Pay for work not done?

[Doc_Bob]

By the way, what did it cost to actually fix the tractor correctly, assuming that has now been done. Did the dealer that has now fixed the tractor (if it has been done) save any money on repairs because of parts installed by the Texas dealer? You can see my angle, but it only makes sense if the Texas dealer actually did something of value, despite not being successful.

I also told the Texas dealer that if the parts that installed were part of what the next dealer feels were needed to fix the PS, I would pay them for the parts. Texas did not like that offer either. Texas dealer comment "you will never call us". The Texas dealer was just as negative as they could be about any compromise. It was their way or the highway. To make things worse, they have never offered to help in anyway. Help like work with the next dealer or call a dealer. The Texas dealer said to me that their work was "warrantied" by any NH dealer. When I told them that all three delaers I called said they had never heard of such a thing, the folks in Texas "had never heard of such a thing". I offered to let them call any of the dealers in WI. They did not want to be bothered in calling any of the NH dealers in my area to explain to them about how these WI NH dealers should warranty their work (the Texas dealers work).

Any other ideas? I have run out of ideas.
Bob

 

[DavesTractor]

I also told the Texas dealer that if the parts that installed were part of what the next dealer feels were needed to fix the PS, I would pay them for the parts. Texas did not like that offer either. Texas dealer comment "you will never call us". The Texas dealer was just as negative as they could be about any compromise. It was their way or the highway. To make things worse, they have never offered to help in anyway. Help like work with the next dealer or call a dealer. The Texas dealer said to me that their work was "warrantied" by any NH dealer. When I told them that all three delaers I called said they had never heard of such a thing, the folks in Texas "had never heard of such a thing". I offered to let them call any of the dealers in WI. They did not want to be bothered in calling any of the NH dealers in my area to explain to them about how these WI NH dealers should warranty their work (the Texas dealers work).

Any other ideas? I have run out of ideas.
Bob

Bob, your approach is very solid. It sounds like you have tried the sort of compromises I had in mind. Once you get it fixed, I'd still offer to pay them what is owed, but I think you might want a "release" of sorts from them when you do, noting that they have compromised and your payment is in full. Best of luck, you sound like a fair man.

 

[Doc_Bob]

Bob, your approach is very solid. It sounds like you have tried the sort of compromises I had in mind. Once you get it fixed, I'd still offer to pay them what is owed, but I think you might want a "release" of sorts from them when you do, noting that they have compromised and your payment is in full. Best of luck, you sound like a fair man.

I tried to be very fair with these folks. I was so fair that when the tractor arrived, and it did not work as a PS, I doubted myself! I was so convinced that they knew what they were doing that I had misunderstood how a PS operates. I called my local WI dealers and verified that I was correct on how a PS is supposed to work. But I still had doubts. I had one dealer in Whitewater run my serial number to confirm that the tractor had a "true" PS. This took 2 weeks. Then I called the Texas dealer. That is when I figured out they had "fixed" a PS and they had no idea how a PS works. The dealer "fixed" something they had no knowledge of its proper operation. Now, how can you "fix" something when you have no idea how it operates? I am at the point now that all I can say about the Texas dealer is that have a lot of nerve wanting to be paid for "fixing" something that they did not fix and did not know how to fix.

In my line of work, I know my limits. I would never offer to do brain surgery or fix a broken hip. Why? Because I have no training to do either one (although I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express). It boils down to integrity. No one should offer to fix something if they don't know what they are fixing. And then demand payment for something they did not or know how to fix.
Bob

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Dealer (Texas) did some work on my tractor. Billed me. I paid. Tractor then trucked to my home (WI). Discovered work was not done after tractor arrived.

I called my credit card company and stopped payment. Dealer (in TX) is unhappy.

I explained in the simplest terms I could, it would be like him coming to get his appendix removed. Hospital bills him for removing appendix. He discovers a month later his appendix was not removed. Would he pay the bill for his appendectomy that was not done?

So, should I pay this dealer (in Texas) for work he did not do?
Bob

Since first reading of your situation, I've had a few questions. Some of those questions were answered through the thread. Some weren't. Yesterday, I was talking with my son's wife, who is an attorney. I mentioned your situation, and asked for her comments. I've been is simular (but not nearly as expensive) situations. In case it happens again, I wanted to know where I stand.

I didn't remember what states were involved. That makes some difference. She wasn't familiar with any states but Kentucky. In a nutshell, here's what she had to say.

There's "right and wrong", then there's the laws interpretation. Even though the dealer may well have cheated you, he billed the work, and you made a good faith payment. When you cancelled payment, you might have crossed a line you SHOULDN'T have. Corrective steps may have been to contact State AG or civil court where the dealer is, seeking a refund, as ordered by the court, NOT cancelling a payment already made. (Again, the law, vs. what is the "right thing to do".) The dealer may have some legal recourse there. If it goes to court, you may be found in the wrong for cancelling payment. That shouldn't change the fact that he tried to shaft you. The DEALER may be found in the wrong for billing work not performed. Again, you need to find aplicable laws in the state where the dealer is located and/or where you reside.

Lawyers are paid to find an advantage in loopholes in the law for their clients benefit. It's not always about "who's right or wrong", but who has the sharpest lawyer. (Just ask O.J. Simpson!)

Best case scenario? Work this out like gentlemen, and don't get it in to court. You might BOTH loose in one form or another.

Glad to see you have no animosity towards "Jason". Sounds like he's on your side, and not the least bit in the wrong. I hope this works out the way it SHOULD, and you get your tractor fixed.

IMHO, I'd get NH as "involved" as possible. They may well be your best friend, come time to make the dealer "pony up".

 

[Doc_Bob]

There's "right and wrong", then there's the laws interpretation. Even though the dealer may well have cheated you, he billed the work, and you made a good faith payment. When you cancelled payment, you might have crossed a line you SHOULDN'T have. Corrective steps may have been to contact State AG or civil court where the dealer is, seeking a refund, as ordered by the court, NOT cancelling a payment already made. (Again, the law, vs. what is the "right thing to do".) The dealer may have some legal recourse there. If it goes to court, you may be found in the wrong for cancelling payment. That shouldn't change the fact that he tried to shaft you. The DEALER may be found in the wrong for billing work not performed. Again, you need to find aplicable laws in the state where the dealer is located and/or where you reside.

Good advice.
Bob

 

[Soundguy]

Thinking more about this.. that texas dealer sounds horrible.

I had a hyd remote valve broken on my NH 7610s. I removed it and took it in for a rebuild.. the dealer rebuilt it, and charged me for the labor and a seal kit ( seal kit was 12$ - cheap.. labor was the real money) When i got home.. the remote pack still didn't work, so i called for a pickup on the tractor because they said they would need the entire unit if that repair didn't work.

They did get it fixed the next day or two, and gave me a discount for most of the labor from the first repair that did not work.

I felt that was pretty fair of them. Sounds like your dealer in texas is a scheister...

Soundguy

I tried to be very fair with these folks. I was so fair that when the tractor arrived, and it did not work as a PS, I doubted myself! I was so convinced that they knew what they were doing that I had misunderstood how a PS operates. I called my local WI dealers and verified that I was correct on how a PS is supposed to work. But I still had doubts. I had one dealer in Whitewater run my serial number to confirm that the tractor had a "true" PS. This took 2 weeks. Then I called the Texas dealer. That is when I figured out they had "fixed" a PS and they had no idea how a PS works. The dealer "fixed" something they had no knowledge of its proper operation. Now, how can you "fix" something when you have no idea how it operates? I am at the point now that all I can say about the Texas dealer is that have a lot of nerve wanting to be paid for "fixing" something that they did not fix and did not know how to fix.

In my line of work, I know my limits. I would never offer to do brain surgery or fix a broken hip. Why? Because I have no training to do either one (although I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express). It boils down to integrity. No one should offer to fix something if they don't know what they are fixing. And then demand payment for something they did not or know how to fix.
Bob

 

[Doc_Bob]

Time for an update. I called the dealer and got the names of the owner and general manager. I wrote both of them a very nice 2 page letter explaining the situation. Today, I was called by the owner (he owns four dealerships) and had a very nice conversation. He understood my position completely and apologized for the behavior of his service manager. He said that his service manager has done a great job for 20+ years and that everyone can have a bad day. I offered him the same deal I offered the service manager. Once another dealer in Wisconsin has completed the repairs, any difference will be paid to him. I also told him that if the parts they used on the tractor were felt by the new dealer to have been needed for the repair of the power shuttle, I would pay for them as well. The owner agreed that my offer was more than fair.

I was a little nervous about writing the letters. But, I knew that the owner and general manager were probably not getting the "rest of the story" from the service manager. It appears to have worked out. I will let you know how the story goes as time passes.
Bob

 

[Soundguy]

Yep.. sometimes middle management provides a stumbling block that can only be overcome 'top down'.

soundguy

 

[Doc_Bob]

Yep.. sometimes middle management provides a stumbling block that can only be overcome 'top down'.

soundguy

Yep, I should have talked to the owner day one, but assumed the service manager spoke for the dealer. Next time (I hope there never is a next time) I will do it differently.
Bob

 

[Soundguy]

I went thru this with a repair issue on my GMC Yukon.

Service manager was blocking me. The issue is i kept bringing it in for the same problem.. and they kept -not- fixing it and saying they did.

it took me writing a long letter, listing all the CC's I was sending..General manager, Franchise /dealership owner, and GM corporate.

That got me a very quick phone call from the general manager who had just been contacted by the dealership /franchise owner... The problem was taken care of in short order.. but it still left a bad taste in my mouth.. and the service manager was a bit 'dry' after that...

Soundguy