Running Welders off Generators

[dragoneggs]

I think 3000iS has a 230v outlet. Miller Tech said to weld 3/8" with the MultiMatic200 I'd need 7200W. I don't know how the 211 would behave. My pair of Honda EU2000i can weld on the 3/16" preset, but the generator overspeeds to get it going - tells me it's over the limit. I suspect with a single 3000iS you will be in the 14ga range maybe more(?) On 6000W it sounds like you might get to 5/16. A 2nd 3000iS is a lot of money, and another 76 lbs too but they are quiet!

Thanks Sodo... yeah I definitely love how quiet it is and that was very important to me for power outages... not quite portable as your 2000 but I wanted just one for the house and rare off site use. Now that I am welding and could use (wish list) more backup house power... a second one has sounded appealing but should be low on the need list. I never ever see these things on the used market. They are keepers for sure!

 

[Sodo]

I have ran my maxstar (inverter welder) off of two different generators, the way I made sure they were close enough to 60 cycles was hooking one leg of the power from the generator and another leg off of "land" power, going to an incondesent light bulb.

If the cycles are off the light will "pulse" when they are balanced it will function as normal.

Adjust the speed of the engine and go "high" and "low" then set in the middle.

It worked for me and I didn't have to get out an oscilloscope.

Hmmmm. Very Interesting. I would expect that to synchronize two 60Hz waveforms would require a microprocessor control system that makes adjustments to the phase (correcting phase errors far in excess of 60 times per second). I can't imagine an engine (and subjected to intermittent loading) could hold such a steady RPM. Am I missing something?

I would expect that connecting 2 separate sources of AC, that if the phases drifted even slightly out of sync there will be smoke & fire. Are you sure this is possible?

 

[SoGeorgia]

Not exactly the same, but same concept using an incandescent bulb to run generators in parallel.

 

[CNC Dan]

Hmmmm. Very Interesting. I would expect that to synchronize two 60Hz waveforms would require a microprocessor control system that makes adjustments to the phase (correcting phase errors far in excess of 60 times per second). I can't imagine an engine (and subjected to intermittent loading) could hold such a steady RPM. Am I missing something?

I would expect that connecting 2 separate sources of AC, that if the phases drifted even slightly out of sync there will be smoke & fire. Are you sure this is possible?

Possable. But for small homeowner size gensets, not likly.
But the honda inverter gensets have a way to sync two units together.

But you can use the lightbulb trick to compare a gensets frequancy with a known frequancy.

 

[Oliver1655]

My Miller 35 mig welder runs fine on a 5k generator.

 

[Texasmark]

If you are referring to this Mark I can't help you there. My generators are 5500 and 6500w and are magnetic induction...rotor connected directly to the engine drive shaft. My Blue Miller 240v ac-dc stick welder is transformer controlled. I have no problem with the 6500w generator running a 6011 or 7018 in 3/32 diameter.

HTH,
Mark

 

[Sodo]

Not exactly the same, but same concept using incandescent bulb to run generators parallel.

Awesome vid. The segment with the lightbulb next to the O-Scope was great!. Nice industrial gensets, and that dude knows some stuff! However, he did not say what happens if one of the motors has a hiccup, would the phase shift? Or if the motors don't have exactly equal power?

If a 'device' existed to combine the outputs of any 2 'normal' generators that could be a useful item if not so expensive. I suspect it would have to convert to DC, combine and invert back to AC.

 

[Farmerford]

I have an 11KW PTO generator driven by an 18pto hp tractor and have no problem doing maintenance welding with a Miller AC/DC Thunderbolt 300 amp transformer type stick welder with 6010. My standards are not very high, but I don't think any of the welds have failed. Don't recall going over about 200 amps though.

 

[Sodo]

Farmerford, regarding 200A,,, what size rod are you using?

My Blue Miller 240v ac-dc stick welder is transformer controlled. I have no problem with the 6500w generator running a 6011 or 7018 in 3/32 diameter.

Appreciate the data point TXmark, thx for the genuine experience. Miller tech said 7200W (for 1/8 rod, with (150A) inverter welder). Anyway since I need to buy one, I'm thinking that 8000W is a good target for my uses.

 

[Soundguy]

I have an 11KW PTO generator driven by an 18pto hp tractor and have no problem doing maintenance welding with a Miller AC/DC Thunderbolt 300 amp transformer type stick welder with 6010. My standards are not very high, but I don't think any of the welds have failed. Don't recall going over about 200 amps though.

keep in mind that you are likely not getting more than 9kw use out of that 18hp engine. ( yeah, i know. math it out and it's higher.. but real world rule of thumb is about 2hp per kw ). still. 9kw is a good bit of juice to work with.

 

[Shield Arc]

All this money spent on generators to run a welding machine?:confused3::confused3::confused3: $200.00 spent 300-amps capacity.:thumbsup:

 

[Sodo]

Waiting for another one of those to turn up for $200 might be awhile.

 

[SoGeorgia]

All this money spent on generators to run a welding machine?:confused3::confused3::confused3: $200.00 spent 300-amps capacity.:thumbsup:

*DROOOOOOL*

I wish!!!:thumbsup:

 

[Shield Arc]

Waiting for another one of those to turn up for $200 might be awhile.

Not around here. Paid $250.00 for the 1948

*DROOOOOOL*

I wish!!!:thumbsup:

 

[MinnesotaDaveChalmers]

All this money spent on generators to run a welding machine?:confused3::confused3::confused3: $200.00 spent 300-amps capacity.:thumbsup:

While the true finished cost on your machine is "a little" higher than that - small gas engine welders (like the Lincoln weldanpower 150) are often found around $600 or less near me.

For a running stick welder with approx 5000 watt generator, pretty tough to beat

I have one, it's a cool little toy - only $300 for it (it's so small it's almost cute)

....just occurred to me I never tried the little mig on its generator...something for me to play with this weekend

 

[Furu]

All this money spent on generators to run a welding machine?:confused3::confused3::confused3: $200.00 spent 300-amps capacity.:thumbsup:

Yes that is very nice and your bad influence may get me in trouble some day.
It is not as if you don't have one or two or more to spare but you well know why I asked the question.

Of course that question, for me at least, is totally without a purpose now.:thumbdown::thumbdown:

 

[SoGeorgia]

Not around here. Paid $250.00 for the 1948

:bawling::bawling::cryingeyesout:

 

[aczlan]

Awesome vid. The segment with the lightbulb next to the O-Scope was great!. Nice industrial gensets, and that dude knows some stuff! However, he did not say what happens if one of the motors has a hiccup, would the phase shift? Or if the motors don't have exactly equal power?
If a 'device' existed to combine the outputs of any 2 'normal' generators that could be a useful item if not so expensive. I suspect it would have to convert to DC, combine and invert back to AC.

If they are a little out of phase or the current dips more on one, the "slow" or "low" generator will do less work and the other will have to pickup the slack. If they are too far out of phase, bad things happen and the magic smoke gets let out.

Aaron Z

 

[sparc]

Waiting for another one of those to turn up for $200 might be awhile.

Good luck finding one in that condition for $200

 

[jwmorris]

Not exactly the same, but same concept using an incandescent bulb to run generators in parallel.

That is pretty much it but you are not using two power sources just matching a generator to "wall" power. I have only done it with a 3500 watt and 4500 watt generators. I have never had a need to run any of my inverters off of my 30kw power station but if I did I would likely test it the same way.