Generator pto generator

[amashinga]

I am looking into a pto generator as we start moving into winter. The best option available seems to be the northern tools generator

One issue I see is that I have a ford 1100 which is rated at 13hp but there seems to be consensus on 2hp for every Kw for a pto gen. In the past I have never found that little shibaura engine to struggle with anything, but I wonder if anyone has any experience with a similar situation, or any opinion on matching this gen to a 13hp tractor.

 

[RobJ]

First up, I just never have seen the appeal of a PTO generator. JMHO.

But around here you can get a stand alone gas model in the same size and price. And you won't lose the lights and heat if you need to plow the drive or go play on the tractor.

Rob

 

[Gary Fowler]

You can use a bigger gen set, you just wont be able to load it past the point of your HP. Standard rule is 1 Horsepower will produce .746 KW max load. If you have 13 PTO HP you could use a 10KW gen set continuous rating which would be more like 12.5 surge.
Check out this website for some pricing info
http://www.ssbtractor.com/PTO_generators.html

 

[srjones]

I'm not familiar with your tractor, but does it have a different PTO rating than engine rating? (they often do).

Even if so, I think your 13HP engine should be able to handle it just fine. The key thing to keep an eye one is your load. It's good to have a some headroom for surge capacity (like motor startups, etc.) Also, as your load increases you may or may not have to adjust the RPM engine speed to stay within the correct voltage/frequency range. A little gadget like the Kill-a-watt will help with all of that and more.

 

[dogtired]

http://www.ssbtractor.com/PTO_generators.html


I can see something like that to tow to a location and use for short term stuff, like building a barn or such.
I could not see running a tractor at 540 RPM for hours on end to power a home though .

For that I would prefer a stand alone unit as someone else stated.

 

[AndyMA]

You can use a bigger gen set, you just wont be able to load it past the point of your HP. Standard rule is 1 Horsepower will produce .746 KW max load. If you have 13 PTO HP you could use a 10KW gen set continuous rating which would be more like 12.5 surge.
Check out this website for some pricing info
PTO Generators - Power Takeoff Generators / Power Take off Tractor Generators - SSB Tractor

1 hp equals 746 watts. That's not just a standard rule but an exact conversion factor of one measure of energy to another. In reality when you convert rotational energy (pto hp) to electrical energy through a alternator it is not a 100% efficient process hence the 2 hp per kw that some suggest. It all depends on the efficiency of the alternator. Larger well build (expensive) alternators tend to be more efficient.

Andy

 

[windy acers]

I own the northern tool pto generater pictured behind a yanmar 2000 . ran it with the pto in 2nd (2000 rpm )gear for 15 hrs.( 5 gallons of fuel).Ran hot water heater refrigerater microwave tv lites computer. would not run dish washer. did not try furnace. heard it may not handle a microprocesser. It is mounted on a carryall with a square dolley mounted on bottom.

 

[Rara Avis]

You might want to peruse this before buying a PTO Generator...
Tractor-Driven Generators: Producing Quality Power

 

[adlertom]

First up, I just never have seen the appeal of a PTO generator. JMHO.

But around here you can get a stand alone gas model in the same size and price. And you won't lose the lights and heat if you need to plow the drive or go play on the tractor.

Rob

I seem to be finding the same thing here. I thought the PTO generator would be cheaper because there was no separate engine. I also like not having to maintain a second engine, but the economics just aren't worth it. The only advantage I've found so far is if you need a BIG generator. Then, the PTO units start to make some sense.

Has anyone found a small (say, 5000 watts or so), cheap, PTO generator?

 

[RonMar]

You can use a bigger gen set, you just wont be able to load it past the point of your HP. Standard rule is 1 Horsepower will produce .746 KW max load. If you have 13 PTO HP you could use a 10KW gen set continuous rating which would be more like 12.5 surge.
Check out this website for some pricing info
PTO Generators - Power Takeoff Generators / Power Take off Tractor Generators - SSB Tractor

Yep, AndyMA is correct. The term Kilowatt is not used only to represent electrical capacity. It is also used to represent mechanical output. 1HP = .746KW is a direct conversion, and represents mechanical KW. IE, a 6HP engine is 4.48KW of mechanical power. As Andy said, frictional losses in the drive train and the conversion efficiency of the electrical generator make that 1HP to .746 electrical KW an impossibility. For sustainable power output, the 2HP per electrical KW rule of thumb is pretty much right on. This is also seen quite regularly in production generators. As a rule a box store 5KW(max, not surge) generator typically has a 10HP engine. 13PTO HP will get you just shy of 7KW sustained electrical load output.

 

[ampsucker]

great link, paul! thanks for digging that up!

amp

 

[SnowRidge]

great link, paul! thanks for digging that up!

amp

One of the things they point out in that link is the necessity (and absence) of a frequency meter on most of the PTO generators. They aren't cheap, even at Surplus Center. Their $165 model 30-FHXX-14 would be a good one to use. Most, if not all of the gensets we had in the military used that type. They hold up, and they are accurate.

 

[Travelover]

One of the things they point out in that link is the necessity (and absence) of a frequency meter on most of the PTO generators. They aren't cheap, even at Surplus Center. Their $165 model 30-FHXX-14 would be a good one to use. Most, if not all of the gensets we had in the military used that type. They hold up, and they are accurate.

I use a Kill A Watt meter to check frequency - $22

Amazon.com: P3 International P4400 Kill A Watt Electricity Usage Monitor: Electronics

 

[SnowRidge]

I use a Kill A Watt meter to check frequency - $22

Amazon.com: P3 International P4400 Kill A Watt Electricity Usage Monitor: Electronics

I notice they don't have an accuracy specification for frequency. I suspect they omitted it for a reason.

 

[srjones]

The company claims to have an accuracy of +/- 0.2% Some people dispute this claim, but disputes seem to be around current (amperage) numbers, not frequency.

Full disclosure: I own two of these. The nice thing is that you can plug it in the house to monitor frequency.

 

[RonMar]

The Killawatt is plenty accurate for setting your generator output(and pretty convenient also). It is way more accurate than the tractor or standalone engine governor is People tend to get too concerned with frequency anyway. You don't have to have 60.0000000HZ. You don't even get that from the power company. Most providers probably only advertise +/-10% frequency stability. That is 54-66HZ, and unless you are doing nuclear science, it is perfectly fine to keep the lights on. Most electronic devices these days convert it to DC anyway. In fact, about the only way you might notice you are running 55HZ and not 60HZ without a meter is if you have an old plug in analog clock, as the under freq will cause that type clock to run slow... I would be way more concerned with under or over voltage than under or over freq.

I have compared my Killawatt against my Fluke 87 multimeter, and mine is right on, or at least the errors are way smaller than what it would take to concern me For $22-$30 they are hard to beat, and IMO no one who makes their own power should be without one. They are also real handy to determine exactly how much power you need when choosing a generator.

 

[MarkLeininger]

I am looking into a pto generator as we start moving into winter. The best option available seems to be the northern tools generator

One issue I see is that I have a ford 1100 which is rated at 13hp but there seems to be consensus on 2hp for every Kw for a pto gen. In the past I have never found that little shibaura engine to struggle with anything, but I wonder if anyone has any experience with a similar situation, or any opinion on matching this gen to a 13hp tractor.

I have the 13KW version of this PTO generator from Northern, I run it on a 27HP engine tractor. Works great, our power goes off a lot. I chose a PTO rather than standalone generator because I use the tractor all the time, so I know it will run when I need it. If I bought a standalone I'd have to run it every once in awhile and keep the fuel fresh, one more thing I'll be kicking myself over not doing when it's -20 outside.

 

[jbman45]

I own the northern tool pto generater pictured behind a yanmar 2000 . ran it with the pto in 2nd (2000 rpm )gear for 15 hrs.( 5 gallons of fuel).Ran hot water heater refrigerater microwave tv lites computer. would not run dish washer. did not try furnace. heard it may not handle a microprocesser. It is mounted on a carryall with a square dolley mounted on bottom.

I would love to see the pic of your setup, carryall/dolly, but it may not be there since it's an older post. can you send another photo? thanks....

 

[Soundguy]

I am looking into a pto generator as we start moving into winter. The best option available seems to be the northern tools generator

One issue I see is that I have a ford 1100 which is rated at 13hp but there seems to be consensus on 2hp for every Kw for a pto gen. In the past I have never found that little shibaura engine to struggle with anything, but I wonder if anyone has any experience with a similar situation, or any opinion on matching this gen to a 13hp tractor.

Even though Gary gave you the theoretical 'perfect' KW conversion from hp.. it' just don't happen in this non perfect world.

About 2hp per generated KW is a great rule of thumb.

I thinkt he NT 7kw genhead is a great match for your machine.. It means that you will likely not overload the head.. and.. if your machine dino's out higher than rated hp.. you might even be using the head to full potential.

I have the northern 12.5kw head.. love it.. put it on a 3pt carry-all.. I've taken it out to my farm property to run power tools and power up the well before we had power out there.. has powered my place during hurricanes.

As for the detractors that don't like pto gens because the power has to be off while the tractor is playing.. keep in mind that during an emergency.. most of the time you do not need 24/7 power.. but rather will be doing a duty cycle to keep the refer's cold, and well pumped up.. etc.. etc. Who wants to live next to the guy with the genny running 24/7???

frequency meter's can be had cheaper than are posted here..

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

I seem to be finding the same thing here. I thought the PTO generator would be cheaper because there was no separate engine. I also like not having to maintain a second engine, but the economics just aren't worth it. The only advantage I've found so far is if you need a BIG generator. Then, the PTO units start to make some sense.

Has anyone found a small (say, 5000 watts or so), cheap, PTO generator?

In my area you can't touch a dedicated gen the same capacity of a pto gen for the same price.

soundguy