killed my case 580c

[David-Davies]

I too bumbed my oil filter on my 454 IH, twice. After the second time, I could only get 25 psi at 1800 RPM, and nothing at idle. I ran it for two more years befor I spun a berring. Then I had to rebuild it.
Dave

 

[Ford tractor]

Does that engine have glow plugs in the cylinders? If so, pull them and squirt in 6 oz of ATF in each cylinder. That will lubricate the rings and hopefully allow you to spin it over. I would squirt and wait 24 hours, try to bar it over or use the starter, then repeat. For up to 7 days.

The ATF will run out of the cylinders past the rings, but you should have the glow plugs out when you try to turn it to avoid the possibility of a hydraulic lock. If it does start, crank it for a bit to blow out as much as possible to minimize the huge blue cloud you will form when it fires up.

You can google and find the 580C service manual online for about 20 bucks.

 

[redneckexplorer]

Forget pulling the glow plugs, it' s not the rings that are seized. Its the babbit BEARINGS that require a constant flow of oil. You might get it unlocked and be OK for a while. But, I would go ahead and put rod and main bearings in it.

 

[whodat526]

yea he can get it free and running then just drop the pan and roll the new bearings in that way

 

[mattellis2]

OK, next question: i took the front end apart to see if I could turn the crank that way. I didn't feel like was getting enough purchase through the starter access hole to really be applying any force.

I removed the grill and the hydraulic pump that rides on the crank. I inserted a 1/2" extension bar into the hole in the center of the hub that the pump rides on. I can turn the pulley (any by extension the alternator) but i still cant get it to start. If it were seized, would I be able to turn it with the extension bar?

When i try to fire it, I get a click from the solenoid starter but it doesn't try to turn over.


eta: also when i turn it, it is difficult at first, then gets easier...then difficult, then easier....like i am actually forcing the pistons up and down. is that correct?

 

[yooper1]

Not sure that this is the answer, but seeing as the solenoid clicks when you try to start it...maybe jump / by pass the solenoid?

Just a thought....at least to see if it turns over easy....er

 

[shiver]

Well, if you can turn the crank, I'd say that's a positive sign, unless something broke up front.

If you turn the crank via the pulley and someone is watching the flywheel,
does it turn? If it is turning, that is good too, I'd say.

If the turn the crank via the pulley and the flywheel doesn't crank, I'd say
that would be bad.

Please correct me if I am wrong here.

If the dang thing turns, but the starter doesn't engage, I'd say you'd have an
electronic problem.

Read this: Case 580C starter - Heavy Equipment Forums

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Well, if you can turn the crank, I'd say that's a positive sign, unless something broke up front.

If you turn the crank via the pulley and someone is watching the flywheel,
does it turn? If it is turning, that is good too, I'd say.

If the turn the crank via the pulley and the flywheel doesn't crank, I'd say
that would be bad.

Please correct me if I am wrong here.

If the dang thing turns, but the starter doesn't engage, I'd say you'd have an
electronic problem.

Read this: Case 580C starter - Heavy Equipment Forums

It the teeth on the flywheel moves when the front pully is turned then that is good news.

I would work it back and forth with the wrench. Make sure it can not fire should you get it to fire under compression by the wrench.

You may be OK. My 1983 JD BH start will hang sometimes and I saw how rusty it was in there when I pulled it and cleaned it.

 

[Transit]

Yes, it may be that the solenoid is not engaging the starter. The solenoid does two things.
First, there are heavy duty contacts in the solenoid that close to send current to the starter motor.
Second, the solenoid moves a gear in the starter motor shaft that engages the flywheel to spin the engine.

That clicking you hear indicates insufficient power to the solenoid. I would check all the battery connections to the starter and tractor frame. Also inspect all the wiring under the tractor in the interlock circuits.

 

[mattellis2]

Transit, are you my dad?! I have been talking with him by phone about this snafu too, and he described the operation of the solenoid exactly as you did.

I got my wife to lay under the tractor while I turned the crank. She was really excited to lay down on the sheet of plywood I put down, but I did get her to confirm that the teeth did move while I worked on the front end. I agree with you other guys that is likely an electrical gremlin at this point. Oh happy day that it happened to fail when it did, or I would have certainly ruined the engine.

My dad is going to come by on Tuesday to help me trouble shoot the electrical problems (by troubleshoot, I mean, he'll do all the work while I watch) I don't get circuits and current and amps...and I don't want to electrocute myself screwing around with the 1000 amp battery I put in the tractor 2 months ago.

In the mean time, I am going to replace the terminal claps...they're both old and sloppy as far as contact.

Thanks again for all the help.

-matt