Mountain lion kills mountain biker in Washington

[3 Horse Ranch]

A mountain lion was killed. Unclear at this point if it was THE mountain lion. I don't understand why we have the need for revenge upon animals who are just doing what is hard-wired in their brains. It's their forest, we are visitors in it.

We are 6 billion+ humans on this earth. Mountain lions number a few thousand and that number falls every year as habitat is logged, subdivided, burned and otherwise destroyed. We might want to rethink the road we are on.

The reasoning as explained by the wildlife agent who shot it is that once any predator sees a human as prey, it will always see a human as prey. To protect other people from predation the animal is killed. Simply catching and relocating doesn't seem to work

 

[Jstpssng]

A single head shot of .22LR into a cougar would kill it deader than a hammer. Several heart lung shots would kill it as well, but it might not be so quick. Cougars do not strike me as particularly hard to kill. But I have zero experience with them. I don't know why some people thing a .22LR isn't a deadly round. It is. It might not be the best or first choice or my choice, but it is a choice.

Wow, and everyone knows that a .22LR isn't worth a hoot for self defense

A .22 is a lot less forgiving than a larger caliber; especially when the adrenaline is pumping and you're scared. Furthermore, I suspect that you both have practiced with and are more proficient with firearms than the average person. I once knew a guide who hunted black bears with his bow- until the night that he found himself tracking one with a Coleman lantern until 2:00 in the morning. He knew that he was close as he was seeing pieces of intestine- then he was looking at one when it started moving.
Now he hunts with something that will do lethal damage when he shoots.

 

[Ken]

Soooo...you think that cougar can dial 911???

everyone knows they have no thumbs....sheeshhh......../s :laughing:

Remember the Oklahoma young lady with new born baby and husband had died recently. Some low lifers were trying to break into her home. called 911 and for 20 minutes tried to convince the response team she needed help. When they did break down door she gave them a load of buck shot. one stayed other ran
State prosecutor wanted to charge her with some crime but Governor said forget it.

Seems the question was it legal to defend yourself if attacked by a protected animal. I was kind of trying to make a joke .that if in doubt its to late.
better to ask forgiveness than permission.

ken
This clear up my post or need some more clarifications.

 

[k0ua]

Remember the Oklahoma young lady with new born baby and husband had died recently. Some low lifers were trying to break into her home. called 911 and for 20 minutes tried to convince the response team she needed help. When they did break down door she gave them a load of buck shot. one stayed other ran
State prosecutor wanted to charge her with some crime but Governor said forget it.

Seems the question was it legal to defend yourself if attacked by a protected animal. I was kind of trying to make a joke .that if in doubt its to late.
better to ask forgiveness than permission.

ken
This clear up my post or need some more clarifications.

Perhaps some animals are more "protected" than others?*

*apologies to George Orwell.

 

[goeduck]

The reasoning as explained by the wildlife agent who shot it is that once any predator sees a human as prey, it will always see a human as prey. To protect other people from predation the animal is killed. Simply catching and relocating doesn't seem to work

I don’t know how anyone knows this, game wardens always seem to kill the animal right off the bat. Too many people in this world is the problem. We encroach endlessly into every corner of the earth. Will we ever stop?

 

[goeduck]

Remember the Oklahoma young lady with new born baby and husband had died recently. Some low lifers were trying to break into her home. called 911 and for 20 minutes tried to convince the response team she needed help. When they did break down door she gave them a load of buck shot. one stayed other ran
State prosecutor wanted to charge her with some crime but Governor said forget it.
.

I hoe that Governor was voted back in for many terms.

 

[dragoneggs]

I don’t know how anyone knows this, game wardens always seem to kill the animal right off the bat. Too many people in this world is the problem. We encroach endlessly into every corner of the earth. Will we ever stop?

From what I understand... at least with black bears and grizzlies, 'they' have proven that if guilty bears are repeat offenders they must be relocated very far away ($$$ / introducing a problem somewhere else?) or put down. This was deduced by tagging bears that were captured. I was told by a ranger in the Canadian Rockies (near Jasper) is that they have done quite a bit of study of bears habits and have a decent chronological history of troublesome bears. He explained to me that they have a '3 strikes your out' policy with bears. They relocate them twice and if they return to do 'no good' they are put down.

My wife reported a grizzly in our campground (we were tenting) and hence the story. She felt bad in that she might have given the death sentence to our visitor. We are relatively seasoned campers/hikers so we weren't too concerned but...

I am not condoning this practice nor do I understand to comment much beyond the above limited info that I have gathered.

 

[k0ua]

From what I understand... at least with black bears and grizzlies, 'they' have proven that if guilty bears are repeat offenders they must be relocated very far away ($$$ / introducing a problem somewhere else?) or put down. This was deduced by tagging bears that were captured. I was told by a ranger in the Canadian Rockies (near Jasper) is that they have done quite a bit of study of bears habits and have a decent chronological history of troublesome bears. He explained to me that they have a '3 strikes your out' policy with bears. They relocate them twice and if they return to do 'no good' they are put down.

My wife reported a grizzly in our campground (we were tenting) and hence the story. She felt bad in that she might have given the death sentence to our visitor. We are relatively seasoned campers/hikers so we weren't too concerned but...

I am not condoning this practice nor do I understand to comment much beyond the above limited info that I have gathered.

So you "dropped a dime" on ole smokey huh?

 

[vvanders]

From what I understand... at least with black bears and grizzlies, 'they' have proven that if guilty bears are repeat offenders they must be relocated very far away ($$$ / introducing a problem somewhere else?) or put down. This was deduced by tagging bears that were captured. I was told by a ranger in the Canadian Rockies (near Jasper) is that they have done quite a bit of study of bears habits and have a decent chronological history of troublesome bears. He explained to me that they have a '3 strikes your out' policy with bears. They relocate them twice and if they return to do 'no good' they are put down.

My wife reported a grizzly in our campground (we were tenting) and hence the story. She felt bad in that she might have given the death sentence to our visitor. We are relatively seasoned campers/hikers so we weren't too concerned but...

I am not condoning this practice nor do I understand to comment much beyond the above limited info that I have gathered.

I know someone who was a game warden back in the day. Generally when they "re-homed" them it was far away deep in the wilderness so they usually don't come back. The bear trap was actually a culvert on a trailer with a set of bars that fell down on one end. As I was told they generally used bacon grease to set the trap and worked every time like a charm.

Not sure if I ever heard of one being put down but things may have changed since then.

 

[dragoneggs]

I know someone who was a game warden back in the day. Generally when they "re-homed" them it was far away deep in the wilderness so they usually don't come back. The bear trap was actually a culvert on a trailer with a set of bars that fell down on one end. As I was told they generally used bacon grease to set the trap and worked every time like a charm.

Not sure if I ever heard of one being put down but things may have changed since then.

Yes bacon grease is a popular lure. I don't know the specifics of how far away they relocated the offending bears but it was significant and they kept moving them farther as the program went along.

 

[Sigarms]

Perhaps some animals are more "protected" than others?*

*apologies to George Orwell.

In general, when a 4 legged animal kills another 4 legged or two legged animal (as brutal as it may be), it's generally for food and to survive. When two legged animals kills another two legged animal, it's for money or something else. One could argue that it's the two legged animal that's really the animal.

Ironically enough, we're the species that has the superior brain.

 

[dmccarty]

I don稚 know how anyone knows this, game wardens always seem to kill the animal right off the bat. Too many people in this world is the problem. We encroach endlessly into every corner of the earth. Will we ever stop?

Plenty of cases where big cats in India and Africa killed and ate dozens of people before being tracked down and killed. Course back in the day, when a cat killed a family member or live stock, one went out and killed the cat. There is an Fox Fire book that has a bunch of panther/cougar/painter stories. Some of the stories are of people being chased and killed by cats. Once upon a time, I hiked up a trail along a creek mentioned in the book where a man was chased by a cougar. I did not see a cougar but did see momma bear and her two cubs.

Later,
Dan

 

[Jstpssng]

In general, when a 4 legged animal kills another 4 legged or two legged animal (as brutal as it may be), it's generally for food and to survive. When two legged animals kills another two legged animal, it's for money or something else. One could argue that it's the two legged animal that's really the animal.

Ironically enough, we're the species that has the superior brain.

We also are the only species which agonizes over killing other animals or our own species.

 

[3 Horse Ranch]

What just hit me as incredibly sad is all the sympathy for the mountain lion and the seemimg lack of sympathy for the human victim and his family.
The game warden's explanation for euthanizing the animal is reasonable, logical and biblical. Gen 9.5

 

[ArlyA]

:thumbsup:

What just hit me as incredibly sad is all the sympathy for the mountain lion and the seemimg lack of sympathy for the human victim and his family.
The game warden's explanation for euthanizing the animal is reasonable, logical and biblical. Gen 9.5

 

[rekees4300]

On the news they said the mountain lion was emaciated. In other words the lion killed the biker in order to survive. IMO most humans would do the same thing.

 

[Silvic]

What just hit me as incredibly sad is all the sympathy for the mountain lion and the seemimg lack of sympathy for the human victim and his family.
The game warden's explanation for euthanizing the animal is reasonable, logical and biblical. Gen 9.5

You think!!!!
All you have to do is read the report of what happened and how the bikers did everything correctly according to the experts and the cat still took them. Originally I thought from the early reports that it was instinct and the rapidly moving bike that triggered the response, Having seen the latest reports: that cat was not right and needed to be put down.
The other thing that folks need to know is that since the initiative was passed back 20+ years ago the exponential rise in the numbers of cats in this state and the number of big game that the cats take just to feed the increased numbers is tremendous. Yes we are pushing out into the wilderness but the cats are pushing in as their territory does not fit their growing population.

 

[goeduck]

What just hit me as incredibly sad is all the sympathy for the mountain lion and the seemimg lack of sympathy for the human victim and his family.
The game warden's explanation for euthanizing the animal is reasonable, logical and biblical. Gen 9.5

Not too be callous but it is hard for me to ignore the mountain lions plight when humans will stop at nothing, overpopulate, overdevelop, and push into their territory. When will we stop? Will it be just humans and chickens we raise to eat left on earth? Thinking men worry about the animals and the earth. Agree that the outcome is very sad for the gentleman that was killed.

 

[DieselnHooters]

Not too be callous but it is hard for me to ignore the mountain lions plight when humans will stop at nothing, overpopulate, overdevelop, and push into their territory. When will we stop? Will it be just humans and chickens we raise to eat left on earth? Thinking men worry about the animals and the earth. Agree that the outcome is very sad for the gentleman that was killed.

There are 150 000 humans for every one cougar, the numbers are even more lopsided when it comes to rhinos, tigers, gorillas and many more. That should explain the concern many showed here .

And of course wildcats hold a special place as they are the supermodels/movie stars of the animal kingdom.

 

[3 Horse Ranch]

Again with concern for a mountain lion. Had the cat taken a calf, a horse, house cat, dog, or a sheep and been put down then I would agree with the sympathy for the lion. But this time it took down a human being that was no threat to it at all. The hills are alive with game, rabbits, deer and fawns, elk and calves, coyotes, possums, etc. etc. but the animal chose a human being. Humans being generally slow and often defenseless it stand to reason that human beings would become this particular animals prey of choice. Putting this particular animal down is the logical and reasonable action.

You mention humans encroaching on their territory, well that has been happening since the first human beings set foot on North America 10000 years or so ago. The only solution would be for all of us to move from our rural hobby farms and ranches to a nice cozy apartment in some well controlled city. You first.