need advice how to plumb 3000 gallon surge pressure tank. for water.

[hawkeye08]

Most around here pump into cisterns when they have low flow wells, then it does not matter whether the well can product 2 or 10gpm, it just fills the cistern. Yes, you end up with second pump, but that pump just pumps from cistern, so it is much cheaper than the submersible 168 ft down the hole. I don't know the details of controlling the main pump, but the pump from the cistern should be very simple. One neighbor even put in some fire hose "stations" so they can protect the house from wildfires.

 

[texasranger556]

I better understand your issue. Assuming 38 to 75 psi pump switch, what do you expect to have when your both tanks just fill and your static pressure is 40 psi in both tanks? Your house tank will cycle until your big tank gets above your pump switch minimum pressure. Then the house tank feeds big tank until 39 psi , for example. You will have about 1500 gal at a diminishing pressure all the way down to zero. I see no way the big tank ever gets much high pressure than minimum plus full small tank added to big volume effect.
Am I missing something?

As an aside, sometimes it's polite to answer questions and spend extra time to help all readers grow from their time spent reading this forum.
Rob

That's a good point. To get more than minimum pressure the orifice filling the big tank would have to be large enough to prevent the house pressure tank from ever reaching 75 PSI before the big tank reaches 75 PSI. The pump timer would cycle the pump continuously until 75 PSI is reached in the whole system. Then the pump would stay off for days until the entire system drops to minimum pressure and the cycle repeats. Could change the pressure switch to move the set points closer together, but reduces effective capacity too.

My grandfather's well had low flow. We buried a 1200 gallon poly tank with a shallow well pump and a coyote valve to cycle the well pump until the float switch opened in the tank. When power went out he used a generator, albeit not nearly 30 times per year.

Is the primary aversion to running a shallow well pump based on cost of running power to your new shed? Or maintaining water pressure during a power outage?

 

[TemporaryKubotaOwnerMark]

Really....your telling a Machinist aerospace technician that has built 100,000 trucks with robotic cnc programing and electric background that I cant understand simple basic design of a ballcock in a water tank. OMG. your Hopeless...

If it even crossed your mind for a second to feed that tank with a 1/4" line, you are hopeless.

Hey im 58 with 4 years of college and 40 years in industrial settings.

Really? You write like a high-school dropout.

 

[jenkinsph]

If you feel it is necessary to use the larger tank for pressurized storage then why bother with the little storage tank?
Plumb the pump to the large storage tank and tee into this line to feed the house and other water lines.

If it were me I would prefer to use a storage tank with float switch to control the well pump. Then use a booster pump for the house and other water lines. A generator can power the booster pump and provide electricity for other needs. Protect everything from freezing.

 

[CalG]

When one asks for advice, one should expect opinion. And accept common sense critique.

really,....? 1/4 inch line and 1 gpm? What a waste of the down hole pump. Have you done the math?
5 hours to fill at 10 gpm 50 hours at 1 gpm. Do you want your pumps to run continuously for 50 hours?

Perhaps your capacity is too large to optimize the supply. Or better, just use the volume as a cistern.

 

[Redneck in training]

Thank You redneck after reading all the other reply's YOU and only You have the best grip on this subject.
so yes in the large surge tank the air will mix with the water at some point and lose air pressure.
There are stock tank ballcocks that i could install inside the tank to stop flow when the level is appropriate.
Our first design was no electric devices or pumps inside this building . The surge tank design should work seamlessly with the operation of the smaller 60gallon tank inside the house.
the inside tank has all the pressure switch and monitors to control this large tank that will be hooked inline.

I guess im stuck with 1/2 inch ballcocks most widely available unless i scab out a old dishwasher fill level valve.

Im guessing the air pressure loss will be a non issue if the fill level valve is used (what you suggested).


the trick is to design the fill valve small enough where it does not compete with normal house hold use of the water.
we dont care if it takes 3 days thru a tiny hose to refill this tank. (typically the math says a normal house uses 300 gallons of water a day usually in 4-5 hours)
we want this tank to refill and use the well for the other 20 hours when we are away.

the well produces enough water during the WINTER 10gpm,, to refill the tank nearly instantly. But the heavy use is during the SUMMER when the flow in the well reduces to 2gmp.

so redneck do you think placing a air pressure control valve ontop of the water tank will keep the air pressure up? the stock tank valve will fill the tank and stop the water.
but then we have air loss. I could add the pressure valve atop the tank and set the max pressure to 60psi. I think we could easily install a air compressor in the building feeding the top of the tank.
the building is just 20 feet from 110volt power.

Most compressors have pressure regulator built in or you can buy one. You should add a check valve in the air line preventing water entering the compressor if the compressor doesn't start. If you use fill valve you can experimentally find winter and summer setting. Measuring water level will be hard part. So there is suggestion. Support the tank with three legs. Then one of the legs is lifted (When water level is low) little bit by a lever balanced by weight. And vice versa. The lever will operate switch enabling the compressor. In essence you will measure mass of the tank. There is also a device that looks like a hockey puck (inserted under one of the support legs) made for the purpose but I can't find the source of it on internet. Other most likely cheaper, simpler and more relible is the, as other already suggested, open the tank to air and use it as a cistern. Then add second pump. Is there possibility of freezing?