Comparison Please help please advise

[kenmac]

And that is?


I paid under $19K for mine including a 4' tiller. Closest dealer though seems to be Haney's in Athens.

Athens Al. ?

 

[kenmac]

I have to say. I have a three range on my HST Kubota MX 5100. Unless I'm on the road. High range is useless.
90% of the time I'm in middle range

 

[TMGT]

Kioti has been extremely quiet on the new HST Assist. But it closely duplicates the HST Plus that Kubota uses as an option on their tractors.

I'm very interested in it as I like to keep up to date on whats new with compacts. We don't have a Kioti dealer nearby so can't see them in person except at shows/fairs and all of those were cancelled last year.
It almost sounded like an add-on so I'm curious to learn more. Seems odd that Kioti isn't advertising it, HST+ was a large reason I went with a 40series Kubota L when I upgraded last year.

Is there any literature on it at all?

 

[paulfun9]

The discussion seems to focus mostly on the HST and 2-3 range - but since you indicate this is a TLB consider how the BH is mounted and subframe.

The Kioti (unless they changed) has a subframe mount that comes off with the BH about 8' long, and it hangs further off the back and has lower ground clearance. IMO the subframe setup is harder to install, and also store. The Kubota BH77 has a 4PT connection close to the tractor and the subframe stays on the tractor and is easier to remove and install.

So take a look and test the R&R on the BH for both models as part of your evaluation would be my suggestion.

Don稚 forget to tell them how you have to take the 3 point arms off to use the kubota backhoe and that with the Kioti you can simply leave them on.

By the way it seems most who have used both systems seem to find the Kioti subframe system easy to attach as well.

 

[Diggin It]

Athens Al. ?

Uh-huh. They have another location further south too from the map I saw.

Don稚 forget to tell them how you have to take the 3 point arms off to use the kubota backhoe and that with the Kioti you can simply leave them on.

I leave them on mine too. I can tuck them up against the back fenders.

 

[John Tractoring]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. I'm now waiting on the Kubota dealer to put together a B2601 hydro for me to test drive. The ONLY THING that stops me from signing papers on the Kioti CX2510 hydro is it has no mid range. My land slightly slopes and I will be using it for a lot of loader work moving dirt building jumps for me and my sons mini 4 acre motorcross track. I also have about 400 yards of gravel driveway up a hill to maintain. I also will be clearing out a new trail through our woods I'd say about 150 yards of clearing at most 8 foot wide and no hurry on the clearing project gonna do a little at a time and enjoy the tractor time. With my last two Mahindras all the loader work I did was in Mid range. My fear is with the kioti the low range will be way to slow in transport and or to weak to push pull. Is the low range in it truly a low range gearing. What I mean is I'm concerned because it only has two range they have sped the low up a bit to balance speed and power because as most of you have already stated I to find high range useless on my property from past experience. On my prior two mahindras Mid range worked but had it not I had the option of putting it in low. I feel the KUBOTA may have a more stronger low range being it has all 3 range, BUT also the kioti out weighs that Kubota by 600 pounds if spec sheets are right. When I asked the dealer if he had any insight as to why the kubota was so much lighter he just started talking about market share and resale value which isn't a concern to me. I would just move up to the Kioti CK3510 but that is the size of my first mahindra 2538 hydro I had and I really can build our jumps and get the angles right faster with a smaller tractor and my building was actually built for the smaller framed 25 hp tractors. I Love the size of the kioti CX2510 and kubota B2601. Any way sorry for the long post I know I am probably WAY overthinking this but as nerve racking as it is its also very joyful I cant wait to get one again. I had to sale my Mahindra 3540 Hydro about a couple years ago due to my wife falling ill with clusters of blood clots in her lungs (due to birth control) long story short I sold what I could and got two extra part time jobs in addition to my main job. Thinks are straightened out now and I'm ready to get back in the saddle. I truly appreciate all of your inputs they help me narrow things down. Thank you

 

[John Tractoring]

I'm very interested in it as I like to keep up to date on whats new with compacts. We don't have a Kioti dealer nearby so can't see them in person except at shows/fairs and all of those were cancelled last year.
It almost sounded like an add-on so I'm curious to learn more. Seems odd that Kioti isn't advertising it, HST+ was a large reason I went with a 40series Kubota L when I upgraded last year.

Is there any literature on it at all?

To my knowledge the HST assist has been available for at least 3 years on the CK3510 and CK4010 as add ons. Its a $400.00 add on on the CX2510 Its standard on the CK2610SE CK3510SE and CK4010SE The SE is the premium line.

 

[rScotty]

To my knowledge the HST assist has been available for at least 3 years on the CK3510 and CK4010 as add ons. Its a $400.00 add on on the CX2510 Its standard on the CK2610SE CK3510SE and CK4010SE The SE is the premium line.

I am curious about Kioti's HST assist, but don't know anything about it.
If anyone has any technical info on what it is, does, and how it works I'd be interested in learning about it.

We have the HST+ on our Kubota and like it a lot. In fact, I doubt if I would buy buy HST without it.
In the workshop manual, HST+ looks pretty complex. I don't think it is an add on.
rScotty

 

[TMGT]

Thanks for all the replies everyone. I'm now waiting on the Kubota dealer to put together a B2601 hydro for me to test drive. The ONLY THING that stops me from signing papers on the Kioti CX2510 hydro is it has no mid range. My land slightly slopes and I will be using it for a lot of loader work moving dirt building jumps for me and my sons mini 4 acre motorcross track. I also have about 400 yards of gravel driveway up a hill to maintain. I also will be clearing out a new trail through our woods I'd say about 150 yards of clearing at most 8 foot wide and no hurry on the clearing project gonna do a little at a time and enjoy the tractor time. With my last two Mahindras all the loader work I did was in Mid range. My fear is with the kioti the low range will be way to slow in transport and or to weak to push pull. Is the low range in it truly a low range gearing. What I mean is I'm concerned because it only has two range they have sped the low up a bit to balance speed and power because as most of you have already stated I to find high range useless on my property from past experience. On my prior two mahindras Mid range worked but had it not I had the option of putting it in low. I feel the KUBOTA may have a more stronger low range being it has all 3 range, BUT also the kioti out weighs that Kubota by 600 pounds if spec sheets are right. When I asked the dealer if he had any insight as to why the kubota was so much lighter he just started talking about market share and resale value which isn't a concern to me. I would just move up to the Kioti CK3510 but that is the size of my first mahindra 2538 hydro I had and I really can build our jumps and get the angles right faster with a smaller tractor and my building was actually built for the smaller framed 25 hp tractors. I Love the size of the kioti CX2510 and kubota B2601. Any way sorry for the long post I know I am probably WAY overthinking this but as nerve racking as it is its also very joyful I cant wait to get one again. I had to sale my Mahindra 3540 Hydro about a couple years ago due to my wife falling ill with clusters of blood clots in her lungs (due to birth control) long story short I sold what I could and got two extra part time jobs in addition to my main job. Thinks are straightened out now and I'm ready to get back in the saddle. I truly appreciate all of your inputs they help me narrow things down. Thank you

The problem I've seen with most 2range HST trans is they have to compromise to cover a wider speed range. The high is a little too high for any ground engaging or heavier loader work and the low range is either painfully slow or not low enough and doesn't have enough grunt for heavier work.

If the company did a good job at balancing the ranges and you don't need a higher transport speed then 2ranges are fine, it just seems like most 2range hst are compromised in one area or the other. I also rarely use high range on my B2620, but its nice to have when heading down the road to the neighbors house to help out and allows for a more even split between ranges.

These lower HP tractors can also use all the help they can get in the gearing department!

 

[TMGT]

I am curious about Kioti's HST assist, but don't know anything about it.
If anyone has any technical info on what it is, does, and how it works I'd be interested in learning about it.

We have the HST+ on our Kubota and like it a lot. In fact, I doubt if I would buy buy HST without it.
In the workshop manual, HST+ looks pretty complex. I don't think it is an add on.
rScotty

That was my thought also, if its similar to the hst+ I don't see how it could be an add on. Maybe it's more like a stall gaurd or something?

I couldn't find a mention of it on their website or in any internet searches.

Is it called something other then HST assist?

 

[paulfun9]

Did you test drive the 2 range?

Without a proper test run the question about is the gearing going to work for you can’t be answered.

 

[John Tractoring]

Did you test drive the 2 range?

Without a proper test run the question about is the gearing going to work for you can’t be answered.

Yes I have drove the kioti CX2510 in low range in the dealer parking lot. The only way to properly test it to me would require me using it at home and that's not an option unless I've already bought it. My hope in posting here was maybe someone here has had the experience on a CK2510 (as the CX2510 is the CK2510 just a little updated) and a B2601 and might have a definite opinion on the two vs each other. Im going to go test drive the kubota in a couple days and that will help me see how the low and mid range compares to the kioti low range. Just driving it in the parking lot I would have to say it felt a bit two fast for what I consider a low range. Its like some of you have said its balanced between power and speed. How well that balance is say compared to my other option the kubota I dont know. Bottom line is the kioti will most likely push pull anything I'm gonna want it too(hopefully I have about 400 yard driveway up a hill I periodically pull the box blade down with the scallops all the way down) but knowing the kubota has that 3 range haunts me. Cuz for me thats the ONLY thing the kubota has over the kioti. I guess what I was wanting was someone here to tell me the kioti has the same push pull power in its low range as the kubota does. I'm probably just way overthinking all this at this point. Thank you.

 

[John Tractoring]

That was my thought also, if its similar to the hst+ I don't see how it could be an add on. Maybe it's more like a stall gaurd or something?

I couldn't find a mention of it on their website or in any internet searches.

Is it called something other then HST assist?

The HST assist or Link Kit (there the same thing as far as I know) may not be what's known as an add on but instead an option. I know the CX2510 does not come with it but you can have it installed same as the CK line. At least thats what I'm told by two dealers. I have drove the CK2610 and CK3510 with the HST assist link kit.

 

[TMGT]

The HST assist or Link Kit (there the same thing as far as I know) may not be what's known as an add on but instead an option. I know the CX2510 does not come with it but you can have it installed same as the CK line. At least thats what I'm told by two dealers. I have drove the CK2610 and CK3510 with the HST assist link kit.

That sounds like the linked throttle maybe? Where it connects the throttle advance to the hst pedal. That can be added on.

It is a nice feature, I find I use it a lot on my L3240, however its not even remotely comparable to the HST+. That's what was throwing me off I guess, since someone said they were similar earlier in the thread.

 

[paulfun9]

Yes I have drove the kioti CX2510 in low range in the dealer parking lot. The only way to properly test it to me would require me using it at home and that's not an option unless I've already bought it. My hope in posting here was maybe someone here has had the experience on a CK2510 (as the CX2510 is the CK2510 just a little updated) and a B2601 and might have a definite opinion on the two vs each other. Im going to go test drive the kubota in a couple days and that will help me see how the low and mid range compares to the kioti low range. Just driving it in the parking lot I would have to say it felt a bit two fast for what I consider a low range. Its like some of you have said its balanced between power and speed. How well that balance is say compared to my other option the kubota I dont know. Bottom line is the kioti will most likely push pull anything I'm gonna want it too(hopefully I have about 400 yard driveway up a hill I periodically pull the box blade down with the scallops all the way down) but knowing the kubota has that 3 range haunts me. Cuz for me thats the ONLY thing the kubota has over the kioti. I guess what I was wanting was someone here to tell me the kioti has the same push pull power in its low range as the kubota does. I'm probably just way overthinking all this at this point. Thank you.

Test the Kioti again, let warm up and put it in high. If the dealer doesn’t look for a way for you to test and prove it’s going to work for you your decision is made to go with an other machine or brand. Unless the other brand dealer also locks you into slow non representative test drives also.
Myself I have actually switched to different dealerships because they expected me to test drive only on a flat paved lot with no room or representative tasks to get a real feel of a machine.
I find most good dealers will find a way to accommodate you if they are dont, they probably are not worth buying from to begin with!

One of the dealers I purchased a Kubota from years ago used to actually schedule demo days. At a site just a few miles up the road from the dealership. They would take a few machines up to the field and have a sort of open house that potential customers would come and actually run the machines, doing actuall work.
When space is limited you can also be a little inventive, tow your car or truck up the hill behind the shop. Have them unload a heavy delivery with the same model tractor your looking to buy, ask to go to the dealers home and run the demo unit he has been using. These being just a few of the many things that have been done.

Few of us can really get a feel for a machine on a flat paved lot without any work to do. If the dealer is worth anything they know this and will have a plan in place for the demanding customer, or be quick to find a way to prove thier machine is worthy of your purchase.

Take your time, look then look again, test then test again. Be sure it’s the right machine and then enjoy!

 

[rScotty]

When you test drive the Kubota, be sure to pay special attention to how it does in the middle range. Most Kubota owners post that they use the midrange almost exclusively. Low is nice to have for occasional use, but frankly I rarely go there and never stay there. High gets a little more use just because I have a 100 yard drive between barn and my normal project area. But once there, it's back to midrange again.
A downside is that the Kubotas don't shift real easily between the ranges. I don't know if the Kioti does.

In the end, HST is a compromise based on operator convenience rather than tractor power. And that sort of describes me, too....I'm getting old enough that my tractoring is now a handy hobby rather than a vocation. And as a hobbyist I like my HST. But I'm a picky hobbyist; hence I lean toward more ranges.

That is why I don't try to compare pulling power between HST versions. I suspect that either would do for my hobby work. If I was more serious about doing hard work with a small tractor - or doing genuine small acreage farming work with a small tractor - then I wouldn't be looking at HST at all, I'd go straight for the the modern geared option in that model: A geared multi-speed power shift/power reverse transmission.

Hats off to both Kioti and Kubota for continuing to offer those modern clutchless shuttle shift transmissions as an option. That speaks well for both companies.
rScotty

 

[Richard]

Athens Al. ?

I presumed he meant Tennessee. It's not too far from where he lives (I have no idea about Alabama)

 

[mred2]

Athen, Al does have a LS and Massey dealer. Just south from them on the interstate is a large Marhindra dealer.

 

[mred2]

Richard, I love you dog. I had one that I got from Tenn. some years back. I lost him after 13 1/2 years. Great dog!

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

Here is another way to look at your dilemma over the 2 range or 3 range:
as others have said, the 2 range is still covering the middle of the ranges.... the low range covers the area into the "lower mid range".....
The high range also covers the "upper part of the mid range".....

With a 3 range, you will find that the "max" of the low range is too slow for what you want to do, so now you have to shift into the mid range....
Then you may find that being in high range while just transporting some light materials, might be too high to initially push into a mulch pile to load... so again, now shifting down into the mid or low range.... you may find that you are needing to change ranges frequently....

I have a gear tractor, 12 speeds forward, 12 reverse (4 speed transmission, 3 ranges). In 1st gear, low range.... really a creeper gear.... my 86 y/o mother in law could out run the tractor with her walker.... 4th gear, high range is down right scary to be on a tractor that fast unless on smooth pavement going straight....

With all those available gears, there is one that always suits my needs. BUT.... I do shift frequently between low and mid ranges.
I believe that the 3 range will give more precise control of speed vs power, but the 2 range are designed to cover the area "in between". There are too many tractors out there with 2 range transmissions that work very well for what they are intended.

Decisions, decisions.... too many decisions....:shocked: