Riggin' for steep slopes

[wasabi]

Riggin\' for steep slopes

Anybody have any proven ideas for safety rigging a compact to make it more stable on mountain slopes that approach 40 degrees in places. I've heard of filling tires with glycol, adding lower weights and/or widening the wheel base, all of which make sense to me...also, while we're on this topic, are there some rigs that make more sense for such customization than others. Thx, Sabi

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

any thing you can do to lower the center of gravity is good
water or gygol in the tires is good up to a point you only want the tire 1/2 full at max
suitcase style on the front end will help keep the nose down if your pulling a implyment up hill
if its realy steep you might want to think about gettign a track conversion kit

 

[ecard]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Another possibility is to add duals to your tractor. Here is a link
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.unverferth.com/wheelsys.htm>http://www.unverferth.com/wheelsys.htm</A>

Eric

 

[bubenberg]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

wasabi, hi
i am originally from the bernis oberland (Switzerland) and my father worked for Aebi. my first education was in mountain farming and one thing that both the eng. at the agricultural faculty & my dad taught me is that you can make a machine do all kinds of things on the side of a mountain. lower the point of gravety, add more wheels in with and more axels, put stuff in the tires ... BUT ....what everybody is forgetting on this disc. site is the OIL LEVEL. if the engine is not made to have a high enough oil level when you are on an incline (not even all POWER TRAC machines are certified to go over 20%) the lubrication stops and your eng. lifecycle is reduced or instant brakedown can occur.

 

[keeney]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

I recall a post where somebody had put together an under-slung belly weight for their machine (I couldn't find it again, though).

If you are not planning to us a mid-mount mower, hanging the ballast down under the machine would be a good choice.

- Rick

 

[MarkV]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Wasabi,
I have been following your tractor quest and am also familiar with the Casiers area of NC. It is just beautiful up there but as you have said it can be steep. Realistically, in my opinion, there is a limit to what a compact tractor can do on steep ground. The general rule of thumb is 15 degrees for side slopes and 30 degrees for going up and down a slope. Exceeding 15 degrees on a side slope just plain scares me to much to do it. I have gone up and down some slopes I think exceed 30 degrees but don’t like it. I use my tractor in the N. Georgia mountains so have some idea what you are up against.

There are several things I would look for to set up a mountain tractor. Unfortunately some of them will not be regular dealer options and that equates into money. I would want a tractor of at least 30 hp with an HST transmission and 4x4. My 21 hp can lack the power for some grades except in the lowest gears and would not make some of them at all with out 4x4. I would look for weight (more is better) and the widest stance I could find. Filling the tires with liquid ballast made a big difference for me. If you can spare the ground clearance a smaller wheel and tire combination would lower the center of gravity. This would be an after market option. I would also have a FOPS type of 4 point roll over protection system made. A heavy skid plate will add weight down low as well as offer protection.

These type of modifications are pretty common with state and county mowing crews and may be a place to get information in your area. With out knowing your property it is hard to say but I had a dozer cut some “tractor trails” allowing access through some of the steeper areas to the more reasonable area.

Good luck in your quest.

MarkV

 

[MarkV]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Bubenberg,
That is a very good point you make and there is now question Switzerland has some mountians./w3tcompact/icons/eyes.gif

MarkV

 

[Egon]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Are you talking about terrain like this?

Egon

 

[bubenberg]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

not in the eternal snow but at 9-12,ooo feet and rather steep, very much so. your picture is one major valley over in Valais or Wallis. the next mountain range is already in france and italy

 

[Darren]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

My father rolled a 14hp Bolens lawn tractor years ago. After that I pulled the rear tires off and took them to a tire dealer that serviced construction equipment. They hand packed the tires with lead oxide powder.

In those days the stuff was put into loader tires to increase traction and lift capacity. The tires went from weighing about twenty lbs each to 150 lbs each. A renter used the little Bolens to mow a couple of acres. He used to pull the thing into the garage and lift the rear to scoot it over to the wall.

After I had the tires filled unknown to him, he couldn't budge the thing. He figured he was getting old and weak. You should have seen the look on his face when we told him the lead added three hundred lbs. to the rear. He had gone from dead lifting one hundred or so lbs. to over four hundred. After the tires were filled that Bolens would go like a goat. I drug trees out of the woods with that thing you wouldn't believe. I think the EPA put an end to using lead oxide in tires.

Before I took delivery of my Kubota I had the dealer send the tires out to be foam filled. It took two people to upright one of the rears. One of them got away from a guy in the shop as he was trying to roll it. It ended up pinning him in a corner. He couldn't budge it. The others had to get it off the wall to release him. Foam filling makes a tire flat proof and adds a lot of weight. I haven't had any problems on the slopes here in West Virginia.

One disadvantage is I'm running ags and you don't to want to run them across a lawn. The extra weight really makes them dig in which is great when that's what you want.

 

[MarkV]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Darren, do you have any idea how the weight of the foam you used compares to liquid fill? I have also heard that some foam can create a rough ride. Have you found that to be the case in you situation?

MarkV

 

[GregGG]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Hey kinda off the subject (but not much). I was wonderin' if you could tell me what my tractor tires are filled with. It looks green like antifreeze and I always assumed it was, but I wanted to see if I'm right. If it is antifreeze, do you know if there are any negative affects of that vs. other methods. One nice thing I noticed is that there is a puncture, and it looks like someone slapped some green gum on it 'cause the antifreeze (?) had gummed up and formed a patch. also you can imagine my suprise when I went to check the tire pressure just to get my electronic pressure gauge full of slippery green stuff. I couldn't really tell from the smell and I didn't want to let anymore out to see what it smelled like.

 

[MarkV]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Greg, it sounded like antifreeze to me until you talked about it stopping a puncture. I just don’t know if it would do that or not. On the down side, if it is the normal antifreeze you use in the car it can be very bad for animals if it were to leak. I believe it will kill vegetation in a big way also. There is environmentally friendly antifreeze that is much less harmful and that is what I used when filling my rear tires.

MarkV

 

[GregGG]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Yeah, I found it hard to believe that it plugged up a puncture, but I'm not about to complain! Nor am I about to pull off the glob to see what the puncture looks like. I am sure it's the old poisionous type, because it had to be done before we got it, which was three years ago, and the previous owner said all he didn't do any mods to it. How would I go about draining and filling them, I am clueless on how to fill tires with anything but air.

 

[mikim]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

I was going to fill a lawn tractor tires with foam but was advised by a small engine mechanic that it could cause damage to the transmission/transfer case? --- whatever it is that drives the wheels and makes it go -- (I ain't a mechanic)
If this brain trust says it ain't so - I may yet do it. My mother-in-law (77 years young) keeps 10 acres mowed using 2 lawn tractors - she runs one in the a.m. til it gets a flat or overheats - then runs #2 in the afternoon. We have a lot of mesquite thorns out there and she gets flats on a real regular basis - tires are full of plugs she puts in. -- I hate working with her - she can outwork both me and the brother-in-law.
mike

 

[WVBill]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

GregGG:

It might be this stuff: Slime</font color=green>

 

[Bird]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

I ain't a mechanic either, Mike, so I don't know, but I don't see how filling the tires with foam could cause any problem. My brother rolled the front tires off the rim on his Cub Cadet Yard Bug so many times, he had them foam filled and never had a problem. I suspect your small engine mechanic just didn't know what he was talking about, or didn't know what the foam is, but of course that's just an uneducated guess on my part./w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[Darren]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

Mark, I checked and what I came up with after talking to one dealer was:

He didn't know what the urethane foam weighed.

He did have some weights of tires filled with liquid as compared to foam. By my calcs water filled is about the same as foam if both tires are filled completely. The practice is to fill a tire with liquid only up to the top of the rim.
I believe that's to get the optimum weight distribution (low).

A foam filled tire is completely solid. Otherwise you'd end up with a tremendous out of balance problem as the foam filled section rotated. Because of general practice the same size trie filled with foam will always weigh more than one filled with water.

The other kicker is that foam comes in different weights. The simplest and cheapest solution for you is have the tires filled with liquid. The other potential problem is foam can destroy a tire with a weak sidewall.

 

[bubenberg]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

slime saves us alot of money each year in tire repair. i found out from my kuboata dealer's maintenance supervisor, that he is using it with his atv's and has suggested it to some of the farmers around here, that move fields with multiflora bushes.

 

[b249]

Re: Riggin\' for steep slopes

I would seem that filling a tire solid w/ foam would cause a slightly rougher ride as the ability of the tire to compress under load is removed. EX. with an air or partially filled liquid tire going over a vertical curve (also read "bump") the tire is able to compress slightly thus absorbing some of the shock. The compressabiltiy (to me anyway) would be removed when the tire is filled w/ a solid foam (or even filled completely with a liquid).

I'm going on a limb here but I would guess that any type of solid filled tire (or attached wheel weight for that matter) would negatively effect the transmission as this may change the rotational enertia specs that the trans. was designed around.

Just my thoughts.

p.s. my dealer filled my rear tires (to the valve stem w/ the stem at "12 0-clock" with "beet juice".

b249