M9000HDC3 or M105SHDC

WhiteRock · Feb 13, 2005

I have a question having to do with torque rise. I don't know much about haying other than its a lot easier and more fun to get out of the field with machines than by hand.

You say torque rise is everything... Does this mean that you do task where you want/have to operate at low RPM and want a LOT of torque response? Can't this be overcome my adding a few RPMs and adding HP?

The amount of torque rise is mostly derived from engine displacement. Lots of torque rise means more CID, means more hourly fuel burn. Is this true?

slowzuki · Feb 14, 2005

I can't exactly remember what torque rise was so I looked it up.

My bosch handbook doesn't give a definition but explains that basicly the injection pump has an additional mechanism to govern the engine speed. When it gets to a set rpm, it backs off fuel delivery with a spring calibrated to match the flywheel governors characteristics. This saves fuel. When a load is encountered the fuel delivery (and available torque) is quickly ramped up to maintain the set speed.

Without this, a load can get ahead of the governor and drag the engine speed down. The mechanism effectively allows the machine to go to a max fueling condition for a given rpm, as opposed to a max accelerator handle position.

So from what I understand, it lets the tractor temporarily exceed its SAE rated output torque when the governor is reacting to a load.

This make sense to anyone who knows more about it /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Torque is based only on two things, mean effective pressure and displacment. Diesels are quite lucky as more CID doesn't always mean poorer fuel consumption when doing the same work. At *really* high loads diesels efficiency starts dropping and approaches that of a gas engine. So an overworked small diesel may be less efficient than a larger one. At low loads the efficiency drops off too, so over sizing a diesel doesn't always help.

</font><font color="blueclass=small">( I have a question having to do with torque rise. I don't know much about haying other than its a lot easier and more fun to get out of the field with machines than by hand.

You say torque rise is everything... Does this mean that you do task where you want/have to operate at low RPM and want a LOT of torque response? Can't this be overcome my adding a few RPMs and adding HP?

The amount of torque rise is mostly derived from engine displacement. Lots of torque rise means more CID, means more hourly fuel burn. Is this true? )</font>

slowzuki · Feb 14, 2005

http://www.kubotaworld.com/KubotaWorld/ad.asp?ID=147

An M9000 at a good price.

slowzuki · Feb 14, 2005

I was doing some looking on the M95s and 105s just for kicks and they come with a 16x16 standard and can get a 32x32 it seems.

Std is 4 speeds on the stick, 2 speed electric over hydraulic syncro (on the fly) range change on the stick, and a non-synchro range change.

The fancy tranny has the same plus a power shift range splitter that drops you 17%.

Reading more it isn't that bad of deal, the 32x32 gives 16x16 on the fly. The powershift drop of 17% would be perfect when you hit a bigger than normal windrow or a heavy patch mowing.

5030 · Feb 14, 2005

Hey Bird Man:

Just for comparison I stopped at my NH dealer this afternoon. I did a little research on the internet this weekend at the prodding of the NH tractor guys.

I priced a NH TL90A with a 52LC FEL on R1 radial ag's, 4WD and 2 remotes plus the mid mount remotes for the loader, fully optioned cab and a 24x24 hydraulic shuttle. The NH has about 70 cubic inches on the M9000, but the 9000 is intercooled and turbo'd, while the 90A is only turbo'd. Plus the PTO is rated at 77 while the M9000 is rated at 80. Being a diesel man, I know that intercooling gives a denser charge and develops more torque and horsepower from a given displacement. Anyway, I almost had a coronary.
The A PLAN PRICE was $4000 higher than the M9000. Actually it was about even with the 105SA.

The dealer I am dealing with is looking for a cab model with the creep speed for me. That will give me the 12x12 with the hydraulic shuttle. The one advantage of the NH is the road speed which is about 2.2 mph higher than the M9000.

If I am spending 40G's for a tractor I might as well get the creep speed option. Actually, on the Ultra Cab, the creep speed option gives you the rear wiper washer and the side defroster in the cab.......I smell a new tractor soon. Matter of fact, I just got off the phone with the dealer and we are 4 weeks out right now. That was easy. Want my payment book??

Guess a forum name change is in order too.

_RaT_ · Feb 14, 2005

Daryl, how many hours did you end up putting on the L5030?

5030 · Feb 14, 2005

RAT:

The hourmeter shows 630 as of last night. What do you think about the NH. Guess Ford employees have no "good" deals anymore.

It will get a few more hours between now and when it ceases to be mine anymore.

stevenf · Feb 14, 2005

5030, I also own a M9000 it is not the cab model as I'm working on a ranch with it that has lots of trees everywhere and I didn't feel comfortable with any loss of vision as many places on the ranch I'm threading the needle and figured I'd end with a cab with cracks and pieces missing quickly even being very careful. As far as NH's faster road speed (bear in mind I'm a newbie tractor owner) I don't think I'd have wanted to go any faster on the road than the 21.5 MPH its rated at I drove it to my dealer and back 17.5 miles one way and there were many times when I was doing far less than max speed although I had the grapple on the front and the BB on the rear with solid filled tires it just doesn't meet my criteria of a race car although I do have a Jeep CJ7 with a 327cuid, headers, high rise cam, fuel injected and lockers that will stand up on 2 wheels and walk across the pasture so I can assure you I'm no weenie where speed is concerned it just doesn't feel right on a tractor as the power steering is quite powerful and you can end up in a tangled heep of iron fast. Steve

froggy · Feb 14, 2005

Price the TL without the "A" plan and you will really have a coronary.

5030 · Feb 14, 2005

stevenf:

We do what is referred to as "road farming" here. As all we do is forage, our fields aren't contigious and I travel miles on roads to and from fields. A guy down the road has an older IH that will run at 30 mph. Now that's scary, but it's great for pulling hay wagons.

This season we are custom cutting a 57 acre field that's about 10 miles away and I don't relish spending any more time on pavement than I have to. For some reason, automobile drivers seem to be real ignorant of road going farm equipment.

I know about cab accidents. I tore the door off the 5030. Actually, I had the door open, caught it on a branch and shattered it. $700.00 later I had a new door. It's easy to forget to close the door. It's all glass. Believe me, I always look twice now. I am also very careful about branches and the like. Before each season, I take the quad to the fields with my pruning saw and trim trees around the perimeter. That trip is really two fold. I have a spot sprayer on the quad so the thistles and the like get a shot of Roundup Ultra.

The 5030 was my first cab tractor.....I just can't operate an open station unit anymore. Kubota needs to make their a/c outlets like JD....you can stuff an aluminum beverage can in the outlet after you remove the grill. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif