Outrigger on new BH does not have much downforce...?

[J_J]

He could do lots of things to analyze the problem, but it ain't happening.

If the out rigger cyl will not go into relief, that will tell you it is not developing the pressure for a good cyl.

It could be damage spool not worn spool as I eluded to earlier.

If you have a good cyl, and the lever for that good spool is in neutral, the hyd should hold. If it can not develop the pressure or leaks down, then you just about know what the problem is. .

 

[heron]

Okay, the only issue is the darn hose end is so stripped I cannot get it broke free. Any ideas on how to break it free..I've tried a little hand held torch, vice grips etc...? I think it was an issue from the factory as someone has tried to break it free before and marred it all up. It's the bottom hose on the piston.
Okay, so once I break a hose free I should simply see if fluid comes thru the hose...? Is there a certain order to do this? I will do my best tonight to pick up a guage. The person I bought the BH from thinks it's a seal from what I described and is sending me a seal kit for it. But, if the seal was bad wouldn't it leak down a bit?

 

[heron]

JJ: I'm getting a guage tonight..I have quite an array of tools but I don't often work on hydraulics. I'll be venturing out after work tonight to see what I can find as far as tools. Much of what you are saying is Chinese to me. Not sure what you mean by "not go into relief". Remember, not everyone on these forums has the expertise as you do so please have patience with me.

Okay, so it does not leak down but does not develop enough pressure...lots of whooshing going on once it hits the ground and begins to try to develop pressure....what does that mean because I don't just about know what the problem is.. )

 

[Soundguy]

not going into relief is not an expert term.

he's telling you if you can't make the relief crack by deadheading the cyl then the oil is bypassing SOMEWHERE.. liekly the cyl seal.. but COULD be in the spool. taking the 'drop' port hose off a DA CYL, then deadheading it will tell you which it is.

if it does NOT go into relief, and NO oil comes out the other side of the cyl in a continous stream at end of stroke, then it is bypassing in the spool.. on the other hand if oil continously floods out the open drop port ont he cyl, then it is bypassing the packing.

try a pipe wrench... i hope this is not an orb/orfs fitting.. if it is.. the torch ruined the oring...

 

[J_J]

If you have a good cyl, and you fully extend or retract it, it will come to a mechanical stop, and go no further, but the pump is still trying to fill the cyl with fluid. When the fluid stops flowing, because of a blockage, the pressure will rise to the relief pressure, and the pump will be protected. If there is a sufficient leak in the seals, the relief might not activate.

The relief going off sounds like a squeal or whine, and the rod will not move any more.

If there was a gage in the system, you would see this pressure. Sometimes a heavy load will cause the relief to come on, and the cyl will stop moving in the middle of the stroke.

I believe what you are hearing is either cavitation or air , but if none of the other cyl have air, just don't know what it could be..

Check your fittings from your BH valve to the to see if there are any restrictor's in the cyl flow path. They might look like a washer with a small hole in it to restrict the amount of fluid . Remove the hose and any fitting connected to the work port of the out rigger spool and look to see if there is an opening the size of the hose or fitting that is in use.

Long distance trouble shooting and analyzing is difficult sometimes, because we can't see, hear, and observe what you see and hear. I was a NAVY instructor, and spent many hours/years training people, and repetition, hands on, show and tell, and reinforcing key points were used.

 

[heron]

Thanks for the input fellas. I spoke to a tech at Ameriquip today and they felt sure it is the seal or the nut has come off inside the piston. I'm taking it apart and will know more shortly. I'll update you in the next couple of days.

 

[J_J]

Thanks for the input fellas. I spoke to a tech at Ameriquip today and they felt sure it is the seal or the nut has come off inside the piston. I'm taking it apart and will know more shortly. I'll update you in the next couple of days.

Did you do all the other test that was suggested.

Remove the rod end hose from the valve work port and plug the work port, and then place the removed hose in a bucket.

If you now push the lever to lower the out rigger, fluid will exit the cyl until the rod stops.

If fluid continues to come out the cyl port, then you know the fluid is bypassing the seals or flowing through the piston center hole.

You never did say whether the valve would go into relief when trying to lower the out rigger. Does the other out rigger go into relief?

 

[heron]

Did you do all the other test that was suggested.

Remove the rod end hose from the valve work port and plug the work port, and then place the removed hose in a bucket.

If you now push the lever to lower the out rigger, fluid will exit the cyl until the rod stops.

If fluid continues to come out the cyl port, then you know the fluid is bypassing the seals or flowing through the piston center hole.

You never did say whether the valve would go into relief when trying to lower the out rigger. Does the other out rigger go into relief?

Sorry, have not gotten any further. The one hose I have not been able to free up. I've got both hoses treated with PB blaster and I'm taking my better wrenches over to the tractor later this week to give it a go. As I said earlier I think this was an issue when they got the BH to the dealership as both hose ends are so destroyed I cannot get a good bite on the fitting. I ordered a larger snap ring plier set and I've got a seal kit coming from the seller. If I can get the hoses off I'll certainly do what you say and test it out before I dismantle the piston but due to the fact the actual Ameriquip tech told me he has seen the nuts back off internally on these 8600 models I'm thinking it's either seal or the nut off. I'll probably have to wait until next week for the snap ring pliers and the seal kit to get here allowing me time to do some further testing. Cycling it with the hose off in the bucket will be an easy way to figure this out. Thanks again for the help and I'll update when I know more.

 

[Soundguy]

take a pipe wrench with you...

 

[heron]

Okay, finally got the time to go further. Switched hoses today and the stabilizer cylinder is fine. The problem simply switched to the other stabilizer so now I know it's in the BH valve assembly. I spoke to the Ameriquip tech who said I'd need to take the whole valve out. So, marked all hoses and began the knuckle busting of removing all the hoses and getting it out.
The tech said to check take out the 1 1/8 nuts on the top and bottom of the problem valve area and have a look. Not sure what the technical term is but on one the rounded mushroom like thing was not pushing in and out very well on the bottom side. Cleaned it up and it moved much better.
So, not I've got this heavy valve sitting on a temporary workbench(building a house so I'm living in an apartment).
What should I do to check this thing out? I attached pictures of it. The problem section is the number 8 and 6

.

Should I disassemble from the where the main pressure side comes in or should I pull it apart from the other side?
What should I be looking for? Remember, this BH has never been used and probably was defective or there is a piece of trash somewhere from the factory. As I took it apart on various fittings I found junk that looked like teflon...? Also, all other hydraulic areas work great, it's just that one stack there numbered 8 and 6.
I do have the instructions from Ameriquip although they are very hard to read.