Runaway tractor

patrickg · Apr 19, 2002

Roy, Interesting thread, huh? I guess I will have to check to see if my Kubota has a seat interlock switch. It is HST and so far I note that it won't start with PTO engaged, or the HST pedal out of neutral/centered position. If you really wanted to have a runaway tractor there is a HST hold feature that lets you "lock" the HST in whatever position it is in until you hit the brakes or hit a good bump where it releases and the HST goes to neutral. You would have to be driving along, engage the HST hold feature, and bail out of the tractor. If there isn't a seat switch then it would go runaway till it hit a bump (not long most places around here).

I frequently start the tractor by shoving the clutch down with my hand and reaching across and twisting the key while standing just in front of the left rear wheel and appreciate the ability to do so safely. I also, with the brakes set and locked and tranny in low range, reach in and depress the HST pedal forward or back to jog it a bit to try to alieviate some 3PH attach/detach headache. I don't feel entirely comfortable doing that but all the tractor folks at the dealership do it. I know, I know, what if they all jumped off a cliff...

Patrick

EdKing · Apr 20, 2002

I know, I know, what if they all jumped off a cliff...

It's all in what you feel is a comfortable risk factor. I start my tractor from the ground, much in the same manner you mentioned. I have a gear tractor, personal preference, but if I had a HST I would probably jog it in the same manner you described. I think safety is more a matter knowledge and common sense, than blindly following all the safety procedires described in manuals. I have removed the PTO guards, both from the back of the tractor, and from my brush hog, to facillitate hookup and shear bolt replacement. I would not recomend a new owner do the same, but I feel it is an acceptable risk for me.

jhburke · Apr 20, 2002

It is a matter of knowedge and how much experience you have. If you are easily distracted and only occasionly use the equipment, then you need to use all the protections you can. But if you are careful in what you are doing there is shortcuts you can take with care. Lack of knowledge and inattention has hurt more auto drivers than anything else.

patrickg · Apr 20, 2002

Ed, you got it. A lot of the so called "SAFETY" information is a liability avoidance manefestation of trying to legislate common sense. Right up there with going to a fast food drive up to order a hot cup of coffee and then sueing the vendor when through your own stupidity (hold the coffee in your crotch while driving away) you get burned.

Look at the actuarial tables and US Dept of Labor stats. Farming is one of the most dangerous professions we have. There are a lot of folks hurt by rotating PTO shafts. The response of having PTO guards at tractor and implement as well as "shielded" PTO shafts saves a lot of folks from serious injury or worse. I have seen safety films with interviews of the actual victims of various mishaps. One was a guy who literally got wrapped around his PTO shaft, kerthump, kerthump, kerthump and was nearly killed and on and on ond on.

If you shut off your tractor and wait for the PTO to stop turning before you get down then of course you can operate safely without guards and shaft covers. You might get away with just disengaging the PTO and letting it stop before getting down. Most folks don't have the discipline to wait and can get wrapped up in their work so to speak. Every time some idiot gets hurt doing something insanely stupid, he or his heirs sue someone/everyone and yet more layers of "protection" are added to try to make dangerous rotating machinery foolproof.

Tractor runaways are not always so humorous as the one spawning this thread. It could have run through a crosswalk full of children. Then we would all end up with deadman switches, a lanyard attached to our waists that engages a kill switch if we get more than 5 ft. from the tractor or whatever some politician seemed appropriate.

Patrick

RoyJackson · Apr 20, 2002

Yeah...it's a lot like those morons (including cops) who say "the gun went off by itself".

DVerbarg · Apr 20, 2002

Another possible solution to: with the brakes set and locked and tranny in low range, reach in and depress the HST pedal forward or back to jog it a bit to try to alieviate some 3PH attach/detach headache while maintaining safety would be extendible 3pt links. Used to think they were a cool idea but overrated. Now that I have them, wow, it is so much easier and safer. Just get within an inch or two while on the tractor and then hop down and slide the arms out to the exact position, push them on the pins, hookup the top link, get back on the tractor seat, back up an inch to lock the extendible links and off you go. Sure beats the old, shove the implement, get one side on, jog the tractor to force the implement to turn, get back down and try to bump the implement to the correct position, get a bruise in the process, yada, yada, yada. (I only weigh 135 lbs, in a downppour, not much of a match for a 600lb implement that is sitting on the ground) /w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif.

EdKing · Apr 20, 2002

A lot of the so called "SAFETY" information is a liability avoidance manefestation of trying to legislate common sense.

My sentiments exactly. The ones I like the best are the stickers on mowers, be it a push mower, or a brush hog, that warn you not to put body parts under the deck when the machine is running. Other than small children who don't know better (and who should be kept away from running equiptment anyway) I can't imagine anyone stupid enough not to know better. Evidently there must have been, otherwise the stickers wouldn't have to be there.

patrickg · Apr 21, 2002

DVerbarg, Yeah, and all the bullies at the beach used to kick sand in your face... Well, I am 6'2" and 230 lbs and I have a devil of a time horsing 3PH implements around sometimes. I have a real HD brush hog with 3PH lower pins canted back away from the tractor that really can give me a workout going on or off. I would have bought one of the quick hitch accessories already if: 1. I thought it would fit all my implements, 2. it would be sufficiently robust to not get buggered up when I pretend I am driving a bulldozer in reverse, and not require an expensive part for each implement. Someone here on TBN suggested to a fellow that he use a good long steel prybar so I bought one and it will helo I'm sure but...

I will look into the extendable lower arms for the 3PH for my Kubota Grand L4610HSTC. It would be worth a few hundred dollars to me to not have so much trouble changing implements. I am sort of jealous of the folks with 2-3 or more tractors with different implements nearly permanently on each. My Kubota dealer said he has customers that buy a tractor and brush hog and the only time they take the brush hog off is when the tractor wears out or the brush hog wears out (not need repairs, wears out!).

Patrick

patrickg · Apr 21, 2002

EdKing, A few decades ago I would agree with your comment. " I can't imagine anyone stupid enough not to know better. Evidently there must have been, otherwise the stickers wouldn't have to be there." virtualy without reservation."

Now there is a growing class of folks who will look for an opportunity to sue. If you have a product you make or sell and have a positive net worth you are a target of these EXPLETIVE DELETED leaches and their EXPLETIVE DELETED bleeping bleeper legal counsel. Bleep 'em, bleep 'em all the dirty frenulerating ratchakratchits!

I sorry but I wouldn't sell clinometers to put on tractors without at least 100 million in product liability insurance. Some bozo will undoubtedly crush his hid who was sitting on the fender in a roll over accident and claim it was the fault of the clinometer (TILT METER). Too slow response, not calibrated or redlined for his tractor, insufficient caveats in the fine print.... and on and on. Then there will be a big argument thread on TBN with folks lining up behind the TBN member who makes the meter or on the other side claiming they feel the father's pain and how he deserves a big settlement.

Patrick

jhburke · Apr 21, 2002

I bought a 3 point quick hitch. It works with everything but my rear mower.

patrickg · Apr 22, 2002

jhburke, Several folks have them and are happy. I have a truly HD Gannon box blade with hydraulic raise/lower scarifiers. I use it going forward and like a dozer blade when backing. I build up some speed and smack a dirt pile. Does that sound like a good idea with the hitch you bought?

If I were to get any kind of hitch improvement system, It would need to work with my toughest to hitch/unhitch implements or it isn't really much help. With stuff that is not so hard to hitch up, it doesn't really matter. My hardest to hitch/unhitch implement is one that is off and on the most (yes, and behind my back whether I know it or not the universe is laughing at me). If the hitch "system" doesn't handle the implement from hell, it is a non starter. For me my worst hitch/unhitch task is my brush hog. It is a 6' really HD unit with heavy gauge decking and a lot of square tubing reinforcement. When I get lucky it takes me 15 minutes to hitch it. I have taken over 30 minutes which I think is totally unacceptable. Not bragging, but I am not a small person and I use 2x6 prybars 6-8 ft long. (recently bought but haen't used yet a 5 foot steel prybar. If I were of average height and weight, I might not be able to hitch the darned thing before pooping out on a hot humid day. It is such a relief when I get it on that I hate to have to take it off, but of course, I must.

Patrick

Mosey · Apr 22, 2002

My NH TC29D will start without being on the seat, but it has to be in neutral. I think it’s a very reasonable system. If it’s in neutral, why make me get on it to start it? For example, I was test fitting an old sickle mower that I just bought and needed to raise it up to do some adjusting, so I just walked over and started the tractor and lifted the mower. No matter how many safety features there are, you still have to pay attention to what your doing or you could get hurt.

I do have a funny (now that it’s over) story though. We have a 1940 Farmall A on the farm where I grew up. Many years ago (25+) my brother went to start it. It has to be cranked by hand from the front of the tractor to start. He left it in gear. Have you figured out what happened yet? Sure enough, it started right up (usually did on 1 crank), knocked him down and went right over him. Fortunately, there was no implement attached. He wasn’t hurt at all, but sure could have been!

EdKing · Apr 22, 2002

I agree with you about the lawyers an sue-happy people. Maybe I'm mean or un feeling, but I feel anyone stupid enough to put thier body parts into operating equiptment deserve what they get. Kind of like the Darwin awards, remove the defective genes from the genepool.

RoyJackson · Apr 22, 2002

but I feel anyone stupid enough to put thier body parts into operating equiptment deserve what they get

Amen, brother!

I guess I understand accidents...but to sue because of their own actions or inattention...that is ludicrous.

patrickg · Apr 22, 2002

Ed King, I too enjoy the Darwin awards. I agree that the gene pool could use a little more chlorine. Haven't seen anything similar in decades but once upon a time a long time ago I bought some model airplane glue that had a "not to be taken internally" warning on the label to comply with legal mandate B_U_T went on to say "and we don't know why anyone would want to."

Justice would be to print the warning that says. " Caution the contents of this hot beverage cup could be hot enough to cause tissue damage." Down the side of the cup and continued across the bottom.

Patrick

jhburke · Apr 23, 2002

Patrickg

I bought mine at a TSC farm store. I think I would tear up mine box blade before I would hurt the quick hitch.

patrickg · Apr 23, 2002

JHBURKE, Now that is a good recommendation. Is your "quick hitch" one of those that requires a special attachment be bought and installed on each implement to mate to the even more expensive adaptor on the tractor or the one that goes on the 3PH and mates to each implement with no adaptors? If the latter and it will grab onto all my implements, I'll get one right away. The TSC folks have a satisfaction guaranteed policy and have always treated me very fine so I would have no qualms giving them a whorl.

Oh, one other item... What tractor do you have it on? HP? 2 or 4wd? I've been told that with 4wd my little Kubota is like having about a 70HP 2wd unit.

Again, thanks for the recommendation.

Patrick

centex · Apr 23, 2002

I bought one of the TSC quick hitches for the purpose of using it with the 6' rotary cutter I bought from them and with my box blade. I did this the same day I first hooked up these two implements and decided I had to have the quick hitch. Well, the quick hitch did not fit either of the implements. I could have made modifications to the quick hitch or the implements to make it work but I took it back and learned that it gets easier to hook up the implements with practice.

edt · Apr 23, 2002

Well ed I'm with you I start my tractor from the ground most of the time let it warm up gear always in neutral and brake set when parked I have a long 300