Robotic Following Cart to Replace Light Duty Tractor Tasks?

[aczlan]

I dont know that I would class picking fresh fruit well as unskilled labor. Quickly picking high quality fresh apples quickly without bruising it or mixing in junk is something that takes some talent and I would assume that picking strawberries and other delicate fruit is similar.

Aaron Z

 

[MossRoad]

MossRoad, below are the unit economics I was thinking. Apples might be a bad use case, but in certain crops, if we assume the average worker can pick 500 pounds of produce an hour, and then has to travel 500 feet to a collection point over a 10 hour day, that equates to 76 500 foot trips over a 10 hour day, or about 143 minutes walking per day. Assuming 30 days picking per year, that's around $1,080 dollars in labor.

Are there any crops where those types of economics exist (thinking Lettuce, grapes, other items where there is a lot of picking and then shuttling stuff, but also not a ton of weight concentration like apples where you may thus go to big material handling equipment as mentioned by posters previously)? Thinking things like this perhaps:View attachment 498174

View attachment 498158

It appears that the time accounting in the sheet above only accounts for the pick to collection point. What about the return trip? Doesn't that double the time?

How are you going to account for the picker changing locations while the machine is away?

In your picture of the person harvesting greens, do you think your burro will fit down the isle without damaging the crop?

Just some more things to consider.

 

[candersen10]

It appears that the time accounting in the sheet above only accounts for the pick to collection point. What about the return trip? Doesn't that double the time?

How are you going to account for the picker changing locations while the machine is away?

In your picture of the person harvesting greens, do you think your burro will fit down the isle without damaging the crop?

Just some more things to consider.

Good point, I was just thinking transit time to was a there/back number in the model. I'll have to rebuild it.

Image of progress on more legitimate looking build attached also.

Today's build progress here: http://www.agrbt.com/images/Chassis Build Day 4.mp4

 

[MossRoad]

How's that front/rear? caster going to perform in muddy/soft soils when the cart it loaded?

 

[redman135]

Hullo candersen10, As you are building a 2wd model you are effectively confined to concrete, gravel or flat grass surfaces. The caster wheel means that mud and or slopes will stop you.
Impressions of functionality are in 2wd form you will need to target a green house type market (hard flat surface and fixed routes). For the Ag scene you will need 4x4 and probably in a pivot steer(does not make mud) form as opposed to skid steer.
Given the current navigation limitations you will probably want a light crop like asparagas(pay load limit) with a fixed grid (track) lay out to make this idea work.
The 5 mile range dictates a swop battery system if you aim for commercial buyers.
Instead of trying to replace people, why not look for areas of labour shortage that this machine could work in as an absence of labor in some situations can be costly, so machine price should be less of a factor/ obstruction in purchasing.
Lastly , the people factor. The machine in the video appeared to be inside my personal space and would "crowd me" I think you will need an adjustable following distance. Country bred people have larger "personal spaces" than city bred people.

 

[daugen]

what a wonderful thread, fascinating to me because if the OP thinks her operation is small, well I'm the smallest of them all at 43 trees, not 430 or 4300. But I prune, and pick (new orchard, got all of one apple last year), and spray constantly (coastal NC is a terrible place for an orchard) as I learned growing up on a farm in PA with a fruit orchard. I look at these pictures of material handling huge amounts of apples and I smile and only think "I wish".

A robotic cart is likely to work best in a very controlled environment where the crops are almost planted to take advantage of it. I would go talk to the folks growing veggies in the Central Valley of California and see what they do. Irrigation is very high tech today, with water sensors testing the ground and only applying water when needed. Those who have already invested in high tech methods might be intrigued by this cart, but to make it work, and be cost effective, I think it needs to be integrated into the process. Otherwise a UTV or garden tractor with a big cart would sure handle the small operations, and then those big bins as Aaron has pointed out for the larger operations. If those fruit growers find those bins to be the right maximum size desirable, why would they consider an alternative much, much smaller? I think you might have to skip fruit and maybe consider a much lighter crop like lettuce perhaps? Otherwise 250 pounds doesn't haul much product.

Now that marijuana growing is legal so many places, how about a robotic cart for the greenhouse operations on that seriously expensive product?
I'm only partially kidding...

Now you can always make a rich man's toy. Lots of talking robots and fun stuff out there, something for the Hammacher Schlemmer catalog.
But I think you have sat down at the end of the day and thought you were really wasting time doing certain repetitive motions in your orchards.
The challenge is in most of the US, particularly here, migrant workers come through and do it all for a known fixed cost.
That may be the issue in California also.

I grew up and lived most of my life outside of New Hope, not too far East of you. A difficult area to get good help because none of the teenagers today want to work basically, too busy texting and driving their BMW's. Maybe not quite so bad out where you are but I can understand why you need some labor alternatives. I think the only real benefit of such a lightweight vehicle/cart is that it would certainly tread lightly. Maybe that feature would appeal to some.

 

[daugen]

I also think that if you are required to make this cart as safe as a current Volvo for legal reasons, it will never be sensible.
Amazon has remarkable automated warehouses, employee safety is a huge issue. You just can't have these things running over folks, who
may, for example, have bent over under the sensor to pick something up. I'm a retired insurance underwriter, and believe there is a whole new area of law dealing with these automated devices. If you are going to sell these things versus use them yourself, you also have to get an insurance company to underwrite your product liability. That could be your biggest hurdle.

 

[aczlan]

I also think that if you are required to make this cart as safe as a current Volvo for legal reasons, it will never be sensible.
Amazon has remarkable automated warehouses, employee safety is a huge issue. You just can't have these things running over folks, who
may, for example, have bent over under the sensor to pick something up. I'm a retired insurance underwriter, and believe there is a whole new area of law dealing with these automated devices. If you are going to sell these things versus use them yourself, you also have to get an insurance company to underwrite your product liability. That could be your biggest hurdle.

Good point. Many places with automated transport systems have defined lanes with markings on the floor and people are not supposed to walk in the "road"
That would not be possible in the kind of setting the OP is thinking of.

Aaron Z

 

[daugen]

I have owned a robotic vacuum cleaner, the IRobot I think, and it does its limited expectations job excellently. I love watching it
and analyzing its algorithms for when to stay, when to go, at what angle to leave. All issues this cart would need to deal with.
If I were the OP, I'd buy one of those things and
learn from it. Might help, she may have already done this.

We are all brainstorming trying to help, not nit pick. So far I'm thinking greenhouse operations. Awful lot of petunias grown out there...

 

[candersen10]

I have owned a robotic vacuum cleaner, the IRobot I think, and it does its limited expectations job excellently. I love watching it
and analyzing its algorithms for when to stay, when to go, at what angle to leave. All issues this cart would need to deal with.
If I were the OP, I'd buy one of those things and
learn from it. Might help, she may have already done this.

We are all brainstorming trying to help, not nit pick. So far I'm thinking greenhouse operations. Awful lot of petunias grown out there...

Daugen, thanks for the feedback. BTW, as the OP I am a guy although to your assumption a lot of the people picking on small scale organic operations especially are women.

Our idea today, is simply a cart that records a path and can retrace it going back while doing obstacle avoidance going back. We believe by running the path first for the Burro, the Burro could retrace its steps. The Roomba (at least newer ones) is using SLAM which is not cheap at all to develop, especially in a robust fashion off road. 250lb. payload eases some of the safety issues. The basic premise of robotics to us is that by reducing the size of the product and running it full tilt you have a cost saving (as opposed to having a tractor that has to have great output but then idles or is stationary for extended times).

We have no clue yet if anyone would buy one...advice on how to figure out if the pain point (transport of 60-100 pound bins in multiples of 2-3 for about 250 lb payload over <$1M distances) truly exists in any place? On my family farm it's ubiquitous, but we are also a tiny farm at only 187 acres versus the average US farm at 440. It feels like a pain point, but who has it enough to pay for a solution?