L3560 with cab. How would I know if I'm close to rolling over?

[Too many Kubotas]

I think inclimometers are a great help.

There has been times when I started getting nervous in my Jeep at 25 degrees, even though I know damn well it can take up to 45 or so. But the 500-foot drop to the left makes even a mere 25 degrees feel like a lot.

Yep, it's all in my head. There's no logical reason to fear 30 degrees in it, but it all depends on the surroundings.

Now, supposedly my Unimog based backhoe shouldn't be taken to more than 20, but its stock inclinometer has been bottomed out a few times - it only goes to 25. Did that feel good? Hell, no, not with a soft long travel suspension, and knowing that it would've been easier said than done to get the 16,000 lb. machine upright again.

Basically, I have no qualms about taking the little BX25D to (or past) the limit. It's dinky and would be very easy to get back on its little wheels. The L3800 isn't much different, except that I'd travel a bit farther before hitting the ground.

Now, the M6040 is a different story. When/if it goes over it'll be expensive. Because of the cab. And there's no good high anchor point to use for uprighting it, making the recovery a bit trickier. But still doable.

Foolishly, I only have a 5-degree inclinometer in it, used for grading purposes. Since I'm easily fooled by the surroundings, also putting a 45-degree version in it would make perfect sense.

 

[JWR]

First, I call BS. You have no way to get your Jeep onto a 45 degree slope in the first place (sideways) without sliding off of it with very likely rollover. If you were on it going up/down you were in a slide and ended up at the bottom with no choice.
Second, a reason to "fear" a 30 degree slope (which is 58%) is that most farm tractors are extremely likely to roll if going sideways along that slope AND a very good 4WD farm tractor with top condition tread AG tires cannot climb that slope nor ease down it unless the soil is perfect for traction. So one reason to fear it is the high probability of death or major injury and loss of equipment. And it is not 'fear' it is brains.
Third, a 45 degree inclinometer would be a good thing to be watching while you expire laying under your tractor.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

Call it what you want (even though I really don't care for being called a liar).

It's not my fault that you severely underestimate the lateral traction of a (Jeep) tire on various surfaces. How do I know that about 45 degrees is the limit? By quickly checking the Lev-O-Gauge just as it starts to fall over. Experience, in other words.

And to claim that driving up or down a 45 degree slope would simply result in sliding down is just, well, in lack of a better term, dumb. But let's call it inexperienced, and that you've apparently never seen what a 4WD can do on slopes - up, down, or sideways.

Oh well, you have inspired me to check the steepness of a slope I drive up and down with some regularity. "...a very good 4WD farm tractor with top condition tread AG tires cannot climb that [30 degree] slope nor ease down it..." you claim.

And maybe that's correct. I don't have "a very good 4WD farm tractor", but have gone up and down it with regular tractors, a Daihatsu HiJet, Jeeps, and...okay, I don't think I ever tried it with the BX25D. That little thing is a bit too squirrely for my liking, and the prairie dog holes at the bottom are large enough to engulf its teeny front tires.

Stay tuned for a number, in degrees. It'll be based on fact, not opinion.

 

[JWR]

No one called you anything. I disagree with your post. I stand behind what I said, and all of it is based on experience.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

First, I call BS. You have no way to get your Jeep onto a 45 degree slope in the first place...

No one called you anything. I disagree with your post. I stand behind what I said, and all of it is based on experience.

 

[jaxs]

It isn't necessary to have sat on a tractor much less operate one to know there's a fair amount of hogwash and poor advice being passed around here. Espouse less danger operating small tractors on hills compared to larger tractors because there's less distance to fall isn't what I call rational. The machine is likely to be on your body at some point either way and a 1k pound lawn tractor is plenty capable of breaking bones and splattering brains. But that advice pales in light of installing an inclinometer. Soft head buyers have already forced mfgrs to try and idiot proof tractors with safty devices that drive prices up and complicate troubleshooting. At what point did/does it speak to common sense and sanity of owners? Dirt bikes and 4 wheelers are better suited to daredevil recreation if one desires to engage in such. You have better odds coming out in one piece. Despite the fact many people can afford to buy airplanes ,thankfully the law forbids flying them without proper training.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

Well, shoot. No wonder I can drive up and down that slope with just about anything, without even slipping a tire...it's only 29 degrees - thankfully shy of the 30 where everything would supposedly just slide down. Except, possibly, a good farm tractor.

And come to think of it, I've driven one of the backhoes up it, too, in about 14 inches of snow.
That was in 4WD and the diffs locked, and with good tire chains. Anyway, it sure seems like another degree would really matter.

As an aside, I'm a firm believer in the laws of physics, so I'd much rather fall only two feet with a small tractor than five with a large one if it falls on its side. It's a lot like that I prefer a backwards endo over rolling over forwards in my Jeep.

Sitting very close to the rear axle, there's a relatively small radius to follow when going over backwards, compared to a forwards endo where some speed builds up. Plus, the stop is far more gentle going over backwards due to the shape of the rollcage.

 

[5030]

Tilt meters only work on cranes.

Not correct. I have one each in my M9's and I have the face marked as to where the pucker factor is at. My indicator is, when my **** gets real tight, I'm almost to the bleed point. Nothing better than finding a large gopher / groundhog hole in a field when cutting hay.. Been there and it's not a good feeling. Hidden by the hay plants but waiting for that tractor to drop into it.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

Yeah, I really should put them in the tractors, too, eliminating much of the perceived problem and instead having an idea about what the tilt really is.

So far I haven't rolled a tractor, or even only laid on on its side, but that day may certainly come. Of course, an inclinometer won't really help in my two most likely scenarios.

Having the rear blade at max offset (to get snow about five feet away from the edge of the driveway) while driving right on the ragged edge of it will probably make it happen first. It's not so much that a tire slips off the edge, that I can handle, but when the blade catches frozen clumps and somewhat abruptly turns the front of the tractor hard right. Simple physics.

Next is that the edge of an irrigation ditch gives way, or I steer into it while looking at the mower behind me. Again, driving as close to the edge as possible. Of course, that wouldn't even put the tractor completely on its side, so it'd be easy to retrieve it.

Anyway, I suspect that most injuries resulting from laying a tractor on its side (I would imagine that rollovers must be somewhat rare with modern tractors) are because the operator sticks his arm out in a futile attempt at protecting himself or the tractor. Much like passengers in 4WDs often grab the rollcage when things get iffy.

 

[Too many Kubotas]

Got curious enough to look up the specs for a stock Willys Jeep. Supposedly the MB would climb a 65 degree slope fully loaded, although I'm sure that wasn't on dirt since the open diffs wouldn't allow it.

More interesting, perhaps, is the listed 55 degree max sidehill angle. Of course, mine is far from stock, sitting about six inches taller, but it's built to keep the center of gravity low. Also, it has 10-inch wide wheels instead of the OE 4-inchers, which obviously helps with stability.

And thinking about it, I haven't laid it on its side since installing 6" wider axles. Probably because I'm so used to trying to keep it at less than 45 degrees.

 

[logcabin]

My rule is, when my sphincter starts to pucker, I start to worry!

When I first read this question my reply was EXACTLY THAT! My wording was a tad different however. I used the wording Touch and Hole! Well said my friend, well said!!

 

[5030]

When in doubt, wear your belt. Seatbelt that is and make sure your ROPS is up. I see so many pictures of owners with the ROPS folded. That does about as much good as nothing.

 

[JWR]

When in doubt, wear your belt. Seatbelt that is and make sure your ROPS is up. I see so many pictures of owners with the ROPS folded. That does about as much good as nothing.

I'm not a fan of seatbelts on tractors. Never wear them. I do keep the ROPS up. I fully understand what they do and how they do it and the necessity of having a strong cage around you while held in by the belt. No thanks. The Penn Ag Progress Days near State College has the only live demo of turning a remote controlled tractor over that exists as far as I know. I've seen it multiple times and it is very educational. Hit a hole on the lower side and purposely roll the tractor... the dummy is in a seat belt inside a ROPS. My policy is that I go to extreme lengths to make damn sure I am not turning the machine over in the first place. If slopes are THAT steep then I am going up or down them, never across, or not going on them AT ALL. If those measures don't work, stay to H off those slopes !!! It is not worth your life to cut a few extra bushes.

In 60+ years of tractor operating on 5 different kinds of tractors I have only been in serious danger of life threatening crashes or circumstances twice. Both times I was up on the seat ready to jump, which I could not have if I had been in a belt. In both cases I steered my way out of it without a crash or turnover. I do not recommend it -- the best way is to stay out of those situations as top priority. You cannot justify being IN those situations. It is your life and you have to preserve it as you see fit.

 

[5030]

On my cabbed units, I tend not to wear a belt simply because I'm completely enclosed in a ROPS certified structure which totally encompasses the entire cab but I do with the open station units and I never fold the ROPS ever, but then the ROPS also mounts my sunshade-roof... The new F series Kubota front mount mowing machine I have also has a ROPS on it and I'm on the fence about that one. I may fold it or I may not, depends on how restrictive it is when I mow with it. The Cub Tank I traded in didn't have one on it and neither does my wife's ZTR. Heck, I may remove it entirely as it bolts on to the main frame. I'll have to see how that plays out as it's still to early to cut the grass up here. In fact it's well below freezing this AM here and got down to 18 last night. Srong is springing, just slowly.

 

[truckdiagnostics]

Recently purchased a B3350 with a cab. We added rim Guard and 2" spacers. Big difference. Pucker factor way to high before for my liking.

 

[JWR]

Recently purchased a B3350 with a cab. We added rim Guard and 2" spacers. Big difference. Pucker factor way to high before for my liking.

If you operate on fairly steep ground, why didn't you go for larger spacers? I don't own a B3350 -- does it have some rear wheel spacing adjustment that is almost adequate and that's why you only used 2" spacers? Certainly ANY added rear wheel spacing reduces the pucker factor but generlly the more you spread the better.

 

[5030]

You can purchase what is referred to as an 'inclinometer' I think at least. Used to be sold on this site but not any more I don't believe. You mount it on your dash panel in front of you and it indicates the angle your unit is at so you know when your butt hole gets tight, you need to mark it as the 'bleed point' for future reference. Me, I can just tell when the 'angle of the dangle' is too severe.

In my situation I cannot space out my wheels though my wheels on the M9's are spaceable by indexing the rims to different positions. I have mine set for row spacing when running hay so I don't run over the fresh cut crop and in my situation, that is inset to the least spaced position. Actually have 4 different settings on the rears and front's.

 

[truckdiagnostics]

If you operate on fairly steep ground, why didn't you go for larger spacers? I don't own a B3350 -- does it have some rear wheel spacing adjustment that is almost adequate and that's why you only used 2" spacers? Certainly ANY added rear wheel spacing reduces the pucker factor but generlly the more you spread the better.

Good question.
Couple of reasons. In order to get chains on Kubota recommended an 11/2" spacer which they have a part number for, so i figured warranty shouldn't become an issue. I choose to go after market to 2" and I did the front also.(which they don't have a part number for) Normally I would have gone more is better. The wider stance messes with you when your tilling.
And from what i read the 2" and the rim Guard was going to get it. Big difference and I did not want to add four more inches. With the additional 2" we are at about 5" Yes I could use a wider tiller, but the tractor doesn't really have the HP. And we have access to a narrower tiller. So we use a narrow tiller and off set, adjust the three point and it works slick.

 

[JWR]

Good question.
Couple of reasons. In order to get chains on Kubota recommended an 11/2" spacer which they have a part number for, so i figured warranty shouldn't become an issue. I choose to go after market to 2" and I did the front also.(which they don't have a part number for) Normally I would have gone more is better. The wider stance messes with you when your tilling.
And from what i read the 2" and the rim Guard was going to get it. Big difference and I did not want to add four more inches. With the additional 2" we are at about 5" Yes I could use a wider tiller, but the tractor doesn't really have the HP. And we have access to a narrower tiller. So we use a narrow tiller and off set, adjust the three point and it works slick.

Front wheel spacers are of no use and do nothing to minimize turnover likelihood. You may have had other reasons for getting them.

 

[truckdiagnostics]

Front wheel spacers are of no use and do nothing to minimize turnover likelihood. You may have had other reasons for getting them.

At the time it was about the clearance for the front chains. Looking at it you could probably get away with it on the front. Be really tight on the rear. And I don't remember where I saw the recommendation for spacers with chains on the rear. It was a, "you're putting them on the rear front won't hurt." There on now and I can't see a reason to take them off.