Tractor Sizing Kubota L3901, L4701, L4060, MX5400, stability, miscellaneous

[ericm979]

The added hydraulics are often called rear remotes or SCV (selective control valves). There's one or more levers controlling one or more valves, and hydraulic couplers to plug in attachments. My Branson had two from the factory and I had the dealer add a third. I'm using the factory ones to control top and tilt cylinders for the 3pt hitch. Top and tilt lets me adjust the implements' angle front to back and side to side. For some things like a box blade they're incredibly useful. The box blade's front to back angle controls how aggressively the blade digs into the ground. Too steep and it digs in and stops the tractor, too shallow and it does not pick up much dirt. You can adjust that with the regular turnbuckle adjuster but you have to get off and do it. Being able to adjust on the fly makes it a lot easier. It adds an extra control besides just raising and lowering the blade.

The tilt lets you adjust the tilt of the blade which is useful when you're grading across a change in slope and trying to follow the slope or not follow the slope- when the tractor tilts it tilts the blade, and you might not want that same amount of tilt. There's not a lot of flat here, so this is also useful though if I could only get one I'd get the top.

I use the top cylinder for other implements too. The chipper is long and there's a short steep ramp out of the barn. If I don't tilt the chipper up it'll hit the ramp when the tractor wheels get to the bottom of the ramp.

Right now the 3rd remote is running the grapple on the loader. Eventually I will make a "3rd function" which is a solenoid operated valve triggered by switches on the joystick. There's a factory kit from Branson and at least one aftermarket kit but I want to do my own.

My first tractor did not have the hydraulics. I'm glad I got them on this one.

 

[crashz]

I skipped to the end here to answer a minor point; I mow my 2 acre lawn with my L2501 with loaded R4's with no turf damage. It just takes a little patience, as the only time I do damage is when the soil is wet and I'm too impatient. Once dry though, there is no damage as long as I'm not turning at full lock with some speed or spinning the steering wheel in one place while dead stopped. The tractor does less damage to the lawn than a car does.

I mow it with a 6ft Landpride finish mower, that does a nice job. Our lawn looks great from the road or the house, but is not golf course quality. If I was very fussy, I'd have a lawn tractor or zero turn mower for the lawn.

 

[Bullwinkle123]

I skipped to the end here to answer a minor point; I mow my 2 acre lawn with my L2501 with loaded R4's with no turf damage. It just takes a little patience, as the only time I do damage is when the soil is wet and I'm too impatient. Once dry though, there is no damage as long as I'm not turning at full lock with some speed or spinning the steering wheel in one place while dead stopped. The tractor does less damage to the lawn than a car does.

I mow it with a 6ft Landpride finish mower, that does a nice job. Our lawn looks great from the road or the house, but is not golf course quality. If I was very fussy, I'd have a lawn tractor or zero turn mower for the lawn.

Thank for the reply, good to know. Even though yours is a lighter tractor, between that and some other things I've seen and learned I'm now less worried about R4's on the lawn. There's also a Messick video where he has some fun with a small tractor and R4's on the wet grass trying to see what the tear factor is.

Now the only question is whether to get the R14's which my dealer quoted me. There just doesn't seem to be much info, and the people who actually make videos on the tires (Messick included) talk more about how it is more road-worthy than anything having to do with grass/turf. To my eye it looks like it's more aggressive than the R4.

 

[BRMyers]

I can hope you get the R14 so we can have someone report back with first hand experience with them.

 

[chim]

I've been happy with the R4's on the three different Kubotas I've had. I was also please with the R1's on the Ford. The old diamond pattern turfs on THE 2wd Cub we had when we first moved in here didn't work on anything more serious than dry grass. They did great in the snow WITH CHAINS and wouldn't even move without them.

That said, I can't help but wonder how those Nokian Hakkapelitta TR1's would do. They really look good and the videos of them in action on snow / ice are impressive. I probably live too far South of the 49th Parallel to see any in real life. I've read somewhere that Canadian Kubota dealers offer them on some tractors.

 

[old and tired]

...Even though yours is a lighter tractor...

Actually, it's the same weight as the L3901 that you were leaning towards.... (ditto with mine) the "Standard" L's are all in the same ballpark. Only if you are looking at the 4701, 4060 or MX do you get into different class size. :2cents:

And that goes for lifting capacity, too.

 

[Bullwinkle123]

A bit of follow up to share information in my search. I'm getting closer to a decision.

I priced a bunch of base tractor+loader+bucket scenarios on the Kubota web site. probably flubbing some things in my confusion about quick connect loaders, "standard" options, and such, but it was just a baseline for me to better have a conversation with the dealer(s). I've included it here as a hopefully-readable image, because the table doesn't otherwise copy&paste well, and I didn't want to link to something else that was more likely to be deleted (though I have no idea how long tractorbynet keeps image attachments).

The prices were all for HST models with mostly the same bucket, the L3901 was smaller by necessity. All prices were for R4 tires.

More realistically the pricing model is likely to ascend in the order L3901, L4701, MX5400, L4060 L4760.

Of course once you factor in all the attachments with a real quote, that are sized to the respective tractor, things balloon out quite a bit, even after incentives which the numbers don't reflect.
For example, in my table above, the L3901 figure is ~28k, and the MX5400 is ~37.3k. But once I factor in a rear blade, pallet fork frame, grapple, 3rd function, rotary cutter, and scraper blade, and state taxes, those two figures balloon to ~35.9 and ~44.8k. respectively for the L3901 and MX5400. Note that my quote didn't skimp on models of things, for example the rotary cutters were slip-clutch versions, but none I tried to stick with mechanical quick connect loaders, not hydraulic.

Of course it is at this point where we potential tractor buyers must have our heads examined, but that's a whole separate conversation.

Meanwhile, I am wrestling with the above. In my entire life I've never spent more than $30k for an automobile, so for me this is just crazy town to be considering it.

What I _should_ buy is probably the L3901. With nothing more than "book learnin'" and test drives under mybelt, it is _probably_ a fine machine. Is that PTO good enough for my gnarly field, probably. Is the machine stable enough, probably. Stability was one of the truly intangible things I was worried about. The L4060 or the MX5400 greater than 20% wider than the L3901.

My test drive yesterday had the negative-wallet effect you'd expect. I liked the MX5400 a lot more than the L3901. It's a beast. It's more than I need. I loved it. The therapist will see me at 11.


Now for the tire bit. Unfortunately it wasn't the best tire test. The L3910 and MX5400 both had R4's on them, but the L3901's tires were not loaded. I'm not sure about the 5400, I'm checking on that.
I also didn't engage in quite as tight a turning radius with the L3901 while looking at the grass-ripping properties of the tires/tractors. Finally, the ground may have been frozen. It was about 33 degrees but quite sunny. No obvious ground moisture in any case.

The unloaded L3901's R4's really didn't do much damage to the ground, so that was good, but again, unloaded tires, frozen ground, maybe not the best test.
THe MX5400, carrying an extra 1000+ pounds plus potentiall more if the tires were loaded, was not so gentle on that frozen ground/grass. It's clear I'd have to drive very carefully and under good conditions to avoid damage. And tight turns == grass ripping.

I plan to do one more comparison test drive, maybe I can find a vehicle with R14's too for comparison. The weather is warming quickly, maybe the ground won't be frozen, though the grass certainly will still be dormant at this time, it's still winter, even with the warm weather.

As for the prices, well, it's hard to justify those prices for new equipment vs what I'll save compared contracting out the work, but there are other factors such as maybe saving myself another back surgery by using a grapple to move fallen trees instead of my back and pushing my small garden cart up hill or across the field.

I've been looking for used or older equipment including an MX5200 and MX4800, and L4701. Not a lot of options in my area. Two of the three have R1 tires that I really don't want, and of course there's still the rest of the attachments I want which no longer get Kubota incentives if I'm not buying a new tractor (though that's only $700 for attachments). I'm checking craigslist too, but there's nothing of interest there for the things I want, attachments or tractors. Of course all this could change week to week, but I'm pretty surprised by the overall lack of used equipment for sale in my area.

With respect to the L4701 which would have been the best step up, price-wise, from the L3901, the dealers don't really carry them new, because the prince difference compared to the MX5400 is so small, it's almost a no-brainer to get the MX5400 for the difference compared to the L4701.

So time for another week of wrestling with choices. I'm sure retirement is overrated, what's another year of work to pay for a tractor, eh?

Addendum: I'm a fairly large guy, leg room in cars/planes is always an issue for me. When driving the l3901 I was having painful cramps up near my hip that I've never experienced before. Maybe something about operating the treadle. I didn't have that issue with the MX5400, the operator station is more spacious all around, I didn't compare dimensions. That may be a factor for me, though I cringe at spending another $9k just for leg room. Will see what the next test drive brings.

 

[jeff9366]

Damaging Turf:

When 4-WD is engaged, the front wheels/tires progress about 5% further than rear tires. This is called "slip" and its function is to improve steering crossing rough ground (more particularly traversing moldboard plow furrows.) and traction moving forward. When 4-WD is engaged, and the steering wheel turned, the front tires tend to damage turf. Therefore, most operate on turf with 4-WD disengaged, in 2-WD.

Loaded tires certainly increase proclivity to rut, in 2-WD or 4-WD.

 

[Bullwinkle123]

This is an interesting thread on stability and similar tractor models. Seems to be thumbs up all around for MX upgrades vs L01 series.
https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums.../413714-kubota-l3901-l4701-mx4800-sloped.html

 

[The Deerslayer]

I'm buying a tractor. First, let me say that my primary uses for my tractor are probably covered. The L3901 should be entirely adequate to the primary tasks. That said, I have a few secondary wish list items and concerns:

Stability:

Big concern for me, perhaps because I'm just a big chicken. My property is very hilly. I'm unsure of the slope, but let's just say that all past people who've brush hogged my field always go up/down hill, never sideways. My woods are also hilly. See next item.

Woods:

I'd like to go into the woods. I have some trails I used to maintain by hand, some logs I'd like to skid out of the woods. Casual stuff. Even if I was super serious about woods and logging, we'd be talking 10 cords/year _max_. My trails are not designed for tractors. They're wide enough to get in, but turning around may be problematic unless I modify the trails, and there's the hills, i.e. the trails are often cut into the side of a hill, so ... forward and back, no sideways.

Snow clearing. Probably irrelevant, just FYI.

I don't think the the snow blowing stuff really has much impact on the tractor size at this point, i.e. the L3901 will probably do the trick. Sure, bigger is better for weight and such. And the Grand L series has the mid-pto option for a front mounted blower. I might be okay with a pull-type rear blower if I went that way. I have a 1/4 mile driveway. Much through the woods (challenging to push the snow back there). Some large turnouts (50 feet in diameter). Gravel. In my dreams I'd snowblow it, maybe I'll settle for plowing. Under no circumstances will I snowblow in reverse. No cab, because of trees and aforementioned woods plans.


Okay, let's talk width tradeoffs:

I've mostly spoken with a dealer about an L3901. Here are the specified (default) widths of the Kubotas I mention in the title:

• L3901 - 55.1"
• L4701 - 62.4"
• L4060 - 66.5"
• MX5400 - 69.7"

So the L4060 'Grand' model is more than 11 inches wider than the L3901! That beckons to me, but perhaps it is irrational, and I don't have the a list of cost upgrades involved yet (any data anyone?). And there's the conflict, wider tractor means harder to navigate woods. Heavier tractor means more damage to lawn (when crossing), and potentially tree roots.

The dealer tells me the L3901 only accommodates 1.5" spacers. So at best I'm going to get 58.1" width. I don't know what's available for the others yet.

Anyway, just looking for advice based on your personal experience with these models and/or issues. I have a _basic_ grasp of the differences in these models, i.e. all the goodies that come with the grand L series compared to standard L. I don't have any clue about real cost differences yet. I'd guess wider models mean I need wider implements, e.g. snowblower, means more cost for attachments too.

So, long and short, I'm trying not to go overboard. I'm hoping I can do some of my secondary plans in the woods and for snow clearing. I'd really like not to end up with a broken neck trying to clear and retrieve wood from my favorite trails. This being my first (and preferably only) tractor, I'm unsure how much to worry. Thanks in advance.

First off, my apologies for responding without reading the full thread so what I will share may already have been covered. Just took a quick break from brush cutting and need to get back out there and enjoy this weather!

I have the L3901 and bought it new with R1 Ag tires because of mud and snow related applications. Plus my prior tractor had them and I found they worked extremely well for me.

Couple points: 1)As long as I am in 2 wheel drive, there is minimal impact on my lawn when I need to cross it to get to pastures, woods, etc..
2)You are able to adjust the width of the rear tires on this model, but only with R1 tires. I was unaware of this when I bought it and they delivered it with the rear tires in the narrowest setting. It was way to tippy for my liking as I have some hilly terrain as well. I switched them to the widest setting and gained about 7 inches total width. The exterior width of the rears are now about 63 inches and it has made a significant difference in stability. 3) I have used mine for the uses you mentioned and then some. It has worked well for me and I have had no regrets.

Hope this helps. Best of luck!