wngsprd
Super Member
That's a nice system. I wish I had more access/control to system status, but like S219, was not able to be as involved at the time of installation, and quite frankly would not have known what else to ask for.
New Build in 2018: Geothermal vs NG/conventional AC
- Thread starter Dadnatron
- Start date
- Views: 7969
That's a nice system. I wish I had more access/control to system status, but like S219, was not able to be as involved at the time of installation, and quite frankly would not have known what else to ask for.
wngsprd
Super Member
Mini splits sound good. But don't forget you can get a similar method to control various rooms' temps by way of setting up zones and installing a two stage HVAC system.
Good luck with your decision.
kenmac
Super Member
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2005
- Messages
- 9,829
- Location
- The Heart of Dixie
- Tractor
- McCormick CX105 Kubota MX 5100 HST, Kubota ZD1021, Kawsaki Mule 4010 trans 4x4
if you are talking about a normal ducted HVAC system. Yes you can get a zone system, but you still lose efficiency through the duct work
NorTracNY
Platinum Member
I like EddieWalker's post. Thanks. This though is probably the best advice I've heard from him...
"In houses that are 100% insulated with closed cell foam, and all the windows are taped, or painted, it takes almost nothing to heat and cool them. Insulation never wears out, never breaks down, and doesn't cost anything to operate. Put your money there first, then install what your HVAC expert in your area recommends. "
If you're looking to have a nice new home, focus on the insulation and passive solar. I would also look at radiant floor heat whether you go with a boiler, Geo, or wood. It's quiet and does a great job of making the whole house feel comfortable (assuming you insulate and don't have drafts). I didn't look into GEO until after building my home. I have looked into Geo twice since building. Since I have a newer house that was build well with gas and radiant floors the payback is next to never. They advertise GEO units as being 300-400% efficient. Yes, they are getting "free" energy from the ground, but they use a lot of electricity to do it! They would double my electric usage.
If I was to do it all over again, I might do GEO, but I would make sure I could do it in a way to not connect gas to my place. I'd also have to plan for over double the number of solar panels I have. The panels were a steal when I got them (Thank you to all you tax payers
). I am guessing the deal I got no longer exist.
"In houses that are 100% insulated with closed cell foam, and all the windows are taped, or painted, it takes almost nothing to heat and cool them. Insulation never wears out, never breaks down, and doesn't cost anything to operate. Put your money there first, then install what your HVAC expert in your area recommends. "
If you're looking to have a nice new home, focus on the insulation and passive solar. I would also look at radiant floor heat whether you go with a boiler, Geo, or wood. It's quiet and does a great job of making the whole house feel comfortable (assuming you insulate and don't have drafts). I didn't look into GEO until after building my home. I have looked into Geo twice since building. Since I have a newer house that was build well with gas and radiant floors the payback is next to never. They advertise GEO units as being 300-400% efficient. Yes, they are getting "free" energy from the ground, but they use a lot of electricity to do it! They would double my electric usage.
If I was to do it all over again, I might do GEO, but I would make sure I could do it in a way to not connect gas to my place. I'd also have to plan for over double the number of solar panels I have. The panels were a steal when I got them (Thank you to all you tax payers
). I am guessing the deal I got no longer exist.
dodge man
Super Star Member
Lots of good posts. I'll add a couple of thoughts that have been brought up but I'll emphasize.
One is whats available? Is natural gas available? If so how much to hook up to it? I was on propane and natural gas was not available so that is one reason geo was attractive?
What incentives are available? Tax breaks and a break on the electric we pay for geo is what put me in geo. If this isn't available to you, it might make a difference.
Talk to an expert. The people that did our GEO did just about everything, so they had no real incentive to sell us that unit. They were happy to put in a regular propane and AC system for us, so they were honest and up front.
Good luck.
One is whats available? Is natural gas available? If so how much to hook up to it? I was on propane and natural gas was not available so that is one reason geo was attractive?
What incentives are available? Tax breaks and a break on the electric we pay for geo is what put me in geo. If this isn't available to you, it might make a difference.
Talk to an expert. The people that did our GEO did just about everything, so they had no real incentive to sell us that unit. They were happy to put in a regular propane and AC system for us, so they were honest and up front.
Good luck.
Larry Caldwell
Elite Member
I like EddieWalker's post. Thanks. This though is probably the best advice I've heard from him...
"In houses that are 100% insulated with closed cell foam, and all the windows are taped, or painted, it takes almost nothing to heat and cool them. Insulation never wears out, never breaks down, and doesn't cost anything to operate. Put your money there first, then install what your HVAC expert in your area recommends. "
If you're looking to have a nice new home, focus on the insulation and passive solar. I would also look at radiant floor heat whether you go with a boiler, Geo, or wood. It's quiet and does a great job of making the whole house feel comfortable (assuming you insulate and don't have drafts). I didn't look into GEO until after building my home. I have looked into Geo twice since building. Since I have a newer house that was build well with gas and radiant floors the payback is next to never. They advertise GEO units as being 300-400% efficient. Yes, they are getting "free" energy from the ground, but they use a lot of electricity to do it! They would double my electric usage.
If I was to do it all over again, I might do GEO, but I would make sure I could do it in a way to not connect gas to my place. I'd also have to plan for over double the number of solar panels I have. The panels were a steal when I got them (Thank you to all you tax payers
The south side of my house has 170 square feet of glass, and the floor under most of it is cement board and tile, with good subfloor insulation. It's a sunny day below freezing, and the glass heats the house. We installed honeycomb blinds for nighttime insulation, because glass can be hard to heat. With the blinds down, the heat rarely comes on, and a small fire in the wood stove will heat 1800 sf. comfortably. Everything is insulated; duct work, water lines, water heater, attic, subfloor, and the windows are low-E argon filled with edges sealed by latex foam. Insulation - the gift that keeps on giving. If you have attic bats, blow cellulose over them. The blown-in cellulose really reduces air infiltration. I have cellulose in the attic and an attic exhaust fan. The fan saves a lot on AC in the summer. I also used light colored shingles to cut the roof temp a hundred degrees or so
All heat pumps are 300% to 400% efficient, but geo systems are more appropriate for extreme climates where sub-freezing temps can hang on for days. In my mild climate, with a wood stove for primary heat in freezing weather, geo source heat pumps are unheard of. If I lived in North Dakota, they would be my first choice.
The price of solar panels has dropped so far they no longer need a subsidy. Trump slapped a 30% tax on solar panel imports in an attempt to save the US fossil fuel industry, but the way solar price is dropping they will be back to current prices in 3 years and continue to drop from there.
RalphVa
Super Member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2003
- Messages
- 7,885
- Location
- Charlottesville, VA, USA
- Tractor
- JD 2025R, previously Gravely 5650 & JD 4010 & JD 1025R
For new construction, it would be a no brainer for me: geothermal, chuck a new gas line.
Looked at converting to geo here, but the lines would have to run back down through the trees down the back hill. No other space. Possibly could go out front to create another mess. A mess with converting, but for new construction, I'd do it. Can either run lines or sink a well for heat sink. Works even far north.
Ralph
Looked at converting to geo here, but the lines would have to run back down through the trees down the back hill. No other space. Possibly could go out front to create another mess. A mess with converting, but for new construction, I'd do it. Can either run lines or sink a well for heat sink. Works even far north.
Ralph
OP
Dadnatron
Veteran Member
I have plenty of room for GT lines. A whole field available so I don稚 think it would be ANY issue in that regard. It is a real issue though about up front cost that Larry brings up. This will be an extremely well insulated house. I値l use spray foam and good windows. In such a house in Kentucky... would the real world savings be realized compared to a mini-split or something else.
The one thing I will have and I知 not sure how to address it will be fireplaceswood burning fireplaces and likely at least one NG. I値l pay the price be it higher heat bills and air leakage.
BUT... I壇 still like to maximize the cost/benefit aspect.
This is mostly where I am at this point. COST/BENEFIT/DESIRE. I want the next 30 years to be comfortable and enjoyable. That has to fit into a reasonable cost and I don稚 want to be wasteful... but my #1 thing is to get the end result of how I知 living on a daily basis. Comfort is king for me. THEN I want to get that comfort for the best cost.
I値l set up wire for solar to be installed, but I won稚 install it now. It will have to have a payoff much sooner than it is now. But, I will have them look at it. (Personally the tariff on solar is asinine. It will cost the US in installations and the installer jobs will be hit MUCH harder than any gains in manufacturing panels which take 20+ years to pay back)
The one thing I will have and I知 not sure how to address it will be fireplaceswood burning fireplaces and likely at least one NG. I値l pay the price be it higher heat bills and air leakage.
BUT... I壇 still like to maximize the cost/benefit aspect.
This is mostly where I am at this point. COST/BENEFIT/DESIRE. I want the next 30 years to be comfortable and enjoyable. That has to fit into a reasonable cost and I don稚 want to be wasteful... but my #1 thing is to get the end result of how I知 living on a daily basis. Comfort is king for me. THEN I want to get that comfort for the best cost.
I値l set up wire for solar to be installed, but I won稚 install it now. It will have to have a payoff much sooner than it is now. But, I will have them look at it. (Personally the tariff on solar is asinine. It will cost the US in installations and the installer jobs will be hit MUCH harder than any gains in manufacturing panels which take 20+ years to pay back)
Macinnis
Gold Member
Have you looked into building with SIPS? If not, take 15 minutes and google them. They basically make your house air tight...to the point you need an air exchange system. Anyway, they are so efficient, they reduce the need for your heat and ac system by a lot (30-40%). They also get your house under roof much quicker, like a week.
SIPS =simulated insulated panels
SIPS =simulated insulated panels
bcjmmac
Silver Member
All homes with good insulation & vapor barriers should/must have an air exchange system. We had our house tested as part of the building process. Turning on any exhaust fan (clothes dryer, exhaust fan over stove) created a vacuum in the house. The Heat Recovery Ventilator (HRV) does kick into high gear in those situations, to balance out the pressure, but it takes a few minutes (up to 6 minutes if both turned on during the testing).
For ref - closed cell foam used around windows, doors, headers - all hard to reach/small/difficult to seal with vapor barrier &/or caulk. Majority of house done with traditional vapor barrier & pink insulation, or blown in cellulose in ceiling. 2x6 walls with 3" foam board wrap on outside.
For ref - closed cell foam used around windows, doors, headers - all hard to reach/small/difficult to seal with vapor barrier &/or caulk. Majority of house done with traditional vapor barrier & pink insulation, or blown in cellulose in ceiling. 2x6 walls with 3" foam board wrap on outside.