Ls engine issue?

[RustyA]

I was hesitating even saying anything until dealer diagnosed what happened until this thread appeared. Temp was around zero tractor was warmed up at 1200 rpm for ten minutes. Plowing light snow with rear blade not much load. All was going good until regen started then flashing codes flashing regen and lots of exhaust smoke that smelled worse than burning oil. Engine started knocking then siezed. Tractor is 9 months old and truly no abuse or modifications.

 

[Wishbonez51]

WOW RustyA,

I am so sorry to hear your motor self detonated. And even though it is a NH, its made by LS and they share the same motors. It will be good to know what they say happened to the motor. Tractors are meant to be used, and you were using it as it was designed and intended for. Would also like to know if they are just going to throw in a new motor, or rebuild yours? I hope they send your in for research and diagnosing and drop in a new one so you can get her back much sooner.

 

[Avenger]

I always warm up the engine, at an idle. When it is cold outside, like it has been, I warm up at an idle for about 10 minutes, then crank her up to about 1500 for another 10 minutes or so. When this is warming up, I am typically getting my coffee or whatever. I never run at full tilt, wide open, for prolong periods. I keep the hand throttle at about 2000 and use the foot peddle for quick engine acceleration when needed. When I park it, I drive to the parking spot at about 1500, shut down to an idle and let her idle for about 10 minutes to cool that turbo. Even though it is small, I know it gets hot! And shutting down a screaming hot turbo when it is cold (or hot) out, that turbo will get hotter and then cool too quick.

My XR41 has been a great little machine so far. My dealer has not needed to work on many of them, especially the engines, the last time I spoke with him about these tractors. That OP mechanic probably meant that he has only changed 7 engines while working at that dealership. IDK. But 7 engines from the XR41 models seems a bit extreme for one dealership.

RUSTY, please keep us updated on what goes on. This is scary stuff. I was just out plowing this morning. I have broken down many times before, but usually it's something small and easily fixable. I have never completely grenaded an engine before. I cannot imagine what I would do if I blew my engine half way down my driveway at 4am before needing to go to work.

 

[Username Taken]

I was hesitating even saying anything until dealer diagnosed what happened until this thread appeared. Temp was around zero tractor was warmed up at 1200 rpm for ten minutes. Plowing light snow with rear blade not much load. All was going good until regen started then flashing codes flashing regen and lots of exhaust smoke that smelled worse than burning oil. Engine started knocking then siezed. Tractor is 9 months old and truly no abuse or modifications.

Does the LC319-T use a 'forced regen' mode?

This is a total and complete and utter WAG but I wonder if the computer didn't send the engine into regen when it just wasn't hot enough for it to happen, causing the DPF to load up, plug up with fuel and stall the engine.

:confused3:

 

[RustyA]

Coolant temp gauge was in normal operating range when I began blading snow and never changed even during the failure of the engine. Everything was perfectly normal until it began it's first regen since I bought it...then things really went downhill in a hurry

 

[3Lfarms]

Rusty, did you do the 50 hr service? What oil and filter was used?

It sure seems like the wicked cold
temps are what is causing this rash of failures. The only thing temperature related I can think of that would cause a catastrophic failure like that is the wrong oil and/or improper warmup.
I’m really curious if any of the failures had a 5W-xx synthetic oil in them.

 

[RustyA]

Since it only had 26 hours at the time of failure it had factory installed oil and filter. I bought all the stuff to perform 50 hour service from my New Holland dealer but hadn't hit the 50 hour mark yet...

 

[Username Taken]

Coolant temp gauge was in normal operating range when I began blading snow and never changed even during the failure of the engine. Everything was perfectly normal until it began it's first regen since I bought it...then things really went downhill in a hurry

Tractor is 9 Months old and just now decided to do its first regen??

I've got my suspicions but I think there's something amiss in your emissions equipment. This might be a good time for someone more knowledgeable than I (which is just about everybody) to address the use of the DPF inhibitor button and when to use it.

I'm trying to be upbeat about this. Best of luck to you

 

[Avenger]

The way I understand it, with these LS engines, is that they regen every 50hrs. Mine did, exactly at 50hrs. 26hrs over 9 months is not a ton of use, but for a home owner that only needs it to plow snow or move somethign heavy, odds and ends, that sorta thing, its not out-of-this-world low. The button is to by-pass the regen. So if you are out in a wheat field or something that you really dont want to burn down, you can by-pass it temporarily to avoid burning down your field type of thing. It shouldnt be used all the time and the regen should take place very shortly after. It is just to get you to a safe place before turning your exhaust pipe red.

I believe, but not certain, that you can also initiate a regen by using this button too. Not sure about that.

My tractor currently has about 80hrs on it, bought it this last April. It has regend once. It notified me and I did what my dealer told me to do, which was firewall the throttle and lift the bucket out of the way to prevent the paint from burning. About 10 or so minutes later, and after some odd burning smells, it was done. I throttled back and went about my day. They say you dont need to stop working, but I did, just to watch it happen.

I dont believe Rusty's issue was due to a lack of regen or the DPF being an issue. Might have, but probably not.

Just my .02

 

[Trillium Farm]

Coolant temp gauge was in normal operating range when I began blading snow and never changed even during the failure of the engine. Everything was perfectly normal until it began it's first regen since I bought it...then things really went downhill in a hurry

This may have nothing to do with the problem, but I need to point it out that Coolant Temp has nothing to do with oil temp. I don't know if you have an oil temp or oil pressure gauge, but if you don't I'd advise you to install one. Especially when cold it is this gauge that you must follow to determine how much effort to demand from the engine. Good luck Rusty I hope everything gets resolved quickly and painlessly for you.

 

[Username Taken]

The way I understand it, with these LS engines, is that they regen every 50hrs. Mine did, exactly at 50hrs. 26hrs over 9 months is not a ton of use, but for a home owner that only needs it to plow snow or move somethign heavy, odds and ends, that sorta thing, its not out-of-this-world low. The button is to by-pass the regen. So if you are out in a wheat field or something that you really dont want to burn down, you can by-pass it temporarily to avoid burning down your field type of thing. It shouldnt be used all the time and the regen should take place very shortly after. It is just to get you to a safe place before turning your exhaust pipe red.

I believe, but not certain, that you can also initiate a regen by using this button too. Not sure about that.

My tractor currently has about 80hrs on it, bought it this last April. It has regend once. It notified me and I did what my dealer told me to do, which was firewall the throttle and lift the bucket out of the way to prevent the paint from burning. About 10 or so minutes later, and after some odd burning smells, it was done. I throttled back and went about my day. They say you dont need to stop working, but I did, just to watch it happen.

I dont believe Rusty's issue was due to a lack of regen or the DPF being an issue. Might have, but probably not.

Just my .02

My theory (just a theory) is that the computer read it was okay to do a regen because of the coolant temp. So it sends raw fuel to the DOC/DPF in order to cook (400 - 500 degrees or more) all that nasty out of it. But the extreme ambient temperatures wouldn't let the fuel get hot enough. So instead of cleaning the DPF, it clogged it. Which clogs your entire exhaust system. And with a clogged exhaust system, you ain't moving. And the diesel fuel would build up inside the engine's combustion chambers and cause it to knock and generally be very unhappy.

Just a Dumb theory.

If I were operating in extreme cold, I would inhibit regen until the tractor got HOT enough to handle it. But that's just another dumb theory on my part.

Diesels don't get nearly as hot as gasoline engines. Not even close. Not even in the same galaxy. In fact, one their main problems operating in cold environments is that they don't get hot enough.

Dummy computer sends raw fuel into exhaust, doesn't burn, clogs DPF.

Just a dumb theory. Hopefully, all Rusty will have to go through is a new DOC/DPF/Muffler.

 

[Bbc396]

^^^^
That was my thinking when mine did it's first regeneration in -35 Temps and split the dpf

 

[Avenger]

I gotcha. That is a good theory! it's not Dumb.

I didnt see (or more likely forgot) that Rusty said it went into regen while plowing. The one thing that doesnt make sense is the oil being pumped out of the exhaust before seizing the engine. Granted, no oil in the engine would size it pretty quick at full rpms. If the exhaust was clogged, oil shouldnt be able to flow out either.? How would oil even get to the exhaust? Blown head? Maybe the coolant froze and cracked the head? IDK.

Rusty, please let us know what the dealer comes up with. This is starting to hurt my brain.

 

[Username Taken]

I gotcha. That is a good theory! it's not Dumb.

I didnt see (or more likely forgot) that Rusty said it went into regen while plowing. The one thing that doesnt make sense is the oil being pumped out of the exhaust before seizing the engine. Granted, no oil in the engine would size it pretty quick at full rpms. If the exhaust was clogged, oil shouldnt be able to flow out either.? How would oil even get to the exhaust? Blown head? Maybe the coolant froze and cracked the head? IDK.

Rusty, please let us know what the dealer comes up with. This is starting to hurt my brain.

Not sure it's seized as much as it's hydrolocked from all the diesel fuel still stuck in the combustion chambers that couldn't escape due to the exhaust system being clogged at the DOC/DPF/Muffler.

Again, just a dumb theory.

 

[Bbc396]

I'm think what he might have thought was oil coming out the exhaust was the fuel mixed with the soot in the dpf while in regeneration just an idea

 

[Avenger]

Regardless, this thread got hi-jacked.... Kinda.

The OP, Bbc396, talking about a mechanic replacing 7 engines in the same model tractor, and someone chimes in with blowing their tractor up this morning!

Timing.

maybe there is something to this? :confused3:

 

[Bbc396]

Don't matter if it got hijacked I own one of these tractors so I'm curious

 

[RustyA]

Sorry I did not mean to hijack thread, thought it might be related since they are sister tractors. Fluid coming out of exhaust was engine oil as it consumed one full gallon of oil within minutes, rods began knocking, then engine seized. Fuel was blended 50/50 and treated and coolant was not gelled or frozen. Engine was at normal operating temp before during and after failure...I could hold my hand on the radiator cap after failure.

 

[PCABE5]

Rusty I hope they gave you a loaner with snow coming tonight and tomorrow.

 

[RustyA]

My dealer generously offered a loaner and I declined. I'll make due with other equipment until my tractor is repaired or at least diagnosed and we have a better idea of how long I'll be without it. If there truly are lots of these going down it might take a long time to obtain a new long block. I have also requested factory help to trade me out of the tractor since it had so few hours for such a major meltdown. We'll see how it all works out and I'll keep everyone updated. Again I hope it's okay I used this thread since I felt it was a related failure. If anyone objects I'll be happy to start a new thread in the New Holland section.