Pisten Bully 400 service and operations

[jonsstihl]

Is that for the season. We get screwed up here. it is atleast 150 -200 for a season pass for the year if you are a atv guy or for the winter season for sledders.

 

[ArlyA]

jonsstihl, I can't tell you that your gov is screwing you over or not, but the trail pass cost that the State of Michigan charges does not cover the actual cost of the trails. The state is covering the remainder. We pay taxes here.

Is that for the season. We get screwed up here. it is atleast 150 -200 for a season pass for the year if you are a atv guy or for the winter season for sledders.

 

[ArlyA]

Our machine went to the shop for service and nothing serious was found.

Top photo is the barn its stored in. Did someone here ask about its storage?? Ya, no heat... We need to push snow as we leave to keep things clean.

Next few photos take during the last run I made.

Last is our machine plus another in the shop with a blown seal in its drive motor.. Glad it wasn't our machine,,,

 

[ArlyA]

I've been our working but little fresh snow has fallen here. Lots of sled traffic so we need to keep the trails smoothed up. Operating this other Bully has been interesting..

 

[ArlyA]

Lake snow kicked back in here. Nothing to exciting to report, just working every day. Any questions or comments??

 

[Z-Michigan]

Last I knew,the trail permit was $45.
I thought it was high at $15,but I'm thrifty!
Around here,the groomer operators are volunteer.

Trail passes are $48 for Michigan residents this year and were the same last year. Non-residents might be more, I don't know. Neighboring states charge somewhat more. Ontario charges a lot more.

As Arly said, the state only pays part of the cost. I don't know the exact details but am under the impression the state owns the machines and loans them to clubs, while clubs have to cover most other costs including maintenance, repairs etc. If you ride, you should join a club!

You're grooming my local trails Arly, thanks! Are you working for KSC/KTS or the next club south of here? I only saw Toivola mentioned and I think that's the next club south but am not sure. The groomer barn shown looks better than what KSC says they have and are trying to replace.

 

[jonsstihl]

I don't know for sure as i'm not a rider but I'm pretty sure the province doesn't pay anything and the clubs take care of the trails with volunteers and the funds from the trail passes. I just don't know how they distribute the funds from the trail pass sales since some clubs are smaller than others.

 

[jonsstihl]

I don't know for sure as i'm not a rider but I'm pretty sure the province doesn't pay anything and the clubs take care of the trails with volunteers and the funds from the trail passes. I just don't know how they distribute the funds from the trail pass sales since some clubs are smaller than others.

 

[ArlyA]

Ok, ok! Sorry that I've not posted in a while. Yes, Ive been out working and here is a few early am shots. Most are taken live so they are blurry. When I do this canal front path, I push the snow towards the canal in order to keep the trail flat. The canal is on my left which is really Lake Superior. An easy groom?? Plenty of space! Please let me know if you like them.

 

[Garauld]

Nice photos Arly. Didya ever take out one of those trash cans by the canal? :thumbsup:

 

[ArlyA]

Nice photos Arly. Didya ever take out one of those trash cans by the canal? :thumbsup:

Well, not quite but I have rubbed up again the lamps concrete bases a few times. I really tone down the pumps for this portion which means I go slow. This helps the machine steer more gradually and easier to operate. Nonetheless, in one canal photo, you can see material in front of my blade..

 

[Thunder chicken]

Nice Arly! Good to see ya getting lots of grooming in.
We致e been out in our Prinoth Husky. I think I like it more the the Trail Bulley we had last season. Running a packer first.....
Then we have lakes to cross to get anywhere and today still only 10 inches in a bad spot so we wait. The critters enjoy the trail while we cut brush!

 

[ArlyA]

Thanks for posting Thunder chicken. Always fun to see what others are dealing with. The photos are all on there side. Can they be turned upright?

Nice Arly! Good to see ya getting lots of grooming in.
We致e been out in our Prinoth Husky. I think I like it more the the Trail Bulley we had last season. Running a packer first.....
Then we have lakes to cross to get anywhere and today still only 10 inches in a bad spot so we wait. The critters enjoy the trail while we cut brush!
View attachment 636126View attachment 636125

 

[Thunder chicken]

Sorry Arly, I’m using my iPhone and have no idea how to rotate the pictures besides turning the phone on it’s side!

 

[ArlyA]

Z-MI, I do work for Keweenaw Trails Services and my crew basically does the Houghton to Toivola portion. If you'd care to ride along in da bully, just PM me.

You're grooming my local trails Arly, thanks! Are you working for KSC/KTS or the next club south of here? I only saw Toivola mentioned and I think that's the next club south but am not sure. The groomer barn shown looks better than what KSC says they have and are trying to replace.

 

[ArlyA]

Photos taken this am.

 

[Garauld]

Hi Arly, have you noticed that, over time, the Bully track belts have stretched causing the the track bars to ride up on the drive sprocket teeth due to the longer pitch distance?

 

[ArlyA]

Hi Arly, have you noticed that, over time, the Bully track belts have stretched causing the the track bars to ride up on the drive sprocket teeth due to the longer pitch distance?

I'm not sure I'm qualified to answer that question. But I will say that track replacement is much more rare, than driver sprocket replacement is. Cleats also fail and are replaced more commonly. The belting they use and the very large holes they cut in it for cleat installation* may have mitigated much stretch. The track belts have sooooooo much fiber it in, cutting it is very, very difficult. I swear the belting is all fiber!

*Holes are cut in the belting that are lager than the cleat bolt size and spacers are add to create a very larger holding surface. Holes in belt for cleats might be 1 inch in dia.

 

[Garauld]

I am planning on a different scheme on my Snowzer project as I am somewhat worried about the strength of the belts. For each 5" wide belt (150 lb/in rating) I plan to make up a pair of 5/16" x 5" wide splice plates to clamp the two belt ends together using (3) 5/16-24 Gr8 bolts. Each bolt can produce 5220 lbs of clamp force so that should be sufficient. The bigger question is whether the screws will pull thru the belting if the load gets high. Each splice plate will have serrations like the ones on the Bully to reduce any pullout.

 

[ArlyA]

Out today and remembered to bring da stupid camera. I'm actually out grooming most days... Note the sledder in the middle photos is waving at me. I'm static to let them by but most are taken live. What don't I have my hand on the blade joystick? The last photo is what happens within the lake zone. Bright sunlight and nicely snowing at the same time... Please let me know if you enjoy seeing them.

 

[Trails2004]

Looks great thanks for sharing

 

[aeblank]

We love seeing the pics. Thanks.
Makes me miss my Houghton days....

 

[ronjhall]

Keep the pictures coming.

 

[Trails2004]

This is a link to the snowmobile trail groomers operators manual.

I was heavily involved with the publication of this Manual. This is a great resource for all Groomer Operators.

http://www.snowmobilers.org/groomer_guide/GroomerGuidecomplete.pdf

Happy reading!

 

[johnems]

This is a link to the snowmobile trail groomers operators manual.

I was heavily involved with the publication of this Manual. This is a great resource for all Groomer Operators.

http://www.snowmobilers.org/groomer_guide/GroomerGuidecomplete.pdf

Happy reading!

Thanks for this guide I an a Safety Offices on and Incident Management team and a ski patroller ad this will be very handy. I am really enjoying this post. Pleas keep it going.

 

[ArlyA]

Thanks to all for your kind comments and I'll keep this thread going as I can. Let me add that this organization has a very high rate of turnover. I'm trying to.....

 

[ArlyA]

With some minor break downs, I spent 12 hours on the trails today. Counted over 100 sleds. Seems that fuel filters don't last all that long in these machines...

 

[pmsmechanic]

Seems that fuel filters don't last all that long in these machines...

Are the machines stored inside for night? Like in a heated building. You could have condensation issues or algae in the fuel.

 

[ArlyA]

Are the machines stored inside for night? Like in a heated building. You could have condensation issues or algae in the fuel.

This machine is in cold storage and we put 911 fuel treatment in it. Does that help anything? The mechanic who work in it today says the filters should be replaced with the oil change...

 

[LouNY]

This machine is in cold storage and we put 911 fuel treatment in it. Does that help anything? The mechanic who work in it today says the filters should be replaced with the oil change...

Are you referring to the Power Service red bottle diesel 911?
If so that is supposed to be only for emergency after fuel gelling or icing.

 

[pmsmechanic]

I'm a poor guy to ask about fuel filter changes. I don't have problems with fuel and I rarely change fuel filters.

I'm wondering if it's not a bit of an algae problem as the machines sit idle all summer. In that case your mechanic is right about changing the fuel filters every oil change. There are also commercially available algicides that stop the growth of algae.

Cut open a used filter once. If it's full of a black dirty type runny jelly like substance.... At least that's the color of the algae that I had to deal with on a customer tractor.

 

[ArlyA]

Guys, We use quite a bit of fuel, nearly 100 gallons per day and see the fuel truck so often, got to know the delivery guy. I'm just a minion and does what the boss says, which in this case, is to add 911 chemical to the storage tank.

 

[Fallon]

Guys, We use quite a bit of fuel, nearly 100 gallons per day and see the fuel truck so often, got to know the delivery guy. I'm just a minion and does what the boss says, which in this case, is to add 911 chemical to the storage tank.

Power Service 911 red bottle is emergency use only. Longterm use of it isnt good for fuel systems. Power Service white bottle is designed for longterm fuel maintnance & anti-gelling. May want to bring that up with the boss man.

 

[ArlyA]

The other operator broke the drag last night so we are officially off the trails until its repaired. No it wasn't his fault. I needed a day off anyway and with all the snow in the yard, have lots to do. I'll post pictures of a lame drag later. We have a blizzard happening here today.

I asked my boss about the use of 911 fuel treatment and his response was to the effect. "Don't ask questions and keep using it" :confused2:

 

[herm0016]

white bottle should get you the gel protection, and red should be carried on the machine just in case. the company i work for is the 2nd largest user of diesel fuel in the US, right behind the US government. I ran lots of different diesel equipment in Wyoming and north Dakota for years. our mechanics insisted on changing out the filters after we used 911 after a gel event and made it back. we had a lot of trouble with the 6.0 and 6.4 ford engines. we have cat c6 and c7 with 30k + hrs on them. according to our mechanics, we have more issues with the emissions equipment because of using too many additives.

 

[pmsmechanic]

I asked my boss about the use of 911 fuel treatment and his response was to the effect. "Don't ask questions and keep using it" :confused2:

My experience with bosses like that is they don't get the optimum out of their employees. That being said....he's the boss so you do as he says.

 

[ArlyA]

Here is a few photos from my last adventure out on da trails. The drag we used was broke and was looking at it today and got some photos of it. It will take time to get it patched up! The 2nd shows the materiel I normal carry in the blade and move towards the middle. Sled traffic always make the center lower.

 

[Trails2004]

Do you ask for a blended diesel from your wholesaler ?

 

[ArlyA]

Do you ask for a blended diesel from your wholesaler ?

I am not the boss and do not order the fuel. Since they have been doing trail grooming since the 80's, I'd guess they order what's appropriate. If I see the fuel guys, I'll ask what they sell us.

 

[Trails2004]

I am not the boss and do not order the fuel. Since they have been doing trail grooming since the 80's, I'd guess they order what's appropriate.

Do you know if you are running blended fuel?

 

[ArlyA]

We got the machine out of the shop early this am so I made a quick run on our section. Seen 120 sleds and one group I meet gave me a tip with a "thank you" note.

 

[ArlyA]

More photos. Kind of pretty out with this fresh snow.

 

[Fallon]

How does the drag work? Is it just a heavy sled that packs stuff down & smooths it out or is there more to it than that? I assume the wheels drop down to lift the drag when you dont want it on the ground.

 

[ArlyA]

How does the drag work? Is it just a heavy sled that packs stuff down & smooths it out or is there more to it than that? I assume the wheels drop down to lift the drag when you dont want it on the ground.

Its a bit like a road grader. Looking down at it, its a big rectangle with cutting bars across it which slice off the snow moguls. In fresh snow, they also take much of the air out of snow. Like a grader that pushes gravel to the left or right and smooths out the bumps in the road, these do a similar job in snow but snow drag will also have a pan which presses the snow and makes it table flat. Just need time for it to freeze. I looked for a video of one that shows how they work and wasn't very impressed with them. Does anyone have a better description??

 

[Thunder chicken]

Hi Arly. Your description of the drag is bang on. Here’s a pic of one of ours. It’s a Sur-Trac from Ebert Welding. The front of the drag (cutters) and the pan adjust independently. Also have a brush cutter bar.
It’s a lot of watching the drag with 2 adjustments but you can cut heavy when needed and keep the snow or let it flow right through.

 

[Fallon]

Its a bit like a road grader. Looking down at it, its a big rectangle with cutting bars across it which slice off the snow moguls. In fresh snow, they also take much of the air out of snow. Like a grader that pushes gravel to the left or right and smooths out the bumps in the road, these do a similar job in snow but snow drag will also have a pan which presses the snow and makes it table flat. Just need time for it to freeze. I looked for a video of one that shows how they work and wasn't very impressed with them. Does anyone have a better description??

Ok, like a land plane then. At least up front.

 

[Trails2004]

....Does anyone have a better description??

See link below, this manual goes into great detail with regard to snow science and multi blade drag operation.


Pisten Bully 400 service and operations
https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5628809

 

[ArlyA]

We received snow over the past few days and not sure of the volume, maybe 2ft. With plenty of fresh materiel to work with, you carry much in the blade. Any questions? I seen over 230 sleds today. The only photos that are taken static is the passing machines ones.

 

[TCowner]

This is the most beautiful country on the planet.

 

[ArlyA]

Photos from early this am. 1st one looks as if some idiot fell off the trail. That was me yesterday.
Then our going under out lift bridge.
Next is a parking lot I groom past and the snow is deep enough, I look down at the autos parked there.
The sun came up and shinned for a bit. We don't often see it here.
Last one is our street. 166" for the season...