Planning on dropping Health Insurance. Change my mind.

[two_bit_score]

Yup. Rich people who are not willing to wait their turn can always get what they want from a country where they can buy their medicine on an ad hoc basis. What I worry about is the guys who can’t afford $1.5 million for their wife’s treatment. It is just a shame.

People from all over the world come to the Houston Medical Center for treatment for a reason also.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

The best way to lower healthcare cost it to limit offering it one way or another. I seems to be working for Canada based on these posts in some cases.

Some are learning access to health care on demand is not always a Right. Gate keepers are in place for a reason.

This matter can only get worse because no one has the will/motivation to fund universal healthcare on demand.

If we can not afford to be private pay as is the case for many of us we have a boat without a paddle. I was reading the other day many see the need to be worth $5 million dollars at retirement to make sure they can buy the medical care they may want when it is needed.

A couple with a child or two making $10 hourly can not pay for much insurance plus food and a roof over the head. In our area the $20-$30 blue collar jobs are going away fast and there goes middle America I expect.

 

[riptides]

...
I was reading the other day many see the need to be worth $5 million dollars at retirement to make sure they can buy the medical care they may want when it is needed.
...

That seems about right. I should go back and add up the whole family for the past 6 years. And project out exactly how long? Average man/woman lifespan?

 

[check]

The best way to lower healthcare cost it to limit offering it one way or another. I seems to be working for Canada based on these posts in some cases.

Some are learning access to health care on demand is not always a Right. Gate keepers are in place for a reason.

This matter can only get worse because no one has the will/motivation to fund universal healthcare on demand.

If we can not afford to be private pay as is the case for many of us we have a boat without a paddle. I was reading the other day many see the need to be worth $5 million dollars at retirement to make sure they can buy the medical care they may want when it is needed.

A couple with a child or two making $10 hourly can not pay for much insurance plus food and a roof over the head. In our area the $20-$30 blue collar jobs are going away fast and there goes middle America I expect.

Right on, Gale. In fact, many countries have universal healthcare systems, but they use a “triage“ method to determine who can wait and who cannot. For example, my father-in-law wanted some I work, and he was told he had to wait a year, where as my brother-in-law had cataracts that were so bad he was going blind, and he was in within two weeks. He was also given the option of “upgrading, the lens that they were going to put in to a more “Cadillac” model (!), but it only cost him $200 for the upgrade.

 

[Streetcar]

Universal care is rationed and there is little innovation. I saw that over 2/3 of new medicine and procedures originated in US in past decade

 

[ultrarunner]

Universal care is rationed and there is little innovation. I saw that over 2/3 of new medicine and procedures originated in US in past decade

Very true... innovation, even from foreign owned Pharm is often US driven market driven... follow the money.

My Austrian Docs and Nurses are amazed at the broad coverage Medicare provides and Austria is known for having very good Universal Health Care... but, even then many pay for a supplement giving them choice...

One could argue the US has Universal Health Care through the County Hospital... especially since the law is that emergency treatment cannot be denied anyone...

I have no idea what the answer is but will add a comment on abuse of the system.

The Bay Area is known for a very large transient population of people living on the street. There is an entire community very well known to Hospital staff and Law Enforcement.

I can name several that are weekly users of public services... sometimes almost daily calls to Law Enforcement and weekly ambulance service to County Hospital...

They are so well known that I can call police dispatch and EVERYONE knows these individuals by first name and this includes EMT... the manpower and resource drain to the entire system by just one individual is tremendous... and this is no exaggeration.

 

[Travelover]

.........

One could argue the US has Universal Health Care through the County Hospital... especially since the law is that emergency treatment cannot be denied anyone...

But would a county hospital provide a full course of cancer treatment including drugs? That is what bankrupts people.

I have no idea what the answer is but will add a comment on abuse of the system.

The Bay Area is known for a very large transient population of people living on the street. There is an entire community very well known to Hospital staff and Law Enforcement.

I can name several that are weekly users of public services... sometimes almost daily calls to Law Enforcement and weekly ambulance service to County Hospital...

They are so well known that I can call police dispatch and EVERYONE knows these individuals by first name and this includes EMT... the manpower and resource drain to the entire system by just one individual is tremendous... and this is no exaggeration.

This is indeed a situation that needs to be addressed, but with national health care costs at over $8000 per person per year, it is a distraction. The problem is that the excessive costs issue is not being seriously addressed. There should be comprehensive data comparing our spending, by category, with other major industrialized countries and a plan to meet or beat the best. Instead we have anecdotes, half-hearted efforts at reform and unlimited campaign contributions from the medical and pharmaceutical industries with robo-letters to constituents that complain.

 

[ultrarunner]

So Medicare for all with the optional supplement for additional cost?

I firmly believe we expect a lot more when it comes to health care than past generations...

Have many family and friend Anecdotes going to my own Grandfather who had NEVER been to a Doc in his entire life until a farm accident at age 88... all my aunts and uncles all delivered at home...

When he went to the Hospital the Doctor noted an irregular heart beat... they did some tests and wanted to put in a pace maker... Grandpa refused saying when it was his time it is his time... lived another 8 years and passed in his sleep.

Contrast that with what we see coming into the ER... insect bites, scrapes, bruises... many come to get checked out... it is big business... a few X-rays, maybe a scan, blood work... etc...

The only people we knew growing up with a Health Plan worked for the government or a large company that provided Kaiser... and plenty had things to say about Kaiser!

Is there anyone that believes Universal Healthcare that pleases everyone is even a possibility?

The reason I bring this up is there are not enough Doctors and Hospitals to see everyone if it was "Free"...

Hospitals are closing every day somewhere in America... the standard of care comes with high overhead... and in California... large Hospitals are finding seismic retrofitting often is not feasible...

What percentage of GDP should go to Healthcare?

 

[Agvg]

If you have a health care like rest of the western world things would probably calm down, if there no mony to be made by checking everything that is possible to do for profit or fear for getting sued for something minor it's no point do more than necessary.

 

[ultrarunner]

If you have a health care like rest of the western world things would probably calm down, if there no mony to be made by checking everything that is possible to do for profit or fear for getting sued for something minor it's no point do more than necessary.

Sounds more like tort reform...

My Austrian colleagues have little fear of mal-practice... the concept really doesn't exist there... unlike here where anyone remotely involved may find themselves in court...

They simply say we did the best we could and that is the end of it...

 

[Agvg]

Here in Norway we have a government system to handle compensation for mistakes etc done in the health care system, but as all other cases that involves compensation you can only claim real economical losses.

So no millions for a failing coffee cup on MacDonald or a day or two extra on the hospital

 

[ultrarunner]

Here in Norway we have a government system to handle compensation for mistakes etc done in the health care system, but as all other cases that involves compensation you can only claim real economical losses.

So no millions for a failing coffee cup on MacDonald or a day or two extra on the hospital

I've never been to Norway but hosted a young exchange student years ago... she is married and has a family and we still keep in touch... she wouldn't trade her time in the States for anything but when it came time to settle and raise a family the difference between Norway and the United States are polar opposite.

Same for all those hosted from Austria... they said to be single and entrepreneurial nothing beats the States... but, trying to raise a family, health insurance, lack of mandated vacation time and limited pregnancy leave had all returning the Austria...

Austrians have some 42 holiday days a year... one young lady became an accountant and had back to back 3 children 2 years apart and was paid the entire time AND her company had to keep her position open for her return 6 years later...

The Moms have a baby book for each child... if the mom keeps all the well baby doctor appointments and vaccinations the Mom receives a cash stipend for being a good Mom...

Here is how it starts:

See the doctor! You should go to gynecologist/obstetrician fairly soon after you know or suspect you are pregnant, to start the bureaucratic and care process. You can find one by asking friends/colleagues/other VBC members. Please note, that you should have your first visit to the doctor before the 14th week, or you may not be eligible for the various payments offered by the Austrian insurance and finance system.

Get your mother-child passport: Somewhere around the 12th week, you will get the Mutter-Kind Pass from your gynecologist. This small bright yellow booklet lists all the procedures that are covered under the Austrian healthcare system during pregnancy and the first 6 years of your child's life. You will need to bring it to all your doctor visits and all your child's doctor visits, and to ensure you get your full payments during maternity leave and beyond. See Birth Bureaucracy for more information.

Pregnancy | Vienna Babies Club

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

Well it’s been nearly a year, spent another $3200 this year on health insurances and didn’t use any of it once. Worked threw the whole “Covid pandemic”.

If I dropped coverage I would have saved that much. Just signed up for 2021, guess I’ll donate another $3200 this year, what a waste of wealth. I hope one day I’ll get my moneys worth out of the healthcare industry but that’s not likely to happen, I have never gotten a break when I use it yet, I always just get a bill like I don’t even have insurance.

In my opinion doctors and nurses are grossly over paid, sure they work hard, who doesn’t work hard? They are greatly composited for it though, then act like they are doing the world a favor by doing their jobs. If Biden forgives healthcare workers student loans I’m gonna lose it and send him a not so nice Email.

 

[Muhammad]

Well it’s been nearly a year, spent another $3200 this year on health insurances and didn’t use any of it once. Worked threw the whole “Covid pandemic”.

If I dropped coverage I would have saved that much. Just signed up for 2021, guess I’ll donate another $3200 this year, what a waste of wealth. I hope one day I’ll get my moneys worth out of the healthcare industry but that’s not likely to happen, I have never gotten a break when I use it yet, I always just get a bill like I don’t even have insurance.

In my opinion doctors and nurses are grossly over paid, sure they work hard, who doesn’t work hard? They are greatly composited for it though.

I've spent at least $40,000 on health insurance and have used only $210 and that was for one covid test this year when my wife was going into the hospital for labor. She got her money's worth with a $40,000 delivery this year.

Some doctors are compensated way more than others, all depending on the specialty. The whole system is a mess and has been for decades. It's only getting worse. These days it's not even really a topic of discussion. Feels like everybody has given up on any chance of reform and now just wants free health care for all. That's another topic.

 

[BrokeFarmerJohn]

I've spent at least $40,000 on health insurance and have used only $210 and that was for one covid test this year when my wife was going into the hospital for labor. She got her money's worth with a $40,000 delivery this year.

Some doctors are compensated way more than others, all depending on the specialty. The whole system is a mess and has been for decades. It's only getting worse. These days it's not even really a topic of discussion. Feels like everybody has given up on any chance of reform and now just wants free health care for all. That's another topic.

You spent 40k out of pocket? Or that’s what the total bill was?

Congrats on the new baby!

 

[Muhammad]

You spent 40k out of pocket? Or that’s what the total bill was?

Congrats on the new baby!

Thanks! The insurance paid about $40k. Out of pocket was about $3k.

 

[polo1665]

You never know when something will hit you. I went through a health scare earlier this year and the medical bills were well over $300,000. I ended up with about $3,600 out of pocket.

In my case the doctor's fees were not the driving factor, it was the pharmaceuticals that were out of sight.

 

[fishheadbob]

" I hope one day I’ll get my moneys worth out of the healthcare industry "


Be careful what you wish for...

 

[two_bit_score]

Thanks! The insurance paid about $40k. Out of pocket was about $3k.

How much were your premiums for insurance?

 

[RickB]

" I hope one day I’ll get my moneys worth out of the healthcare industry "


Be careful what you wish for...

It takes a special kind to complain about having good health.