping to get more, maybe in the form of another video, from chasing down several of the proposed suggestions.
Naturally interested because I also have the 4300 and like it a lot. None of the computer/electronic "improvements" made to the models that followed.

 

[super55]

On my 4400 I can reproduce what the OP was describing but only when it is in C range at low RPMs . B range only if I am dealing with temps in the teens.

On my JD 1420 commercial mower its a different story. On a cold start with cool temps and if I mash the pedal it will do that bucking for about 10 seconds until i either throttle up or the fluid warms up.

As you said Beenthere, this shouldn't be overly difficult to diagnose compared to the 4310. When the went to the electronic hydro things got vastly more complex

 

[gstrom99]

I get the same reaction and sound, if i forget to release the parking brake. Check that?

 

[dugthompson]

The shudder should go away if your run the tractor at a higher RPM. This is because right now at a low RPM your hydraulic charge pump isn't pumping enough fluid to the transmission. When you press it rapidly all the way down the squash plates are opening fully and there's not enough fluid going through. The lack of charge pressure will cause bucking as you mentioned.

Also as Footer said check the linkage and make sure return the pedals are returning properly.

Hydro transmissions and low rpms typically don't play well together. I typically just keep my 4400 hydro at PTO rpms.

I have the same issue with a tractor I just bought. I’ve done a complete fluid change including cleaning the screen. Is their a fix for this, or is it just a part of this tractor?

 

[Hoss710]

check to make sure you don't have a stuck brake. it will do the same thing.

 

[dugthompson]

check to make sure you don't have a stuck brake. it will do the same thing.

I checked that today. It isn’t the problem. Are their any valves that need cleaned???

 

[super55]

Sorry about the delayed reply.. Been away from the computer. Is it still shuddering when running at PTO rpms even after warmed up? If you did filter swap and cleaned the screen then once the oil is warm you should not experience shudder if the RPMs are up.

Just out of curiosity did you end up using JD hy-gard or hygard lo-viscosity. If you use generic tractor hydraulic fluid it has too much viscosity for the for pump especially if you are in a area that gets winter temps.

 

[Doaaj50]

The noise you are hearing is caused by high system pressure. There is something that is loading the hydraulic motor in the transmission. It is either the motor itself, something mechanical in the gear transmission/final drive or the brakes.

The next question is why is there high system pressure?
Does the tractor ever move?
Does it act the same way in fwd and rev?
Is it the same regardless of what gear range you are in?
Have you tried it with the tractor off the ground?

You mentioned that you did some work on your brakes. Have you verified that those aren’t engaged?

 

[butter262]

My 4300 cuts the engine when forward or reverse pedals are pushed, also if I activate PtO for midmower. This all goes away after 30 to 40 minutes of warm up. So, hydraulic fluid change?

 

[RidgeTopWVA]

Years ago on my JD 4400 the dealers installed a loader with a 4 in 1 bucket , they delivered the tractor to me I started driving the tractor and the hydraulics were strained trying to over work , long story short the control leaver installed to open and close the 4 in 1 was sticking .