PT1445 20 hrs, Lost steering!

[SnowRidge]

A low hydraulic oil alarm (loud) or automatic shutdown would be ideal. It wouldn't be terribly hard or expensive to do, if Power Trac built it in in the first place. Since they didn't, it would require the hassle of cutting into the tank to mount the float switch, not to mention the research required to find just the right switch and mounting method for the job.

Out of curiosity, does other hydraulic drive equipment typically come with something to prevent damage from or warn of the loss of hydraulic fluid?

 

[ernemats]

I have no idea how the hose got pinched, there is not any slack. The hose had a plastic cover over it and it could have been from some problem before I purchased it and finally just sprung a leak. The machine had been used pretty hard by the condition of the tires and rims, (cuts in tires, rims dinged and bent and tubes in all the tires)

 

[toy]

Went from bad news to worse news..
Did not spend Monday working on the tractor as planned because I had some other business to finish up. Today however, I dug into the PT1445.
Using all of the advice from this forum, I checked the oil level first - and got the bad news right away. Not a drop of oil remained. Thanks WF for recommending a flashlight otherwise I would not have been able to see in.

So I am ordering replacement pumps, valves, hoses, the works because the parts are cooked. Going to work on it again next week. Went from a 3 hour estimated repair, to at least 8 hours, and a lot more money.
Now I have to come up with a way to prevent this catastrophic failure from occuring again.

This has been a painful lesson in a lot of ways. Will post photos from the repair surgery.

In one of your posts you said that you had already ordered two cylinder jacks for the steering and I assume that you have had replacement hoses made up and bought replacement fittings. I wasn't there when you had your break down so naturally I don't know all the details , but don't make your repair more expensive than it has to be. It is not a good idea to run the pumps without oil and is quite possible a destruction of the pumps but not necessarily. The valve banks takes what oil is sent to it and if they don't get enough oil to do work then there will be no work done by them, but I don't believe they will be hurt. If it was me I would get me one of those squeeze bulb pumps like you fill up a keroseen heater with in case I needed to pump the oil back out of the oil tank. I would replace the busted hoses and broke fittings , I would hook up the steering cylinders and then hook up the hoses to them I would fill the tank up with oil and I would try to purge the air out of the lines according to the directions for purging the air out of the lines to the pump and filling the pumps back up, and if they pick back up and purge the air out then I would check the oil level again and add oil if necessary and all the while you are doing this making sure you don't have any other oil leaks and fixing as necessary. The pumps is what would be destroyed by running it without oil, but I have seen machines cavitating for oil and when the oil tank was replenished then all worked fine. If the pumps are then working it might take a little time for the pumps to fill your cylinders back up, and you need to keep a tab on the oil level as you do this. If after doing this you see that your pumps are not picking back up then pump the new clean oil back out of the tank and back into the clean containers that it came in and then you can worry about replacing the pumps. I am sure that it running out of oil wasn't good for it but I wouldn't imagine that you ran it very long before you turned it off and you just might be lucky and get by with a cheaper repair, I surely do hope so. I am sure others have other ideas on how to check this out that might be simpler or can at least word it better than I have but I sure do wish you the best of luck in your repair. If my suggestions sound nutty then disregard but I hate to see you spend money that you don't absolutely have too. Keep us posted.

 

[toy]

By the way if you do use a squeeze bulb pump you might have to add a little longer hose to the suction side to be able to reach the bottom of the tank, but if you do pump out what you can before adding the extra hose and add the hose and strain the last oil that you pump out.

 

[SnowRidge]

I'm with Toy. Make sure the stuff is bad before you replace it.

I lost a steering line on my CUT a few years ago. It has a small independent hydraulic system for steering. Despite running for a minute or two without fluid, the steering pump still works fine.

The drive pump is part of a lossy closed loop system, with a charge pump to make up for the losses. From you description of events, it sounds like your drive system was still functioning properly when you shut it down.

The tram (drive) pump is the most sensitive and expensive pump in the system. There most likely is still oil in the closed loop, so it may be OK. The other pumps may be OK, too. Check before buying new ones.

 

[J_J]

Just a little extra bit of advise. Once you get all the hoses on and fill the hyd tank, disable the engine from starting. Now, run the started to slowly fill up all the cavities in the system. Enable the engine, and start and let run at idle, turning the steering wheel lock to lock about 4 times. Then do the lift and tilt thing several times. As far as the tram pump, if you didn't drive to far after the break, the charge pump would already have been trying to replenish any oil that was lost in the closed system, for whatever reason. Drive slow for a while, and just evaluate everything.

 

[SnowRidge]

Be sure to purge any air out of hydraulic filter and the tram pump using the starter. The procedure should be in your manual, if you aren't familiar with it.

 

[woodlandfarms]

I am of the ilk that the reason 1445's hoses got ruptured was that the cylinder broke free and the hoses got pinched when in free fall. Looking at the damage, I might infer that the 45 degree connector on the rear of the cylinder caught the other hose, then snapped off completey in the bind

1445, I also concur that you should refill, prime and try the tractor out. You said the engine started to stall, so I wouldn't hold my breath, but I am sure those pumps are two to 3K, and money is tight these days.

If the pumps are indeed shot, this may be a golden opportunity to make some upgrades if you can find a few hundred more at the most.

You can now take that top plate off your tank and install all sorts of goodies.

I would want a low oil alarm (I have had the same issue as you, but got lucky cause I saw the oil on the road and immediatly shut down).

I would install a digital thermometer

I would install a tank magnet

I would install a Tiny Tach

I would install a fuel shutoff valve (to get to the pumps, you have to remove the fuel tank).

I would look to reconfigure both the deutz intake filter and the exhaust, it may mean moving the primary oil filter but hoses will be undone anyway. You say you have clogging issues with dust, I bet your airfilter takes it on the nose.

I would add a control lever or new circuit for the lock/unlock mechanism (so you don't have to bend over, you said you have a 4n1, right?)

I would spend all your money buying a nice sportscar and touring some exotic island with it ;-)

Good luck with all of this. BTW, this is not a field repair anymore. I would really suggest getting it into the barn. Towing / moving your PT might take some special concerns so read your manual or ask terry first.

Carl

 

[J_J]

1445,

Just a little curious. How far away from where you were working did the PT crap out. Do you realize that the steering pump at 2 to 6 GPM, can probably empty out your tank in about 6 min. Somewhere there is a lot of fluid, or a trail of fluid.

 

[MossRoad]

Out of curiosity, does other hydraulic drive equipment typically come with something to prevent damage from or warn of the loss of hydraulic fluid?

I had a late 70's IH2500B that was HST. It had a warning light if the hydraulic pressure got too low. I do not know if it had an oil level alarm, though.