Removing driveway culvert

[kongmen]

I have to remove the 16" by 40' plastic culvert under my driveway so I can lower it in order to move water after I lower the ditch by about 16". The question I have is will it be possible to remove it without destroying it? I'm going to straddle it with the backhoe and scrape off the top fill and try to pull it out. I will also need to find a way to access the property while doing this project. Do any of you think a 3/4" piece of plywood wood allow a car to cross this 16" gap temporally? Any of you who have done this before please chime in with any comments or heads ups. Thanks.

 

[mjncad]

I wouldn't trust a car's weight on 3/4" plywood without some sort of metal or wood beam structure underneath it. The distance of the span will be the biggest determining factor as to how big the beams need to be.

I think straddling the culvert like Slim Pickens did on the A-bomb in 'Dr. Strangelove' is asking for trouble. I envision you having trouble getting your rig back onto solid ground as you near the end of the culvert. I'd remove the cover dirt from a perpendicular position relative to the culvert. Yeah, it's going to mean lots of moving the tractor to align the backhoe up properly. How do you intend to support the culvert as you lift it out of the ditch? 40' is a long culvert, or is it two 20' pieces joined together to make a 40'.

Be careful.

We need more info to help you out.

 

[beenthere]

Don't know the layout, but I'd suggest digging a 32" deep trench along the side (but deeper) of the existing culvert and letting it roll down (or be encouraged to do so) into its deeper position. That may work ok if a new spot alongside is reasonable. Trying to lift it likely won't work, or will require some support within the tube.

3/4 plywood, even if it were 7 or 9 ply, likely wouldn't by itself let you cross the ditch.
Some timbers spanning the ditch with plywood on them may do the job.

 

[CurlyDave]

I would be a lot happier with renting a steel trench plate than using 3/4" plywood to bridge the ditch. Columbus is big enough that they will have at least one company that rents them.

A good backhoe operator can straddle the ditch with no problem. I think you are going to destroy the culvert getting it out. Flat BH bucket with teeth, round culvert. Possibility of ripping culvert with a tooth is very high, if not you won't remove enough dirt . If you aren't sure you can straddle the ditch and get off at the end, you probably can't. You have to be able to lift the tractor with the hoe...

The lowest cost option may very well be to just buy new culvert and install as quickly as possible. You can probably live with your driveway being down for one day.

 

[kongmen]

It's in 2 20' sections. I think having new culvert on hand is the way to go. Township wants to charge me $600 to do this job thats why I was thinking of doing it myself. I wonder if I would be able to reuse the fill thats there or have to order more fill. If I have to buy new culvert and have fill brought in it might not be that much cheaper then what the township wants. What do yall think?

 

[Gary Fowler]

Plastic culvert? I think, no way to get that out without damage unless you dig it by hand. Galvanized steel maybe. You may be able to dig out on both sides of it and then use the side of your BH bucket to kind of rake the top dirt off into the hole if you are a very good operator. One uh-oh an that plastic will be history. A lot depends on what kind of backfill is over it. Sand might be easy to remove, clay or heavy soil would likely be impossible to get the culvert out without damage and you certainly would have to have much wider hole than 16", more like 48" to get it exposed properly. I think the only way to do that would be to straddle the culvert and excavate both sides simultaneously, then remove the top cover, clean the sides and move down a bit, do the same. You would have to be adept enough to move the whole rig side ways to get off the ditch by using the BH to live the tractor and slide is sideways. at the end

 

[RickB]

It's in 2 20' sections. I think having new culvert on hand is the way to go. Township wants to charge me $600 to do this job thats why I was thinking of doing it myself. I wonder if I would be able to reuse the fill thats there or have to order more fill. If I have to buy new culvert and have fill brought in it might not be that much cheaper then what the township wants. What do yall think?

I think I'd give them $600 before they change their mind.

 

[tommu56]

It could be done I dug out my empty unused plastic septic tank and moved it.
with the pipe 40 foot long could you dig one side using the other side (some shoring might be in order) then bridge the gap with something proceed to do the other side.

If you could move culvert 1' down hill dig one section (shoring again?) lower it move it 1' down hill to needed elevation back fill and tamp then do the up hill one using the one you aren't working on.

You are going to need some place for the spoils.
Make sure you power tamp the fill in 4" lifts or you will have problems later.


Unless time doesn't cost you any thing or you can incur the inconvenience of an open trench I would spend the money for the twp to do it.

tom

 

[dave1949]

I have a 16" by 20' plastic culvert that has been moved twice. It's doable, those culverts are tougher than they look.

The trick is to get the material off the top and sides enough to lift them gently with a chain wrapped around one end.

Beenthere's suggestion of digging a deeper trench next to the culvert, then rolling it in is really a good one. Saves you lifting out the culvert and separating the two 20' pieces. Not to mention the money saved over buying new.

Dave.

 

[kongmen]

Thanks for all the feed back. The whole reason I'm doing this is because I put 300' of drain pipe in going to the road ditch out front to drain a big storm water issue and ended up coming out about 1' lower then the ditch bottom. I really don't know where I'm going to go from here. The township board member really wants me to abandon my whole drain pipe project and hire one of his employees (on the side) to come out and put in a 300' swale for $1500 right next to my $1200 (just for material) failed drain tile job. His suggestion is probably right it's just hard to admit defeat and lose out on the money for the drain tile job which includes the purchase of the tractor. The water issue has to be dealt with it gets to within about 15' of the house. The tile I put in consist of 2 6" PVC pipes which I thought would do a pretty good job and they probably would have had I had some pitch to work with. We have had a couple of good rains and the pipes flow but as soon as the ends of them get submerged under water the flow up into the ditch (water don't like to flow up hill) slows considerably. I do have about 90' from where the pipes exit into the ditch and the driveway culvert so I may try lowering the bottom of the ditch 1' up to the the culvert and see if that will help at all. It looks like the ditch on the other side of the drive way is somewhat lower but not much. I don't know why I rambled on like this but I guess just to vent some frustration.

 

[mjncad]

Township wants to charge me $600 to do this job thats why I was thinking of doing it myself. If I have to buy new culvert and have fill brought in it might not be that much cheaper then what the township wants. What do yall think?

Now that we know more; I'm inclined to pay the township $600 to do it, and if they screw-up, it's their responsibility to fix it.

The township board member really wants me to abandon my whole drain pipe project and hire one of his employees (on the side) to come out and put in a 300' swale for $1500 right next to my $1200 (just for material) failed drain tile job.

And how much is the board member's employee going to kick back to the board member for this side job? That part sounds fishy to me.

 

[juliefilm]

Hello All!

I just happen to notice your posts concerning your gravel driveways and replacing culverts.

I don't have a gravel driveway myself but just so happen to be working on an episode for Disaster House (airs on DIY network), "Gravel Driveway Disasters".

The premise of the show is we recreate accidental or natural home disasters to a house that was slated for demolition. We then bring in construction experts who show our viewers how to prevent or fix said damage.

Im in search of a real life GRAVEL DISASTER STORY that was visually documented (photo or video) with the homeowner willing to share the story.

It can be random, funny, awesome, or just plan disastrous!!!!

Thanks!!!!

Julie

 

[DJ54]

I believe the first thing I would do, is see if you have enough fall to drain the water. Do you know anyone that have a level, or transit..?? A simple Lock Level, and folding rule, or tape measure will do the job. You'll need to see how far beyond the culvert you'll need to go, to let it to drain properly. 2% of fall is sufficient.

If it's a smooth bore pipe, they can be moved. You can straddle the pipe, clean off the top within an inch or so, then offset yourself enough to dig down past halfway of the pipe. You need to relieve the side presure at the widest point. It may take some handwork to get it fairly clean. When totally exposed, put chain around an end, and gently lift. If it is the bell type connection, it should pull apart, lifting up. Just be careful of the rubber gasket. When reassembling, use some spray on vegetable cooking spray as a lubricant. Take the hoe, and push back together gently. Use a solid object to buck against. Tree, post, etc.

Digging beside it, and letting it roll in lets material on the lower side fall in the hole, and not have a level bottom of the ditch. Twice as much work, trying to clean it up, with the pipe on top of it.

Also, remember you will be shooting grade for the invert (flow line) of the pipe, not the O.D. With a 16" pipe, I'm guessing 1 1/2" to 2" walls of the pipe, so you will need to go that much deeper where the pipe will lay.

Just guessing here, but where you live, I'm betting thye specified 67D, or 304 Limstone over the pipe. Should be fine for reusing, although if the pipe was just put in th ditch, then covered, you may get a lot of dirt mixed in with the clean limestone backfill. As mentioned be sure to tamp it back in in lifts. You'll have an extra wide hole to allow a plate tamper alongside the pipe.

Under highways, we put sand around the pipe, and covered about 1'. Then flooded them with LOTS of water. You'll get approx. 98% compaction when the water soaks out. then you can cover with limestone, and compact. Doubt they let you do that though... They wouldn't let me do that, just south of you in the next neighboring county....

All in all, if you don't have your own hoe, renting a steel plate, and other costs incurred, $600.00 isn't all that bad, by the time you figure it all up. And in the big picture, if it doesn't drain properly, it's the Townships baby...

 

[Fixemall]

Hello All!

I just happen to notice your posts concerning your gravel driveways and replacing culverts.

I don't have a gravel driveway myself but just so happen to be working on an episode for Disaster House (airs on DIY network), "Gravel Driveway Disasters".

The premise of the show is we recreate accidental or natural home disasters to a house that was slated for demolition. We then bring in construction experts who show our viewers how to prevent or fix said

Julie

Julie,
Silver Creek NY had several ponds blow out over the last couple of years due to high rains, I would do some research on that.

 

[Fixemall]

I think I'd give them $600 before they change their mind.

That is some sound advice, I charge $375 just to bring a compact on site, $750 for an excavator and $500 for the backhoe.

 

[Xkvator]

i see this is a post from 2010...jobs probly been done...

plastic culvert can be lifted out, once you dig along side and remove the fill on top...
i use a length of 4"/6" I-beam as a spreader bar...4 slings spaced evenly over 20'

if you have a foot or so of mud in the bottom, it can be a problem...sometimes you can get the local vol. fire dept. to hose it out for a donation...