Comparison LS ranked best tractor supplier.

[jibe717]

Let's face it, small tractors that are built today are junk compared to my dad's 60's Deere, international, Ford and Massey tractors, no comparison in weight or brute strength. Anyone using anything 60hp or less that was bought in the last 10 years is using a weak, cheaply made light weight hi tech poor excuse for a tractor..

I yarded 50 cord of four foot firewood a year for 35 years out of the nastiest piece of woods with a international 350 2wd utility Tractor, that old girl pulls hay tedder today and will do so when I'm long gone.

We buy them because there is no other choice.. They do most jobs fairly well but they are worth no where near what they get for them..

There certainly is no comparison to the weight but as far as brute strength goes I will put my MF 4610 against the 4020 I and my Dad farmed with years ago. I have no problem pulling a 5-16 moldboard plow with my 2 y/o MF. MY 4610 is less HP but will pull more I have found. Granted I now have front wheel assist, and the newer lighter tractors do need it when it comes to tillage work. I wouldn't buy a new tractor w/o it. As far as other ways that it is a better tractor than the old Deere is: 1. Worlds and worlds more comfortable for the user. By and large the old tractors can't compare in comfort which means tons when you are talking putting in a 10 hour day on a tractor. Much quieter and far less vibration. 2. Hydraulics. Blink 3 times real fast and you will miss seeing the FEL go from the ground to its full height. 3. Speed on the road and in the field. My MF will flat out fly, about 7 MPH faster on the road than the old tractors I grew up on. Also no way I could have stood the jars in the seat of my 4020 cutting hay at 8 mph that I can do with my MF. 4. Fuel economy. I barely burn half the fuel with my 4610 that I did with the old JD. I estimate that in its 2 years of use that I have saved close to $2,500 in fuel over the guzzlling Ag tractors of old.

Now all that said I am very fond of old iron. But in many many ways they have improved equipment. As far as price goes a JD 4020 was over 10k new in the early 70's. With inflation the 50k of my MF is in line with where everything has went in the last 40 years. But 10k was a nice chunk of cash in 1970.

 

[atsah]

There certainly is no comparison to the weight but as far as brute strength goes I will put my MF 4610 against the 4020 I and my Dad farmed with years ago. I have no problem pulling a 5-16 moldboard plow with my 2 y/o MF. MY 4610 is less HP but will pull more I have found. Granted I now have front wheel assist, and the newer lighter tractors do need it when it comes to tillage work. I wouldn't buy a new tractor w/o it. As far as other ways that it is a better tractor than the old Deere is: 1. Worlds and worlds more comfortable for the user. By and large the old tractors can't compare in comfort which means tons when you are talking putting in a 10 hour day on a tractor. Much quieter and far less vibration. 2. Hydraulics. Blink 3 times real fast and you will miss seeing the FEL go from the ground to its full height. 3. Speed on the road and in the field. My MF will flat out fly, about 7 MPH faster on the road than the old tractors I grew up on. Also no way I could have stood the jars in the seat of my 4020 cutting hay at 8 mph that I can do with my MF. 4. Fuel economy. I barely burn half the fuel with my 4610 that I did with the old JD. I estimate that in its 2 years of use that I have saved close to $2,500 in fuel over the guzzlling Ag tractors of old.

Now all that said I am very fond of old iron. But in many many ways they have improved equipment. As far as price goes a JD 4020 was over 10k new in the early 70's. With inflation the 50k of my MF is in line with where everything has went in the last 40 years. But 10k was a nice chunk of cash in 1970.

Good input and agree on several points including comfort. We had a 4440, 4020, Ford 7710 and IH 350 utility and a Massey 375 so I guess comparing them to today's tractors isn't really fair. I agree, if today's tractors didn't have 4X4 they would be close to worthless.. They are very lite in weight and not safe doing some things, I used a new 4720 to bale hay one day up and down hills, I was pulling a 575NH with a kicker and hay wagon behind it, that wagon wasn't even half full (about 100 bales) and it pushed me down a hill like I was on a 4 wheeler. Today's 60 HP tractors are light and even with 4X4 they can't compare to old iron when heavy work is in the cards. They are very nice, comfy and all.. One thing I really dislike about some of the new tractors is the controls being to weak you can bend them if push on the white metal to hard, my brother is a cattle farmer, he is 6.5 and 220, without any abuse he broke nearly all the controls on side of the seat and the steering wheel didn't last a month, very poor quality parts. You couldn't break a control on and older tractor with hammer..

 

[Turbys_1700]

Good input and agree on several points including comfort. We had a 4440, 4020, Ford 7710 and IH 350 utility and a Massey 375 so I guess comparing them to today's tractors isn't really fair. I agree, if today's tractors didn't have 4X4 they would be close to worthless.. They are very lite in weight and not safe doing some things, I used a new 4720 to bale hay one day up and down hills, I was pulling a 575NH with a kicker and hay wagon behind it, that wagon wasn't even half full (about 100 bales) and it pushed me down a hill like I was on a 4 wheeler. Today's 60 HP tractors are light and even with 4X4 they can't compare to old iron when heavy work is in the cards. They are very nice, comfy and all.. One thing I really dislike about some of the new tractors is the controls being to weak you can bend them if push on the white metal to hard, my brother is a cattle farmer, he is 6.5 and 220, without any abuse he broke nearly all the controls on side of the seat and the steering wheel didn't last a month, very poor quality parts. You couldn't break a control on and older tractor with hammer..

Excellent and valid points. Just for a comparison my 1982 4610 SU in 2 wheel drive weighs in at 4600# give or take, is 60 HP, and has a 201 cubic in engine. My 2016 Workmaster tips the scales at 5059# (according to the specs), is 53 HP, and is only 136 cubic inches but it is a 4 WD. I think the biggest advantage other than the comfort level and shuttle shift is the hydraulics on the newer units versus the older tractors. Our old Allis Chalmers were never in the shop but typically only plowed, pulled a disc harrow, planter or drill, and bailed hay. Mostly what tractors back in the day did. Today we use our units for more varied tasks utilizing the FEL for digging and lifting.

When I bought my unit I would have bought an MX in a Kubota if I was set on a hydro unit but I'm fine with the shuttle and the New Holland had good specs. My dealer at the time had sold 9 of those units and not any issues needing attention. I've had no issues on mine either to speak of. I've got a good dealer and parts are not an issue. I did have to get a couple pins that were lost and they were on the shelf. You really can't go wrong with Kubota, New Holland, Deere or others if you have a good dealer. I don't know how good the other units are on parts support in my experience. My dealer sells Mahindra also and he says that they support their product good also but he is a salesman. I don't know how good the local LS dealer here is. It is a 45 mile drive and I never go up in that area. Our Kioti dealer here is excellent.

 

[atsah]

Excellent and valid points. Just for a comparison my 1982 4610 SU in 2 wheel drive weighs in at 4600# give or take, is 60 HP, and has a 201 cubic in engine. My 2016 Workmaster tips the scales at 5059# (according to the specs), is 53 HP, and is only 136 cubic inches but it is a 4 WD. I think the biggest advantage other than the comfort level and shuttle shift is the hydraulics on the newer units versus the older tractors. Our old Allis Chalmers were never in the shop but typically only plowed, pulled a disc harrow, planter or drill, and bailed hay. Mostly what tractors back in the day did. Today we use our units for more varied tasks utilizing the FEL for digging and lifting.

When I bought my unit I would have bought an MX in a Kubota if I was set on a hydro unit but I'm fine with the shuttle and the New Holland had good specs. My dealer at the time had sold 9 of those units and not any issues needing attention. I've had no issues on mine either to speak of. I've got a good dealer and parts are not an issue. I did have to get a couple pins that were lost and they were on the shelf. You really can't go wrong with Kubota, New Holland, Deere or others if you have a good dealer. I don't know how good the other units are on parts support in my experience. My dealer sells Mahindra also and he says that they support their product good also but he is a salesman. I don't know how good the local LS dealer here is. It is a 45 mile drive and I never go up in that area. Our Kioti dealer here is excellent.

Good to hear I may have had just plain bad luck with my two TC's I owned and my buddy was just as unlucky as I.. :laughing: You know how it is, I have great luck with my brand tractor, truck etc and you don't, it happens, there all man made machines..

You bring up some valid points that I hadn't though about in the older tractors really, such as PTO HP, running a tedder, a cord wood saw and maybe a 14T baler a few times a year doesn't take much HP and never I really thought about it until you brought it up.

Thanks for posting, from my reading here I had no doubt we would bring value back to this thread..

 

[jibe717]

Good input and agree on several points including comfort. We had a 4440, 4020, Ford 7710 and IH 350 utility and a Massey 375 so I guess comparing them to today's tractors isn't really fair. I agree, if today's tractors didn't have 4X4 they would be close to worthless.. They are very lite in weight and not safe doing some things, I used a new 4720 to bale hay one day up and down hills, I was pulling a 575NH with a kicker and hay wagon behind it, that wagon wasn't even half full (about 100 bales) and it pushed me down a hill like I was on a 4 wheeler. Today's 60 HP tractors are light and even with 4X4 they can't compare to old iron when heavy work is in the cards. They are very nice, comfy and all.. One thing I really dislike about some of the new tractors is the controls being to weak you can bend them if push on the white metal to hard, my brother is a cattle farmer, he is 6.5 and 220, without any abuse he broke nearly all the controls on side of the seat and the steering wheel didn't last a month, very poor quality parts. You couldn't break a control on and older tractor with hammer..

I run a 14' disc with my 4610 MF. W/o the 4x4 engaged it struggles mightily. I know I would have no problem running a bigger disc as I ran a 3 bar 24' multi weeder with the size smaller 4609 with little issue. But the 4x4 is a great equalizer.
The things I have broke on mine were the PTO shield. They are junk, made of plastic I believe. I also shattered the left hand door. Was loading bales with it open and BOOM! Not sure what damage that would have done to my old 4430 JD, if any. Or might have sprung it. I will never know. But that was a $435 boo boo. I read on another thread on here that someone did similiar to a new MF and warranty covered it. They didn't for me since I assumed they wouldn't and didn't even ask

 

[daugen]

If I understand this correctly, the OP reference to LS ranking is based on dealers input and has nothing to do with consumers.
When do we the owners get to see unbiased comparisons? The only test I ever heard of that was done to prove comparative performance was that old one in the Midwest where they tested everyone's pto power. I'm blanking on the name. But what can we read today
other than puff pieces in farm/tractor magazines that take advertising dollars from the folks they are reviewing?

Big farmers have to do it themselves, having more than one color in the sheds. Conventional wisdom, talk over the fence rails, might tell you to get a JD for a row crop, a New Holland for a baler, a Kubota for compact utility, whatever, you pick, but then we all know that many big farms strive to be all one color. Some make sure all their implements are the same color too. So clearly this has nothing to do with performance, lot of other factors including pride of ownership are wrapped up in which tractor they buy next.

But for most of us "small fry" who do this mostly for fun versus a living, wouldn't it be nice to hear this from the consumer standpoint?
Well you appear to be the choir I'm preaching to because this site and likely a few others like it are the only places you can find unbiased feedback. Where you can collect a whole bunch of sometimes conflicting information and then make the best decision you can. Where else do we have to turn?

Hats off to LS for doing such an outstanding job backing their dealers. They come from a huge parent company that has access to the best management practices, deep pockets, and a strong cultural work ethic.
But it has to transfer to the US operations and they have to be committed here, which means a big investment in parts and infrastructure.
It isn't cheap being good...although sometimes just a corporate mandate to return all calls by the end of the day can make a big difference.
Versus trips to the Bahamas for contest winners.
We really should all read the LS section on TBN too... I bet corporate LS does.

 

[daugen]

The flip side of this is to look at who scored badly in the rankings
and wonder if any major changes will occur because of it
If I owned a TYM tractor, I'd sure be curious

 

[snowbelt geauga]

The test for pto horsepower is called the Nebraska tractor test.

 

[myyaz33]

If I were at TYM, Snapper or a few other low scorers, I'd be concerned. /I]

My TYM dealer is also a Snapper dealer..