Massey Ferguson 4608 Lethal defects

[Fergie4608]

Agco's Warranty Good or Not Pt2 You Decide - YouTube
Now before anyone jumps on me about talking about them wearing out my Brakes, it means its down to the Frame here, it's just an adjustment and not a big deal, what my point is that it's been an issue for around 5 months since Splitting and re assembly, if the Brakes were dragging they would have worn out completely before this. This has gotten Far worse and a Angry Video will be up loaded today, But I informed the Agco Staff that attended the testing and inspection of this Defective Tractor on Tuesady the 18th 07 2017 and saw all bar the Steering. Now I told them that it is getting Far worse and quickly.
Last night, Sunday the 23rd of July 2017 the Tractor was binding in 2nd gear High Range that it was actually pulling the motor right back and that was on flat ground, I will be very surprised if this tractor is still working by the end of the week. Then when I get to feed the Horses.
I shuttle to reverse and then try to turn the wheels and no steering past 1/3 from center to either left or right, this lasted 10 minutes, At 8 minute I started lifting the motor to 1500 Rpm and no change so I increased it to 2,000 Rpm and still no improvement, 1/3 of a turn left or right is all it could do and then it was rock solid Not one ounce of it trying to move further and that was on dead flat hard packed ground. I then tried lifting the loader up and down and releasing it abruptly, I could see a momentary pulse in the Steering like a Bubble if that makes sense, but no improvement after that.
Then I started driving it slowly in low range and in 100 meters it came back, so I started to serpentine the steering in a Zig Zag pattern only to find it came back again while Driving and continued in and out of operation, this is a major change for it to last so long and then to last a long time while Driving. I really Doubt if this Tractor will be running at the end of the week.

 

[redman135]

Hello Fergie 4608, Last thing first, show the loader MODEL NO so people can make the correct instruction video.
The offer for a spin on the lemon is tempting, but I am to far away unfortunately.
I would still like to see the tractor jump off the ground if possible.
Just curious, do you think it would be worth suggesting to agco to donate the tractor to a T.A.F.E to give the students real world experience in trouble shooting and repair? This is just the sort of thing to catch boys attention. If I was a student it would certainly catch mine.
Or would this be viewed as to inflamatory?

 

[Fergie4608]

Hey Redman135, Thanks for the thoughts, the most important first,
At 16 months the split the Tractor in Half and replace the seals in the Spool Valves that control the Shuttling from forward to reverse and this fixed the Launching, I actually think I might put on here the actual letter recieved from Agco as to EXACTLY what was happening.
Some of that really is above my head, but it would feed the masses on here that really have that expertise and love puzzles, and I mean that in a positive way as I have seem many of you who have so much knowledge if the workings internally. So I can't actually show that at this stage.

2
After the Repairs was done, then the Binding showed up as a result of the Splitting and re assembly, Agco Say that they don't see many of these Tractors but that does not make sense and nor is it a reality, I would say that Many people use the Tractor in a low RPM type of works like Loader and towing, But if you were using it in PTO operations then the Tractor would Buck off the Planet while destroying itself.
That is why getting the message out to people with these tractors or any with this shuttle, Take then out and run them at PTO speed, but that does not have to be high gear work and run them back and forwards say 10 times and see if you get launches, I suspect that many in the ranges above this model that now have the modulation control, may very well have this problem but they can blame the modualtion control now.
It is so important to understand that in certain works with this Tractor you will have gotten punched in the Back hard but that was it because it was low RPM work, Also note if you were a Farmer in a large paddock and you just keep circling and never changing Direction then you may have exactly the same Fault and never know that the damage is happening so Please Test your Products, Most of us leave things go that we should demand to get fixed because like me you cannot afford the losses of our equipment away for a month or more.

3
Last night I played once again with the Steering and found a huge piece of the puzzle, My Steer goes completely bye bye in Neutral, now it will still do it in Driving but that is so random that I can't cause it and show it, but it happens, But from the First hours of operation I knew the steering often just completely dissapears when I thought I moved the Loader after Shuttling, But Last night I got it to do it endlessly by SHuttling forward and reverse and then to neutral, in Neutral there is only 1/3 of a turn in either direction from Centre, and at 10 minutes the steering will not return at all not matter what i did.
I am positive that the steering returns only when the tractor drives in either direction, a part of that puzzle is that I shuttled forward and reverse without movement and the Steering would not return, But once I started driving then after a length of the tractor in either direction it came back. But in Serpentining the tractor while driving it did go intermittent but it did allow more travel?
Agco now are only talking about specific repairs once again so we are back to a stale mate again, but I intend to educate people on how to look at their tractors to systematiclly find out if they have lethal issues like this tractor.

4
Please remember one thing in all of this, I was told from 2 hours after purchase that the Launching was caused by sticking Servos in the Shuttle as well as many other excuses that made no sense on a brand new tractor, SO Both North Pine Motors and Agco were already making excuses to blame the owner, So for a owner that uses their tractor very little they are going to blame the launch on your use pattern UNTIL your out of warranty then the RAPING can begin. if we get this out there to all the owners and they find that they do in fact have these issues then they can refer back to this information and possibly force some sort of support, Agco will never give any support unless forced.

5
Your Idea of donating it would make massive sense but Agco could never allow someone outside of their business to work on it because they would lose control of the damaging findings. It would make the perfect play thing for some people that love to nut out problems and its the perfect enviroment for those people learning But as I said I can't see Agco ever wanting to allow any part of that, even though they might patch it and sell it but they would never admit that it was this tractor with this history.

6
It has been said before that Agco will only do what Agco wants to do, they will only respond to kind loving words and lots of Stroking, But the truth is they don't respond to anything at all and that is how they operate, so you ease up on them and then they go quite edging you to no warranty, the thing that needs to be understood here is that this is lethal and it affects many Families around the world directly so it does not matter if this tractor comes out of warranty because I will be dissecting it from here on in and reporting both findings and if any solutions, but in that reporting it will highlight that Agco should have fixed these lethal defects, it will make an amazing documentary for people thinking of Buying machinery. So That is where we are all at now.
I will post something on the loader soon.

 

[PatrickS2222]

Hello Fergie 4608, Last thing first, show the loader MODEL NO so people can make the correct instruction video.
The offer for a spin on the lemon is tempting, but I am to far away unfortunately.
I would still like to see the tractor jump off the ground if possible.
Just curious, do you think it would be worth suggesting to agco to donate the tractor to a T.A.F.E to give the students real world experience in trouble shooting and repair? This is just the sort of thing to catch boys attention. If I was a student it would certainly catch mine.
Or would this be viewed as to inflamatory?

Hey there Redman, your style of help is evidently more appealing than mine it seems. I've been following this case for quite some time, subscribed to his YouTube ..... after which I read this thread and bashed out Post 45 on page 5 which took some time, aside from "thought time" but hasn't yet rated even an acknowledgement from Garry, let alone an invitation to experience his tractor's problems ..... and I live around a one-hour drive from him! Maybe he's busy, stressed and worried - and has overlooked my input ..... but it's still there 12 days later if he finds some time to read it. Nevertheless, I still do have my fingers crossed for him receiving a best-case result after all this stress.

 

[JWR]

PatrickS2222 -- Fergie posted an invitation sometime recently for anyone to come try out his lemon. He wrote so much stuff I can't find it but I do recall reading his invitation for anyone to come try out the defective machine. Has not answered the question about what model his loader is. I think one of the You Tube videos show the loader closely enough where one could read the model number. Being in the same general part of the world and only an hour away you are in a much better position to interpret this whole thing than most of us.

 

[PatrickS2222]

PatrickS2222 -- Fergie posted an invitation sometime recently for anyone to come try out his lemon. He wrote so much stuff I can't find it but I do recall reading his invitation for anyone to come try out the defective machine. Has not answered the question about what model his loader is. I think one of the You Tube videos show the loader closely enough where one could read the model number. Being in the same general part of the world and only an hour away you are in a much better position to interpret this whole thing than most of us.

I can't recall being aware of that, but if you can it must be somewhere and I've missed it. Thank you anyway for the tip-off. :thumbsup: Yeah, I've also devoted around six hours just trying to absorb all of it, :confused2: as have you and a lot more of us here at TBN.
I'll possibly hear from Garry at some stage, otherwise he might not want me involved ..... time will tell. :drink:

 

[Coyote machine]

I can't recall being aware of that, but if you can it must be somewhere and I've missed it. Thank you anyway for the tip-off. :thumbsup: Yeah, I've also devoted around six hours just trying to absorb all of it, :confused2: as have you and a lot more of us here at TBN.
I'll possibly hear from Garry at some stage, otherwise he might not want me involved ..... time will tell. :drink:

If you want to contact the OP PM him and ask him to PM you back, or ask him to answer your questions in the thread.

 

[Coyote machine]

To Fergie,

Wow, I thought things were going on track, but now I'm not sure what is happening. Seems more videos, that to me at least don't show anything happening. I see you talking a lot, and same here on TBN; a lot of monologue, that I find difficult to understand and/or comprehend what exactly you're trying to convey.
There are accusations, swearing and words like raping in caps, none of which give you any more credibility than if you were to remain calm and explain exactly what is happening in a FEW words regarding each 'problem.'

This harms your 'case', because it's just not clear what you are saying is wrong. I get steering goes wonky; tractor used to leap off the ground BUT, not once has anyone here or anywhere else seen this occur, to my knowledge?!:confused2:

I get that the loader won't lift since 'they', Agco/ your dealer worked on it. Spool valves, shuttle shift, serpentining, steering goes wonky?

Here's what I want to know in ten words or less per issue: What exactly got discussed with Agco at the meeting of the 'minds' last week/most recently?
What is the disposition of the tractor 'fixes'? Are they, Agco/dealer going to take your tractor and fix the list of issues or not?

In my opinion, IF you want positive results, you must stop all swearing on any videos you create. You should NOT publish ANY private correspondence you receive from Agco or a dealer here on TBN. And this is not about getting or not getting sued. You will or won't be, depending on where this whole thing goes.

Here on TBN posters have to be respectful of all others, including manufacturers and dealers; it's actually a requirement of the EULA that we all agree to when we become members of TBN. It protects those who are in the business of manufacturing and selling equipment and their dealers, because they aren't on TBN presenting their side of whatever stories are being told by and to members of TBN, and therefore creates an unfair advantage to those who may want to do harm or slam products/manufacturers etc. And it's also about respect in general terms. We, as members need to give respect and expect respect in return, just basic good relations with other people, regardless of whether they are or are not in business or whatever walk of life they live.


Clean it up- present your case point by point in a professional manner, as you would conduct business with someone you respect, and want respect from in return. Otherwise you may garnish points with the youtube crowd; which is totally different than TBN. Youtube is a basically free for all of videos where most anything goes and little censorship takes place, except where it must based on laws about what can be presented. It has it's place, and can be constructive and useful to many people, as you are attempting to make your videos about your tractor woes.
TBN, on the other hand is a place to bring questions, concerns, etc. to seek input from others or to warn of potential problems or possible dangers also.

Notice, however I don't see anything from Agco or your selling dealer, or anyone else but your side of what's gone on regarding your tractor. That might well be construed as one sided reporting, and it literally ONLY gives us your POV and no one else's. Think about that for a moment - would you stand for that if you were on the side which was NOT being represented?! I very much doubt you would want only one side being told against you- with no way to counter the statements, accusations, what have you, coming at you from someone wanting to do you or your reputation harm....

I'm merely playing devil's advocate here, and asking you to take a deep breath and again consider how you present your case here and elsewhere. There is honey and vinegar; most like the taste of honey.... maybe consider sweetening it up some, and seek advice, more than thrashing what is by now a pretty dead horse....

Just saying - I want the best outcome for you if at all possible...

 

[PatrickS2222]

Hey there Fergie ..... Any developments?

 

[Coyote machine]

Seems like he prefers ranting on youtube?!