Power Service Problem???

[oldballs]

Guys,

I went to my Kubota dealer today to pick up some parts etc. On my shopping list was a bottle of Power Service (White bottle). I could not find any on the shelves???? When asking the parts manager about it, he said that they do not stock it any longer ...........because Kubota claims PS has alcohol in it that dries out some seals that will eventually cause failure.

He had an alternate product called "All Season DFC + Plus HP"...Diesel fuel conditioner by BG Products in Wichita Kansas.

Hum-m-m-What do you all think? I've used the PS white for 11 years in several models of CUT and SCUT.....without a problem....so far.

Cheers,
Mike

 

[Peter 315]

I found this...... Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement at one time did contain the type of
alcohol recommended by Cummins, Detroit Diesel, and Caterpillar for
reliquefying gelled fuel. At that point, Diesel Fuel Supplement was not an
antigel product. However, we changed the formulation of Diesel Fuel
Supplement to be a year-around antigel/injector cleaning product. Diesel
Fuel Supplement and Arctic Express are both middle distillate flow
improvers that prevent gelling -- neither product contains any alcohol.
The only product manufactured by Power Service that contains alcohol is
our Diesel 9-1-1 -- For Diesel Fuel Emergencies. This product reliquefies
gelled fuel, de-ices frozen fuel filters, and removes water.

 

[LouNY]

I've used the Power Serve anti-gell for quite awhile.
I'm not sure what I'm going to do this winter,
I tried a jug of Howes this fall and it seemed to do a bit nicer job,
I am tempted to try it for this winter and see how it goes, :confused3:
I may be kicking myself later on this winter but who knows, I do have spare filters and 911 if i have to.

 

[hube2]

I ordered a case of the PS White. It does not go bad and I figure I have enough to last me years.

Need to get at least one bottle of 9-1-1 before it gets really cold, but having a hard time finding a small bottle. You don't want to leave a bottle of this sitting around after you open it because a lot of it will evaporate over time.

I will probably order a case of the silver some time before spring.

I hate running to the store for things over and over again.

 

[oldballs]

As Peter315 above posted.........PS white does not contain the alcohol that Kubota has told to my dealer. Why would Kubota make such a claim saying that the alcohol would dry out some seals, if it was not so??? This long time dealer has sold PS for years and is just another profitable product to him.

 

[sandyc]

My dealer moved his ps to the stock room. You have to ask for it. Makes me think Kubota wants another brand to be sold....$$$?

 

[diesel85]

If Power Service was that bad, they wouldn't be in business, nor would modern large engine manufacturers recommend them.

I've used PS (the silver bottle) in my BX2200 since we bought it back in 2002, and I think it has done nothing but good to the engine. I've never had any issues.

The biggest problem I see with folks fuel systems getting contaminated with water is the following:

1. Bad fuel from the supplier. (Ranks #1!)
2. Poorly sealing fuel caps that let too much moisture in. (More so if the machine is kept outside with no protection.)
3. Not keeping a full tank during the fall to winter and winter to spring (high temperature/moisture gradients).

Folks forget that fuel caps are wear items too.

With all the technicality aside, if you use quality fuel, have a properly working fuel system, you should not have a problem, and you don't need to use any additives.

 

[LHoyer]

Use Howes

 

[oldballs]

I just can't figure out "why" Kubota would claim that PS white bottle has alcohol in it when PS says it does not???? Maybe it has something to do with warranty......but yet if there is no alcohol.....there is no case.

 

[Ford850]

Power Service used to recommend using the white bottle year round. Some years back, they changed the formula and the directions. Now they say "Diesel Fuel Supplement +Cetane Boost is intended for use only during cold winter months when temperatures drop below +30F." That's when I switched to Howes and use that year round, double dosing in winter. If you look at the PS details, they say the white bottle will not affect your engine warranty as long as you use the PS "as directed". Using it in temps above 30F could be considered as not using it as directed in my opinion. PS also says they do not use alcohol, but they don't use common names for their ingredients, only sating they are "Trade Secrets". They do, however, say to use an "Alcohol resistant foam" for firefighting their product. To me, that says their "trade secret" ingredient may not technically be alcohol but it obviously acts like alcohol. That could be why they say not to use their product year round, and why Kubota does not recommend it.

 

[hube2]

I'm not a chemist, but things like this pique my curiosity.

I looked at the data sheets for PS products and did some creative searching and guesswork and this is what I came up with 2-Ethylhexanol - Wikipedia.

Please note that I could be wrong because the actual ingredient in PS is a "Trade Secret" and all I had to start with is what PS calls it which is "Hexan-1-ol, 2-ethyl"

It is a type of alcohol, but from what I can find it is a common diesel additive and added by refineries, so it's nothing that is not already in the the fuel you get from the pump. Cetane Improver - Wikipedia

One of the main Cetane Improver additives manufactured today is 2-ethylhexyl nitrate (CAS n°: 27247-96-7)[1] which starts to decompose at 130 °C. 2-ethylhexyl nitrate is the result of the reaction of 2-ethylhexanol and nitric acid.

So someone saying there is alcohol in it is not exactly lying, but they're not giving you the whole story.

Kubota makes there own diesel fuel treatment "Opti-Lube" and it is no surprise to me that they would find some reason to say that theirs is better and to give some reason not to use other brands.

 

[Paystar]

I have used Power Service in my big trucks, heavy equipment and my pickup. And I can say Howes and Cat's fuel treatment are superior. Howes actually unstuck two injectors in an engine that stuck using Power Service.
That's why I think it is superior. But that's just my personal opinion. No scientific proof. Just my performance on the road and off.

 

[oldballs]

Thanks hube2 and ford850.... et al.....Those explanations make sense to me. Now.....guess I'll try some Howes......Guess I'll have to go looking for it locally first. Don't think that I have ever seen it at the places that I shop. Even Walmart stocks PS.

Cheers,
Mike

 

[oosik]

Gee Whiz - I've used PS White jug for over 20 years in my first tractor with no problems. It's going on eleven years of use in my 2009 Kubota M6040 with no problems. I use it in the diesel fuel - year round. I'll grant you - there could well be a better product out there but PS has done everything I need.

 

[hube2]

Gee Whiz - I've used PS White jug for over 20 years in my first tractor with no problems. It's going on eleven years of use in my 2009 Kubota M6040 with no problems. I use it in the diesel fuel - year round. I'll grant you - there could well be a better product out there but PS has done everything I need.

This is my first diesel tractor. I chose to PS after reading about it hear and people that have been using it for many years. If others have been using it for a long time without issues then I'm not concerned about it hurting anything and if there was a big issue with it I doubt it they would still be selling it. Would be a bigger issue if I ended up with jelly in my tank. I have a case of the silver (32oz bottles) and a case of the white plus 1 bottle of 9-1-1 that I hope to never use. I should have enough to last me years, and I do plan on using it year round. Nothing that I've read or discovered has me worried.

 

[RickB]

Even Walmart stocks PS.

Cheers,
Mike

Walmart stocks whatever sells. Brand recognition and price point beats function and quality every time.

 

[Redlands Okie]

Opti lube and howes are easily found here at auto part stores.

 

[Peter 315]

Any truck stop service station will have it also.....

 

[oosik]

I went to PS after one incident. Half way down my mile long driveway and the fuel turned to Jello. Quick thinking - portable generator and my wife's hair dryer.

That taught me three things. Do I REALLY need to use the tractor when it's that cold. Use PS or equal - year round. I bought a commercial heat gun.

 

[oldballs]

Yeah oosik...........i'm getting so old that the very cold of winter gives me second thoughts about the need to deal with the outdoors. One time I even had to fire up the torpedo kerosene heater to thaw out the chain saw so as to be able to pull the start cord. Don't think I'll try that again.

Cheers,
Mike