new tractor idea possibly....

[boggen]

starting to like the P shape engine box and drive wheel doing, and folding the implement up at an angle over the top of the engine box, for transportation. it would allow for a larger length (front to back) engine box. and more room for "front balance wheels" and transport tires. perhaps getting a narrower width for transport. and couple minutes between change over from transport to field ready... exception dealing with cab. not sure about that just yet.

a longer engine box. might allow for more "optional engines" or instead placing the various tanks (fuel, engine oil, hyd oil, coolant) in between engines vs above the engines vs previous posts. were 2 foot front to back and getting up to 8 to 10 feet high.... now changed to say 5 to 6 feet (front to back) and keeping it down to say 4 to 5 feet high. hhhmmsss....

View attachment 280079

Tires, Traction and Compaction - University of Minnesota Extension dealings with tires, traction, and compaction....

never stated yet. but current tires for tractors with low PSI of air in them. almost act like "tracts" on a rim. good flat surface across the face of tire that touches dirt. and then the side walls flex just enough for suspension. and allow the surface of the tire to become more flat vs "curved" as the tire rotates into the ground.

i have almost thought about skipping the generic idea of AG / R1 tires. and go with tire with less higher "nubs" and more flatter surface on tire. then it hit me were do you want a "hard compacted" layer to form (groves left by tires)? anyhoots enough tire talk.

 

[boggen]

50th picture / set of diagrams...

View attachment 280095

connection points on machine and connection points on implement....

so you have a bottom plows on machine. and plows begin to dig in deep. do i want attachment points that will cause implement and machine. to pull down harder onto the rear tires to pull it through. or do i want some "twisting action" going on to pull the bottom plows back up out of the ground and hopefully if set correctly not completely back out of the ground?

since machine has "dynamic weight" ability. and bottom plows begin to dig in. would you rather the dynamic weight shifted more forward, and at same time slightly raise the bottom plows up out of the ground some? along with transferring weight / force to rear drive wheels to gain more traction?

would you rather avoid transferring a certain "max weight / combo force" to rear tires with a bottom plow? so you do not cause more compaction? though with a bottom plows... and set deep as possible.... would it really matter? but what if plows were set to only go so deep? any additional force from pulling bottom plows through ground would need to be transferred some place to pull the bottom plows through the ground...

would a third connection link might be wanted that a spring, or hyd cylinder with accumulator in line with this third cylinder. might be wanted for any sort of implement out there? remember implements would no longer have this long tow tong/hitch and front implement wheels, due to implement would be attached directly to back of this machine, kinda like a 3pt hitch implement. Or perhaps putting a hyd accumulator in line with one of the current 2 links between machine and implement?

================
been thinking of stuff that requires some sort of hopper or trailer or wagon, that is pulled behind implement or between tractor and implement, or some sort of box for seeds to grain to fertilizer....

current age tractors with fold up implements could fairly easy tow something behind them. to hold everything. but this machine. due to how it moves when transported. really does not offer a "easy way" to tow something. you would have to drive machine into field, then drive the (trailer, wagon, etc...) into field and then hook up each trailer, wagon, etc... were it needed to be hooked up. to be towed be hind the machine.

my other concern for some current age stuff. is most of the trailers, wagons, tanks, etc... that get pulled behind the implements. are not really designed to limit compaction. with many, having narrow based width wheels (typical truck / trailer tires) on them.

been trying to think of "how" some sort of container or containers could be setup. to fold / unfold with the implements. or perhaps, you hooked up to "containers" first full of seed, flipped them up over top of the machine. and then went back to hook up all the implements. if it was wagons for grain.... you would attach to the containers first. and flip them up on top of the machine, and then go back and attach to implements. same thing with some sort of tanks for liquid fertilizer maybe....

perhaps making room some how on the "balance wheels" for tanks and like? *cringes* do not know about that idea. that would most likely place a huge amount of weight on only a couple wheels on the front of the machine. you would almost need tanks and like that would fit between the balance wheels. or to possibly remove current balance wheels on machine, and be replaced by tanks and containers that had there own (front wheels aka balance wheels) and transport tires.

 

[boggen]

mini short bed dump truck anyone?

View attachment 280119

 

[boggen]

it has been bugging me for some time. and that is how this machine would actually "trailer" behind a large size truck or another smaller size pulling tractor. in previous version trying to stay with 2 feet width engine box. not really able to. but with engine box becoming wider / taller. there could be enough room. to drop down 3 or possibly 4 axles. on one side of the machine. and then have some sort of "tongue" or something that extends out for bumper hitch, or pintail, or 5th wheel like setup.

also if you had 2 or more of these machines being pulled other words....
truck <- first machine <- second machine <- third machine?!?!

normally wagons. have a solid axle in back, and then front axle pivots with tongue that attaches to back of truck. so the wagon "follows" the path of the truck tires.

in the old machine, i thought about tractor driving up along side of a trailer. and just roll up the side of the trailer for transport. been thinking kinda same idea but instead for the newer version of this machine possibly...but would really like to avoid a custom trailer, just to place machine on. to get it from field to field and back to farm. there is a good amount of combine heads, to seeders / no till drills around here that have there custom trailer. that they get loaded on. due to they, do not fold up or not enough to get them down the road...

main want is being able to connect multi of these machines side by side. to go down the field as one solid mass per say. and trying to disconnect and maneuver each machine onto its own trailer sounds like large time consumption task.

perhaps different towing packages. for machines. so one package is built for 3pt hitch for tractor, another for bumper pull another for pintail. but then a package that connects 2 machines together for in the field, and also being able to tow one behind the other...

is it even possible to tow say two 40 foot trailers, or even two 60 foot trailers. behind a single truck or tractor down the road at the same time?....

would there be optional CAB unit that has its own little engine, just to move it around the machines and to follow or stay in front of the machine. and then used to tow the machine? by using engines on the machine to power the CAB's larger tires? or rather engine on machine to power the transport wheels? eewww getting into them "huge long cranes" that has multi drive axles. with independent steering per axle. to get the crane through very tight corners...


hhmmsss..... i could almost 2 axles, 2 tires per axle per side for total of 8 tires. on far end of machine and the another set of on other far end of machine. that could spin 360 degrees. and be used both as "balance wheels" and as balance wheels. and wheels would have a hydrostatic tranmission. hhmmsss...

perhaps instead of duals floatation tires? hhmmss.....

View attachment 280132

who says duals? multi tracked unit....

 

[boggen]

View attachment 280158

and i thought i was on to something long time ago. this seems way to easy....

if you need more wheels to say pull not one but 2 sets of bottom plows. (another set behind the first set.

hook 2 machines up side by side... and crank up the all the engines... and see what gives first....

but who says 2 plows, perhaps a combine head and a some sort of grain wagon box (without wheels on other side? heck maybe special made wagons.... you back the wagons up to the machine. and attach rear end of wagons to links on machine. who knows... perhaps having a second machine following the machine with combine head. this second machine having grain boxes on each side. that way you could have a train moving side ways with a bunch of grain. to haul over to the road for a semi truck ready to take it all on....

to note it, i drew in 2 implements per side. there is no need for that. and perhaps not wanted at all to keep compaction down. *shrugs*

 

[boggen]

View attachment 280172

alrighty then! i am back to my sections of the machine. that can be down to 20 feet per section. not sure on min width per section. till wheels get figured out, and placements for links for implements. on all sides of machine. and length per section would be as long as someone wanted or multipules of min width per section.

argh! not again! either i could have "middle sections" and "end sections. or all in one sections that did not matter were they were placed... all in one sections sounds like a bloody costly adventure. wonder if i could make the "limited joints" between sections, along with "end links" for towing as select your package / addon on doing. and be able to bolt / unbolt. things. to switch things around if a customer wanted to... vs welding the end links and limited joints to each section...

hhhmmsss. limited joints.... main purpose is to keep implements and the sets of tires, from taking a sudden quick slope. and cause things to bind up on each other. and goal of limited joints. would be to keep that from happening.... since there is no "hyd cylinders" in current limited joints. why not place end links (for tow options or end implements) but also use these end links to create a "limited joint" by use of some solid bars between end links. of each section... it would make more sense. placing limited joint lower on each section. vs placing it high up on machine. the end links would already need to be beefed up, to some extent for towing or an implement being placed on the end links. hhmmsss....

before i jump to diagrams for limited joint and like... for implements that do not require a lot of extra HP to pull the implement through the ground or what not. perhaps adding in a "short section" that is called a "field cab" though field cabs cost $$$$, due to needing short width implements to cover width of cab would take up. along with just the comforts of a cab, (A/C, heating, all the controls, and buttons, etc...)
not sure if "cab" would have any sort of drive wheels under it. maybe instead of 8 wheels just 4 smaller wheels? or perhaps just a couple caster wheels that spun 360 degrees. just to help deal with weight... i could almost see the cab being able to do 360 degree turning. kinda like a tracked excavator cab. *eyes light up*

 

[boggen]

13.5 feet diameter. from center axis per wheel set.. (OUCH) on total width for "transporting mode"

View attachment 280173

tires = 1.5 feet width, 2 feet in diameter.
6" spacing between tires,
6" between tire and hydrostatic transmissions.
6" all the way around for clearance.
3.5 feet for transmission
end result = 13.5 feet diameter or dead man circle for wheels. were nothing can be placed in that circle or interfere with 360 turning of wheels.

the major implements. that fit on the sides (in transport mode) are going to need lower links that stick out some...from the main frame. if taking that into account, might give a few inches there.

i suppose implements could be placed in "total raised" position. to give clearance over wheels. but *yikes*... just a bad seal in a hyd cylinder, or 0-ring/seal in a valve, and machine would come to a dangerous crashing halt. way to risky to many seals / 0-rings / gaskets. not to mention possible hyd accumulators added into the mix. totaled raised implements (beside being titled back) to dangerous...

perhaps making a "indent" into the frame for were wheels would turn. that would give extra clearance when implements are tilted up.

3.5 feet for transmission area seems pretty large... so is spacing between tires, and spacing between tire and transmission. the transmission does not have to be "box shape" i could possibly squeeze it down to 1.5 maybe 2 feet?!?! and squeeze distance between tires down to 2 to 3 inches, (errr clogs getting stuck in between tires?!?) and then distance between tire and transmission... hmmsss....

 

[boggen]

View attachment 280175

down to a 9.5 feet diameter of a dead man circle for wheels.

googling other implements past few days. widest i think i saw when fully folded up was 16.5 feet. leaving about 7 feet for implement to be placed on one or both sides... for transportation with the machine....

i would love to go back to the 13.5 feet diameter. but could i add 2 more axles. to the transmission. and some how pivot them at the transmission. so the raise up for field use for 4 to 8 inches up. and then lower them down for transportation. and still keep the 360 spin. and all wheel drive, with each half axle having independent forward/reverse

i am almost positive there is a special "gear type set" that would allow transport tires to angle up and down. and still get power to the transport tires.

View attachment 280176

 

[texasjohn]

Well, I officially give you the TBN award for most out-of-box (er tractor cab) thinking AND most posts to one thread in minimum amount of time. :drink::tractor:

You've certainly been struck by an innovative idea and are working thru the ramifications of the idea and just can't stop until you get it all worked out.

I admire your tenacity and innovations....hope they come to some sort of fruition for you and you see your new kind of tractor going thru the amber waves of grain!:cloud9:

 

[boggen]

View attachment 280191

20 feet width, with 8 feet long frame (not counting how far links stick out from frame.)

thinking about calling it
--STB (side train box) tractor
--STB (side train boggen) tractor
----kinda of an upside down box, if you have implements around all sides, you would have "flaps" like a box
or
--STT (side train tractor)
----thinking more along the lines of, multi units in a line, like a train, but moves side ways through field.
and of course
--STD (sexual transmitted disease) tractor
----ok, i hope that name does not stick, kinda like FORD (found on road dead)
----saying STB or STT fast and could easily sound like STD :/