Miller Bobcat Vs Hobart Champion Elite

[GManBart]

For a number of reasons, and requirements I think I've settled on a welder/generator rather than separate units.

The Bobcat with GFCI is $3,500 at Cyberweld, but there is a 10% discount if you add $150 worth of accessories. So, it would be $3,285 delivered (free shipping).

Miller Bobcat 225 Welder 907498001

The Hobart is $3,299 at the local TSC, but there's 6% sales tax, for a total of $3,496, but TSC just came out with a promotion for 0% until Jan 2015, which would be nice. I'm $40k into building my barn/shop, with another $10-15k left to go, so any chance to spread the cost over time is welcome, but not critical.

Hobart Welders - Products - Welder/Generator - Champion Elite

The two seem pretty similar in specs, so is their anything that would push you towards one or the other just based on specs/capability?

 

[murphy1244]

For a number of reasons, and requirements I think I've settled on a welder/generator rather than separate units.

The Bobcat with GFCI is $3,500 at Cyberweld, but there is a 10% discount if you add $150 worth of accessories. So, it would be $3,285 delivered (free shipping).

Miller Bobcat 225 Welder 907498001

The Hobart is $3,299 at the local TSC, but there's 6% sales tax, for a total of $3,496, but TSC just came out with a promotion for 0% until Jan 2015, which would be nice. I'm $40k into building my barn/shop, with another $10-15k left to go, so any chance to spread the cost over time is welcome, but not critical.

Hobart Welders - Products - Welder/Generator - Champion Elite

The two seem pretty similar in specs, so is their anything that would push you towards one or the other just based on specs/capability?

Gonna have to see some pics of your shop when your done.

 

[GManBart]

Gonna have to see some pics of your shop when your done.

I'm doing my best to take pics as it progresses so I can make a thread about it! Here's a pic after we poured the slab for the shop side (24x40). The LS is in front of the barn side (40x40).

 

[Shield Arc]

You realize that Hobart doesn't have CV? Plus it has 80 open circuit volts!

You're not interested in the Lincoln line up? Buddy of mine has the 305G. I just got him set up with a used LN-25 to run Mig. That 305G is one sweet welder!:thumbsup:

Lincoln Ranger 305G w EFI Welder Generator K3928 1 | eBay

Lincoln Electric K2857-1 Ranger 225 Engine Drive Welder

 

[CJONE]

I have to agree with Shield, if I was to buy another welder/generator combo it would be Lincoln. The Ranger 8 [G 8000] I have has been flawless except for 1 circuit board. That was 8 years ago. The machine is 20+ years old and runs like new. I have burned alot of 5/32 7018 with it along with a truckload of 6010. I have owned/ran a 225 and the Lincoln welds better. CJ

 

[GManBart]

You realize that Hobart doesn't have CV? Plus it has 80 open circuit volts!

You're not interested in the Lincoln line up? Buddy of mine has the 305G. I just got him set up with a used LN-25 to run Mig. That 305G is one sweet welder!:thumbsup:

Lincoln Ranger 305G w EFI Welder Generator K3928 1 | eBay

Lincoln Electric K2857-1 Ranger 225 Engine Drive Welder

See, that's what I have you guys for!

I'm not planning on running a MIG, so I figured CV wasn't important, but maybe I'm overlooking something.

The Lincoln 305G looks great, but it would be around $5k after tax, and more than I'd like to spend.

The Ranger 225 is definitely on my radar....forgot to list it...but it seems that it also has 80 OCV like the Hobart. It does have CV, so it would be a plus if I change plans and want to run a MIG.

Aside from stick welding, I can see maybe running a plasma cutter with it, but I'm not sure if that yet. Every time I start comparing, I wind up looking just one step nicer, more expensive, etc!

 

[GManBart]

I have to agree with Shield, if I was to buy another welder/generator combo it would be Lincoln. The Ranger 8 [G 8000] I have has been flawless except for 1 circuit board. That was 8 years ago. The machine is 20+ years old and runs like new. I have burned alot of 5/32 7018 with it along with a truckload of 6010. I have owned/ran a 225 and the Lincoln welds better. CJ

Thanks, that helps....I'm trying to avoid paralysis due to analysis!

 

[CJONE]

Thanks, that helps....I'm trying to avoid paralysis due to analysis!

I sold a SA200 to fund the G8000 and I had my doubts that the G8 would be capable of burning rod like the 200. I did not need the 200 anymore [job change] and needed back up power. To my surprise it did very well, not quite as smooth as the 200 but it was/is impressive to me and I have ran a few machines. I would not hesitate to weld pipe with it and have done so a few times with no issues. May I ask why you don't want seperate machines? CJ

 

[Shield Arc]

Don't cut yourself short. You never know, you might find a good deal on an LN-25 sometime, with a CV machine you'd be able to run Mig or dual shield.
It may not matter to you, and everybody has their opinion, so here's mine. I've run a couple Bobcats before, never was impressed with them, just another welder. If you can swing it money wise, the 305G will weld circles around a Bobcat.

 

[firemanmike69]

You can run some suitcase MIG wire feeders on CC as well

 

[Shield Arc]

You can run some suitcase MIG wire feeders on CC as well

Yes you can run the feeders on CC, but the Mig process is best run on CV. I have run the Mig process on my 1966 SA-200 Red Face without a CV box, but I don't recommend it.

 

[Arc weld]

The 305G competes more with a Trailblazer 325 than the Bobcat. The 305G is a very popular/good machine but according to one customer who had a TB 302 air pack and bought a new TB 325, the 325 is smoother to weld with than the 302 it replaces but the even bigger benefit is if you get the EFI and Excel power options. Costs more money but you can get 19 hours+ on a tank of fuel because the machine only revs up if it has to. It stays at idle when using a grinder and when burning 5/32" 7018 will rev up when the arc is struck but come back down to idle a couple seconds later. If you want a machine for back up power, it would be a good choice if it doesn't need to rev full throttle. I can't remember if you can get Excel power on a Bobcat, maybe. Some of the Hobart branded machines are the same as Miller, especially the engine drives. The new Miller machines are also about 6" shorter than the old ones.

 

[lmalcomb]

Very interesting thread, what are the concerns about 80 open circuit volts ?

 

[Arc weld]

80 OCV's may be too much for some voltage sensing wire feeders (CC). You'd have to check with Lincoln or Miller depending on which feeder you were considering if you wanted to run flux-core.

 

[GManBart]

I sold a SA200 to fund the G8000 and I had my doubts that the G8 would be capable of burning rod like the 200. I did not need the 200 anymore [job change] and needed back up power. To my surprise it did very well, not quite as smooth as the 200 but it was/is impressive to me and I have ran a few machines. I would not hesitate to weld pipe with it and have done so a few times with no issues. May I ask why you don't want seperate machines? CJ

I'm thinking one machine for a number of reasons, but it's kind of a complicated story. For starters, I'm certain that when my entire shop is up and running (at least 5yrs from now) the vast majority of welding I'm going to need to do will be TIG. Stick welding will likely only be for side projects like fixing implements, tractor parts, etc?othing fancy. I'm going to need a generator for quite some time during the ongoing construction, and will want to have a generator for backup after things are finished, so I have two capabilities I need filled. The power company is in the middle of a major infrastructure overhaul out here in the sticks, and I had to demo the structure that was on the spot where the shop is going, so they pulled the drop, and all the supporting things like utility poles (this was agreed upon in advance), etc. They're helping me out by burying the lines from the new poles/transformer, along with a few other things, so I knew going in that we won't likely have power access ready for the building until at least Spring/Summer next year.

I'm also trying to think ahead, and consider space requirements, and finances, as well. I have to add a full-size milling machine, lathe, surface grinder, floor drill press, arbor press, parts washer, blasting cabinet, etc, etc?lots of stuff. If I can combine the stick welder and generator into one package, that will saves some space, saves some $, and still lets me do what I need done.

I also have some future projects planned where I'll need to be able to weld in places where there's no power supply at all. As an example, I'm going to build a rifle range that will require a bunch of welding hundreds of yards from where the shop will be. It would be great to have the welder/generator maybe mounted on a carryall that I hook up to the tractor, and drive where I need power, or need to do some welding.

I was already looking at dedicated generators in the 10kw ballpark, and decent ones aren't all that much less expensive than a generator/welder, and that's sort of what got me leaning that way?for a reasonable increase in price, I can add another capability I need with only one device.

Heck, after writing all of that, my head hurts even more! As always, the more I research and learn, the more I hear my checkbook start to whimper :laughing:

 

[newbury]

I'm trying to become a welding newbie, thus I've been following this thread.

But -

<snip>
I was already looking at dedicated generators in the 10kw ballpark, and decent ones aren't all that much less expensive than a generator/welder, and that's sort of what got me leaning that way?for a reasonable increase in price, I can add another capability I need with only one device.
<snip>

That's one of the reasons I bought my Winco 12KW PTO generator for $600, to have a portable generator where ever my tractor could go and not have to worry about another engine to maintain.

I wouldn't plan on running a PTO generator 24/7 for long, but to carry it out and back certainly sounded like a good plan.

 

[Shield Arc]

80 OCV's may be too much for some voltage sensing wire feeders (CC).

That was my concern, thinking of the LN-25. For some reason I had 72-volts in my head, but I just checked my manual for the LN-25, it's says 102 to 110 open circuit voltage. Before the LN-25s came out all we had were LN-22s, they were limited to 49-OCVs. On some Miller engine drives we had to drop the RPMs so the wire would feed on the LN-22s.

 

[CJONE]

I'm thinking one machine for a number of reasons, but it's kind of a complicated story. For starters, I'm certain that when my entire shop is up and running (at least 5yrs from now) the vast majority of welding I'm going to need to do will be TIG. Stick welding will likely only be for side projects like fixing implements, tractor parts, etc?othing fancy. I'm going to need a generator for quite some time during the ongoing construction, and will want to have a generator for backup after things are finished, so I have two capabilities I need filled. The power company is in the middle of a major infrastructure overhaul out here in the sticks, and I had to demo the structure that was on the spot where the shop is going, so they pulled the drop, and all the supporting things like utility poles (this was agreed upon in advance), etc. They're helping me out by burying the lines from the new poles/transformer, along with a few other things, so I knew going in that we won't likely have power access ready for the building until at least Spring/Summer next year.

I'm also trying to think ahead, and consider space requirements, and finances, as well. I have to add a full-size milling machine, lathe, surface grinder, floor drill press, arbor press, parts washer, blasting cabinet, etc, etc?lots of stuff. If I can combine the stick welder and generator into one package, that will saves some space, saves some $, and still lets me do what I need done.

I also have some future projects planned where I'll need to be able to weld in places where there's no power supply at all. As an example, I'm going to build a rifle range that will require a bunch of welding hundreds of yards from where the shop will be. It would be great to have the welder/generator maybe mounted on a carryall that I hook up to the tractor, and drive where I need power, or need to do some welding.

I was already looking at dedicated generators in the 10kw ballpark, and decent ones aren't all that much less expensive than a generator/welder, and that's sort of what got me leaning that way?for a reasonable increase in price, I can add another capability I need with only one device.

Heck, after writing all of that, my head hurts even more! As always, the more I research and learn, the more I hear my checkbook start to whimper :laughing:

Gotcha, makes sence to me. My machine maybe gets ran 2-3 times a year at best anymore but when I need it it is there. Sounds like you know what you need and I agree with you on the units you are looking at. My MIG is the primary machine that gets used, I almost bought a stick welder but for 1 time a year the engine driven works. I have mine on a small skid the I can carry with the tractor or slide it into my pickup, that works the best for me. CJ

 

[CJONE]

The 305G competes more with a Trailblazer 325 than the Bobcat. The 305G is a very popular/good machine but according to one customer who had a TB 302 air pack and bought a new TB 325, the 325 is smoother to weld with than the 302 it replaces but the even bigger benefit is if you get the EFI and Excel power options. Costs more money but you can get 19 hours+ on a tank of fuel because the machine only revs up if it has to. It stays at idle when using a grinder and when burning 5/32" 7018 will rev up when the arc is struck but come back down to idle a couple seconds later. If you want a machine for back up power, it would be a good choice if it doesn't need to rev full throttle. I can't remember if you can get Excel power on a Bobcat, maybe. Some of the Hobart branded machines are the same as Miller, especially the engine drives. The new Miller machines are also about 6" shorter than the old ones.

I kina have Shields view of Miller engine driven units, I can take them or leave them, not my first choice. Now the one exception is the 350 pipeliner that I ran, now that is a sweet unit. But I think maybe a few $$$ out of his budget!! CJ

 

[George2615]

I own a Miller Bobcat 250NT 10KW welder/generator. I have also used a Lincoln 225 at work. Both are fine machines. Have no experience with other brands. When I bought mine I was in need of replacing a 5KW generator which was too small to power the whole house and an old Sears AC buzz box. I'm glad I did.