Rear wheel weights vs filling tires

[Gary Sweat]

Sorry about the loss of your Dad, I can understand the sentimental value of your tractor and would have the same concerns myself about taking care of it,
if you are interested in reinforcing the tractor? I can share with you what I did to mine, But with you having already built the FEL you have metal fabrications skills well beyond mine, I'm sure you have already examined the stress area's that would need to be addressed and reinforced and most likely have your own plans underway

I would very much like to see how you did the reinforcing. I know it should be done but am not sure just how to attach it to the rear end so it would be effective. Maybe we should start a new thread so others can watch the build? Then again, they may not be interested....

 

[winston1]

I'm interested, come on with it!:thumbsup:

 

[Gary Sweat]

I'm interested, come on with it!:thumbsup:

Well if deepNdirt doesn't mind putting up some photos and walking me through it, I'll post some pictures as I go along. In fact, anyone that wants to get in on it is welcome throw in some ideas:thumbsup:

 

[deepNdirt]

Well if deepNdirt doesn't mind putting up some photos and walking me through it, I'll post some pictures as I go along. In fact, anyone that wants to get in on it is welcome throw in some ideas:thumbsup:

Back when I did this to my tractor I had post up some picture, I think?
I have been through a couple different computers since then having to backup my Data so I do have the picture on a disk somewhere, was rather simple, You go ahead and start the topic and I'll be looking for the pix and the sketches I had of it, and catch up with you on your next thread,

 

[Gary Sweat]

Back when I did this to my tractor I had post up some picture, I think?
I have been through a couple different computers since then having to backup my Data so I do have the picture on a disk somewhere, was rather simple, You go ahead and start the topic and I'll be looking for the pix and the sketches I had of it, and catch up with you on your next thread,

Since I'm going to have to move the loader hydraulic lines I want to hold off for a little bit so I can use the tractor a bit more. I will start the new thread as soon as I get some work done. Here are some pics of what I have to rework to make room for the welding and steel and the current sub-frame under it. Maybe by then I will have decided on either wheel weights or filling the tires.

 

[Reg]

I'm sure you have your reasons as to not wanting have the bb connected for ballast weight, But I must suggest that using a ballast connected to the rear of the tractor extending past the rear tires not only give traction but also helps to unload weight from the front, think about it for a moment! like a child seesaw the weight is over the center support just as the weight is on the axle of a tractor, the farther back the ballast the more equal the load on front becomes,:thumbsup: however I'm not saying that liquid or wheel weights don't add benefits to traction, They do... but while using a FEL it does help to have a ballast weight on the rear,

Last time I did the arithmetic on this it didn't take much off the front axle for the amount of ballast hanging (not very far) out behind the rear axle.
If you have a fragile front axle maybe you shouldn't be doing loader work with THAT tractor.
Weights have the supposed advantage of being removable, but unless you are young with a strong back you will likely need a tool to help lift them into place, maybe an engine crane ?
100 or so pounds about a foot off the ground to be manipulated into place within a 1/16th or so.

Fluid ballast has the big advantage of taking up space that would otherwise be occupied only by compressed air. It is also weight that is right there on the ground - I'll avoid references to "unsprung weight" out of respect for the other thread that went sour on that (-:

 

[deepNdirt]

Last time I did the arithmetic on this it didn't take much off the front axle for the amount of ballast hanging (not very far) out behind the rear axle.
If you have a fragile front axle maybe you shouldn't be doing loader work with THAT tractor.
Weights have the supposed advantage of being removable, but unless you are young with a strong back you will likely need a tool to help lift them into place, maybe an engine crane ?
100 or so pounds about a foot off the ground to be manipulated into place within a 1/16th or so.

Fluid ballast has the big advantage of taking up space that would otherwise be occupied only by compressed air. It is also weight that is right there on the ground - I'll avoid references to "unsprung weight" out of respect for the other thread that went sour on that (-:

:confused3: what size 2-WD tractor have you?
Reg: I went back to the thread you mentioned and looks like you to disagree with the rear ballast weight helping to relieve stress from the front of that tractor in question, I'm curious to the size tractor you use your mathematics with? we are talking about 1600 to 1800lb CUT size tractors,

 

[Gary Sweat]

Here is what I have come up with just trying to go through all of the possibilities:

Weights - Guessing about 100lbs per side.
Can be made from 1, 2 or 3 pieces since I have (6) holes in the wheels.
I have an engine lift that would be no problem installing or removing.
Would be much easier to fix a flat as they can be removed and tire hauled to be fixed.
Would be much easier to replace the tire.
Will cost more and take longer to get the job done.
Will have to be checked periodically.
Can be increased in weight if 100lbs is not enough.
Not sure if they will effect the axle bearings and seals since the wheels are reversed?

Filled - Guessing about 80lbs per side on 22" tires. (May be way off on that)
One time job (unless I get a flat)
Probably get better tread performance and less wear on tires.
Seems to be (so far) the preferred method. (Maybe due to weights being harder to find or fabricate?)
Tire shop has told me they charge more for breaking down filled tires.
May be more stable than weights? ( I don't know at this point)
Can't increase weight if I need more.
Somewhat of a pain to drain and refill if needed.

 

[Reg]

:confused3: what size 2-WD tractor have you?
Reg: I went back to the thread you mentioned and looks like you to disagree with the rear ballast weight helping to relieve stress from the front of that tractor in question, I'm curious to the size tractor you use your mathematics with? we are talking about 1600 to 1800lb CUT size tractors,

My tractors and their dimensions are irrelevant.
I think the "hang something heavy on the 3 pt hitch to relieve the load on the front axle" is bogus.
If the loader is appropriate for that tractor there should be no "need" to load relieve the front axle - that is about the bottom line.

Yes, you can regard the rear axle as a pivot point, and
Yes, the bucket and it's load is cantilevered out in front of the front axle, so it's load on the front axle is multiplied maybe 140%.

BUT ! hanging even some large number of hundreds of pounds off the 3 pt a SHORT distance behind the rear axle provides very little load relief for the front axle.
IOW, it would only be necessary for tractors with known fragile front axles - and if the front axle is THAT marginal... maybe use a smaller bucket, or use a different tractor for the loader work.

 

[deepNdirt]

so basically what your saying beside repeating yourself is! you have no Compact tractor and never have had the need to improvise to make your tractor perform in a way to work better, One thing you must know is, our Compact tractors are strong built small tractors although can do task well beyond what some people would expect from a tractor tractor this size, However by them being so lightweight can limit us to certain task for the lack of traction, example: just as a race car enthusiast will do to cars to gain faster and better performance we can make improvements to our CUT tractors to allow them to perform better and more efficient and weight added to the rear happens to be necessary for such a lightweight tractor, given one with a FEL means even More weight is needed for the rear, Your argument seems to be that weight added further past the rear wheels connected to the 3-pnt lift has no effect in helping to relieve the load from the front,....................
Well I also read back a thread where a trailer was being discussed over and you chimed in for the sake of argument.....
Let us use a trailer as an example: I have a dual axle trailer estimated 1800 lbs, unloaded.... 500 lbs of which is tongue weight, So! I add 600 lbs of cargo in front portion of the trailer approx 4 ft in front of the axles and 4 ft. rear of the tongue this puts the load about Halfway between the tongue and axles, I approximate half of 600 lbs (300) is on the axle and the other half (300) is on the tongue, this now gives a total tongue weight of 800 lbs, This could be considered cantilever weight to the front of the axles, Correct! OK this is the fun part of figuring, my trailer has no tongue jack and I need to unload the trailer and cargo from the hitch of my truck and have no way to do so, I cannot not physically lift 800lb, But Wallah!
I find a stack of cinder blocks and back up to them and start loading them onto the rear of my trailer in effort to lighten the tongue enough to lift it by hand and to Scotch it up and pull my truck away from it, Question is: how much weight from the Cinder block will be needed to unload the weight from the tongue of the trailer? or would you be willing to say that this would not work and would not help to lighten the tongue?