Just ordered my NEW Bobcat CT225! Pic Included!!

[Dmace]

It would be funny that a company specializing in loaders puts on a weaker loader...do we know this for a fact or are you just assuming based on visual?

According to a VERY reputable dealer on this site:

That is a Rhino loader.
It will either be a 2406TL or a 2407TL
2406TL lifts 850lbs
2407TL lifts 1035lbs
Now that is going from the specs in my Rhino book.

Using these numbers makes it a weaker loader, that is what I am getting to. Kioti's biggest selling point is the fact that their loaders are stonger than the competition.

Why would they allow another company to sell the exact same tractor with a new paint job? It's probably cheaper too due to large sales volumes and brand name. Obviously, they are not allowing Bobcat to use there attachments which leaves them with a slightly different/better product.

 

[TractorLegend]

So what then will be the allure of the Bobcat?

 

[Dmace]

So what then will be the allure of the Bobcat?

Mostly brand loyalty but also they will likely have a lower price, better financing, and maybe a better warranty, plus they have a wider dealer network. I highly doubt they will beat the 4 year warranty that Kioti has but only time will tell.

 

[TractorLegend]

Thats sweet of Kioti to do that to their loyal existing dealers... :~{

 

[crabjoe]

That is exactly what my dealer is telling me. All the dealer sales reps went to training school on these tractors within the last month or so and the change in loader for the "2" Frame loaders was discussed at length. Apparently Bobcat engineers and product testers said the Kioti loader did not meet their desired specs so they went in another direction. So, even though it may look more light weight, it looks like the loader was updagraded for how Bobcat wants owners of these tractors to maximize there potential (i.e. use of bobcat front mount attachments and such).

I have a friend that works for a Bobcat dealer here and he said they haven't gotten much info. Based on that, either your dealer, and all their sales reps, got special training other Bobcat dealers aren't getting or they fed you a line.

I was told that they hadn't gotten any loader specs, but was told that the loader would most likely be of Bobcat design. And regardless of what loader they were using, if your dealer went to training, they should be able to give you detailed info on the loader; not something that answers a question without answering and bad mouthing the tractor manufacturer they are buying from.

If I had to trust anyone on the loader specs, I'd believe Wallace since he has the inside track on Kioti and there's no reason for him to spit out Rhino as the loader if he was just assuming.

BTW, can you check with your dealer to see what Bobcat's desired specs are? I'd like to know why they feel Kioti's current specs don't meet theirs. I know it can't be capacity because the TYM uses the same loader but with a higher capacity. This means the current Kioti loader is under utilized on the Kioti. At least on the CK20.

 

[BTI]

I have had more than one Bobcat dealer approach me at shows.
Their exact statement to me was:
"Don't worry about price wars with us, If we can't make at least xx% on them we won't sell".
xx% was quite a bit more than what we sell ours for.
So, I doubt it'll be price they are working on.
Most Bobcat dealers have alot of overhead.
Most sales will be loyal to Bobcat owners, just a guess but that's what we are figuring.

BTI

 

[wallace]

I have had more than one Bobcat dealer approach me at shows.
Their exact statement to me was:
"Don't worry about price wars with us, If we can't make at least xx% on them we won't sell".
xx% was quite a bit more than what we sell ours for.
So, I doubt it'll be price they are working on.
Most Bobcat dealers have alot of overhead.
Most sales will be loyal to Bobcat owners, just a guess but that's what we are figuring.

BTI

Sweet!... that means we can raise our prices to compete with Bobcat!

 

[IslandTractor]

That is exactly what my dealer is telling me. All the dealer sales reps went to training school on these tractors within the last month or so and the change in loader for the "2" Frame loaders was discussed at length. Apparently Bobcat engineers and product testers said the Kioti loader did not meet their desired specs so they went in another direction. So, even though it may look more light weight, it looks like the loader was updagraded for how Bobcat wants owners of these tractors to maximize there potential (i.e. use of bobcat front mount attachments and such).

So much for the Bobcat sales claims, but where are the numbers. The KL120B lifts 1170lbs at pivot pins. The KL130B a bit more. What are the Bobcat loader numbers? And can you confirm that the Bobcat loader has QA as standard? Can't see in the photo.

 

[crabjoe]

I have had more than one Bobcat dealer approach me at shows.
Their exact statement to me was:
"Don't worry about price wars with us, If we can't make at least xx% on them we won't sell".
xx% was quite a bit more than what we sell ours for.
So, I doubt it'll be price they are working on.
Most Bobcat dealers have alot of overhead.
Most sales will be loyal to Bobcat owners, just a guess but that's what we are figuring.

BTI

Look at this quote:

I did my homework before signing on the dotted line for this tractor. The price I was quoted beat John Deere, Kubota, and Kioti (very close).

Since he's bought one, it looks like they're going to be competitive and already eating into the Kioti dealer's sales. I also don't feel most sales will go to loyal Bobcat owners. The reason is because most Bobcat owners are construction oriented. Also Kioti doesn't have a large following or dealer network like Bobcat, so anyone looking into their 1st tractor will have a tendency to go Bobcat due to name recognition and dealer network. And if the Bobcat version does come standard with the QA that's another plus to go Bobcat.

I just don't see this being good for Kioti dealers. It'll be good for the end user and Kioti since end users now have a larger service and parts network and Kioti just added hundreds more sales outlets with a signature. But for Kioti dealers.... Well it'll make it harder for them because they just got another competitor in their market that sells an identical product (except for color and possibly loader/BH).

Just be careful of what they say. When a Bobcat dealer says they won't sell if they don't make X percent. Yes, it might be true, but they're cost from Bobcat might be lower and being new to the market, they might get aggressive and go after market share.

Me, I'm in the market for a tractor and I know I'll need to take a real hard look at Bobcat because it's a Kioti tractor. And I'll be looking at it because of price and possible resale (Everyones heard of Bobcat) down the road.

Seems we'll all need to speculate on what's going to happen but we'll probably all know in the next 6 months.

 

[BTI]

It will depend alot on what the other dealer is selling his tractors for also.
I have a quote from another Kioti dealer that doesn't frequent this board.
He sells them all at list.
Doesn't move many but none the less the ones he sells are list price.
The Bobcat dealer could definitely hurt his sales.

I don't disagree with what you are saying.
But to alot of people they are new tractors.
We have the board for education. That's the reason I said it'll be Bobcat Loyals, alot of people won't know they are Kioti's. At least I hope not.
BUT it just depends on what kind of marketing they do with them.
If they are in this to really hit the market hard it's hard to tell.
You would be surprised at how many don't know the true origin of the tractors.
Regardless of brand.

The 2 most local were the ones that said this, they are also still a good distance away.
Just another tractor to fight for market share in an already full market..

BTI