Need advice on a larger chainsaw for an older guy.

[John_Mc]

Skip chains make sense on super long bars.

Could you explain why that is, please?

When cutting very large wood, there ends up being a LOT of chips along the length of that saw kerf. It can start to clog things up, interfering with the normal motion and cutting action of the chain. Full skip has half as many teeth (left cutter - space - right cutter - space - left cutter, etc), so less chips in the kerf and a better "cleaning action" to pull the chips out without clogging things up. It also takes less power to drive a full skip chain, since fewer cutters are engaged with the wood at any one time - so if you are maxing out the power of your saw, a skip chain might let you use a little longer bar than it would otherwise be able to handle.

There is also a "semi-skip" chain: (left cutter - right cutter - space - left cutter - right cutter - space) that is an effort to split the difference.

If you are not cutting large diameter logs where chips clogging up the cut are an issue a regular chain will cut faster IF your saw has the power to properly drive the chain. Also, skip chains are not recommended for cutting small branches, such as limbing. The large gaps make for rough cutting in small wood, and can make the chain feel rather "grabby".

The safety chain that often comes on smaller box store saws is a skip chain: but they fill the gaps with a "bumper link" to avoid the rough cutting and grabby feel of a regular skip chain.

 

[MossRoad]

Think of it as putting larger and larger tires on a tractor. Eventually, it won't be able to turn them efficiently.

Eventually, with a long enough chain, with enough teeth contacting wood, the engine won't be able to pull it efficiently.

So you have to increase the length of the bar to get through larger diameter trees, but the saw will only handle so much load. So remove every other tooth. The load goes down, while the cutting length maintains the same.

 

[ericm979]

Here's an explanation from Madsens with drawings to make it clear:

Chain Sequence Explained

This information helps pro saw users understand cutter sequence on pro saw chain.

www.madsens1.com

 

[Big Blue Florida]

Not often do I have a full day of cutting up trees.
But after a storm & the fallen stuff is cut up by my little saw(s) I'm thankful for our CS-590, sometimes marketed as Timber Wolf.

The CS-590 is heavy but if used right, the weight works w/ the operator. It cuts so fast, I'm in & out before the pinch sets in.

Have never tried the ''skip chain''. However after reading some of the experiences here, I will try it.

Must ask, is the ''skip chain'' requiring a different bar ?

Don't care to endorse the CS-590, only because of the starting issue.
Only draw back is the motor starting cold & restarts. But most is forgiven during the long tank operations.
At times of refueling I never shut it down. Same for topping off the bar lube.
Not to get off topic, it would be good to not have to be plagued by these little faults. . . .any suggestions.

Much appreciate the interesting input from the collective

 

[John_Mc]

Have never tried the ''skip chain''. However after reading some of the experiences here, I will try it.

Must ask, is the ''skip chain'' requiring a different bar ?

There is no need for a different bar to run skip chain. However, like any chain, you do need to be sure you are getting the appropriate pitch, gauge, and number of drive links. (If I'm not mistaken, .375" pitch, 50 gauge is the standard bar and chain that comes with the CS-590.) Personally, I see no reason to go to a full skip chain unless you are running a 24" bar (the longest bar recommended for a CS-590), and then only if you are running that bar to bury it in big wood. (Skip chain is a detriment if you are just using that longer bar to get more reach for cutting small limbs.)

Don't care to endorse the CS-590, only because of the starting issue.
Only draw back is the motor starting cold & restarts. But most is forgiven during the long tank operations.
At times of refueling I never shut it down. Same for topping off the bar lube.
Not to get off topic, it would be good to not have to be plagued by these little faults. . . .any suggestions.

Can you describe your starting sequence in detail, both for cold starts and for hot starts? You are not using the choke for hot starts, are you?

On some saws (Husqvarna and Jonsered, for example - I can't recall if Echo works this way or not) when doing a hot start, turn the stop switch on, then turn the choke on and then push it back off again (before attempting to start). Leaving the choke on when hot starting risks flooding the saw, However, that move of turning the choke on and off again sets the "fast idle" which can make restarting easier. The fast idle will remain engaged until you "blip" the throttle to disengage it. (Don't pull the throttle trigger after cycling the choke, but before starting the saw, since that will disengage the fast idle. Some people inadvertently disengage the choke if they use the boot stepping on the handle method of starting and hit the throttle in the process.)

I've only used a CS-590 a couple of times when using a friend's saw to help him take down some "problem" trees. I can try to help, but your description may prompt some comments from those who use this saw regularly.

 

[kenmbz]

Do not gas up a running saw. This will eventually lead to a quite large fireball.

from cold:
For starting on my CS-490 I put on choke, switch on, the give it a few pulls until it gives a false start.
pull trigger to put the choke back and it usually starts on the next pull.

Om my cs-620P - push in decompression valve, pull out choke, make sure power switch is up,pull twice on cord, never more, hit trigger so choke goes back in , pull cord 1 or 2 times to start.

If I tried to start the 620p like the 490, it would just flood. The larger saws can flood more easily since they grab more fuel on each pull of the cord.

 

[Big Blue Florida]

I have to admit, I'm doing about everything wrong w/ this CS-590. Poor thing, maybe it just needs a better operator.
Even using the compression release on restarts.

It has been common for me to trigger pull when restarting, in the past.
All cold starts were under compression release pressed in.
Yes, after setting a spell the choke was used to restart while warm.
Did no know about the choke out & then in to set the high idle

Is it common to start by setting the chain brake ? I do not but have heard others suggest this for safety .

Have check the plug often & YES it was soaking wet. Just checked after yesterdays work out & it was text book color, running dry & not black.
That was one start up & three tanks while idling at refueling & bar lube.

Have read & reread you suggestions. Funny how the little saws are near operator (ME) proof. All of our saws are Echoes . . . .4 bought over the last 30 years, all still running.

Good suggestion on the chain swap.

Thanks again

 

[Big Blue Florida]

Have notice this CS-590 has its own combination for a successful start & restart.

thanks

Do not gas up a running saw. This will eventually lead to a quite large fireball.

from cold:
For starting on my CS-490 I put on choke, switch on, the give it a few pulls until it gives a false start.
pull trigger to put the choke back and it usually starts on the next pull.

Om my cs-620P - push in decompression valve, pull out choke, make sure power switch is up,pull twice on cord, never more, hit trigger so choke goes back in , pull cord 1 or 2 times to start.

If I tried to start the 620p like the 490, it would just flood. The larger saws can flood more easily since they grab more fuel on each pull of the cord.

 

[airbiscuit]

Skip chains make sense on super long bars. Otherwise my experience has been that they cut slooowly.

Could you explain why that is, please?

Best guess, less drag/friction from cutting teeth allowing longer bars for tree diameter.

IrishLoader answered the question.

I bought a Husqvarna 572XP that had a muffler mod. It came from out west and had a long bar. I put on a shorter bar and had the (skip) chain shortened. The performance was unimpressive. I then put on a full chisel chain, and it made a huge difference. I never used the skip chain again.

 

[John_Mc]

Did no know about the choke out & then in to set the high idle

That's just how my saws work (my history is mostly with Husqvarna and Jonsered). I did not mean to imply that all saws worked that way. Others may not be the same.

 

[kenmbz]

All the saw I worked on are choke out and trigger to set high idle, just when you get to that point changes.
Sounds like the 590 and 620 are similar, based on the same design at least.
If you try to pull too many times with choke on, just floods.

Putting the brake on is for safety during starts, especially ones off the ground (drop starts etc.)

Never start by holding the trigger, most saws will flood pretty quick.

Husky, Jonsered etc. are similar choke systems. But as with everything, some saws are slightly different and some completely different. toggle switch or momentary contact for power on.
Points (on much older saws) or electronic spark. Chokes that connect to start switch vs. separate.

Some have purge bulbs, some don't, some big saws have decompression buttons, some have spring assist.

I buy from a shop and he starts the saws and makes sure they are setup. Then I ask him what I will do wrong first with starting it, and he shows me

 

[IrishLoader]

All the saw I worked on are choke out and trigger to set high idle, just when you get to that point changes.
Sounds like the 590 and 620 are similar, based on the same design at least.
If you try to pull too many times with choke on, just floods.

Putting the brake on is for safety during starts, especially ones off the ground (drop starts etc.)

Never start by holding the trigger, most saws will flood pretty quick.

Husky, Jonsered etc. are similar choke systems. But as with everything, some saws are slightly different and some completely different. toggle switch or momentary contact for power on.
Points (on much older saws) or electronic spark. Chokes that connect to start switch vs. separate.

Some have purge bulbs, some don't, some big saws have decompression buttons, some have spring assist.

I buy from a shop and he starts the saws and makes sure they are setup. Then I ask him what I will do wrong first with starting it, and he shows me

I'll admit, I have never set the brake ever. Not even on the big Magnums I worked on.

I have worked on many and about the only time I hold it WFO is in a flooded condition. Hold on because she will catch and go. Sthil saws on cold start have a full and partial setting on the throttle and choke. Pretty Irish proof. I have a 26 y/o 036 Pro that is testament to that.

Most shops worth your coin will do that and trust me Nothing is Irish proof. There are warning labels on everything because of me.

 

[two_bit_score]

Thanks everyone for the education about skip chains on longer bars! I appreciate the instruction!


I’m planning to add a Stihl 261 CM to my line up and while it’s not going to be carrying a real long bar it is good to have that information.

 

[dodge man]

I have a 261 and run a 18” bar. It would pull a 20 well.

 

[JDZ735M]

I have a 261 and run a 18” bar. It would pull a 20 well.

Thanks for that information!

 

[Ravimor]

Thanks everyone for the education about skip chains on longer bars! I appreciate the instruction!


I’m planning to add a Stihl 261 CM to my line up and while it’s not going to be carrying a real long bar it is good to have that information.

Stihl 261 CM is one of the best all-around chainsaws.

 

[xyz123]

If I was to buy a new saw today in 50cc. I would be buying the echo 501 or 4910. Both come with carbs you can still tune yourself. Very light saw too.

Dealer on my chainsaw repair group has 4910 for $300 right now PHO = no b+c and 501 in the low $4's same way.

Cheaper version 4910 in pic showing weight as they come PHO.

 

[m7040]

I am 80 years old and run a 20 inch Stihl saw MS261C. Recently added a 16 inch Makita saw for smaller branches. Using the excavator to lift the logs into a more comfortable position and the Stihl saw is very quick on cutting them into firewood lengths

 

[Hermio]

I am 80 years old and run a 20 inch Stihl saw MS261C. Recently added a 16 inch Makita saw for smaller branches. Using the excavator to lift the logs into a more comfortable position and the Stihl saw is very quick on cutting them into firewood lengths

Nice to have an excavator. I have a tractor with a 4-way bucket, but I rarely use it to grapple logs. It can make the tractor tippy if the logs are not centered. I just use the Woodchuck Tools Timberjack to get the logs off the ground and roll them when needed. And I love my MS500i. Least fatiguing saw I have ever used.

 

[two_bit_score]

My JD dealer had a couple Stihl 261 C's 'on sale' for $639 today with a 'list' price of $699. I also found one at a local lumber yard. It was marked $699 and they did not mention the 'sale' price.