Should I buy a Kioti CK30?

OrangeAlex · Oct 12, 2005

If you can accept that the L2800 and the CK30 have roughly the same capabilites at about the same price. ~$16k with FEL Putting aside dealer, reliability and resale issues. The CK30 gives you more "nice" features and would be a better buy. A $3-4000 better buy?? hardly. But with the real world, dealer, reliability and resale value/ease of resale are issues. Not sure which one I would go for at that price. Other factors are financing, which last time I check Kubota had a better deal than Kioti. It would be a tough one for ME.

OrangeAlex · Oct 12, 2005

( I think you missed my point about the "dealers" I spoke to. You can even compare MSRP's if you'd like but I'm referring to the quotes I was given by the dozen or so dealers asked. Search my posts about pricing......................

I paid $15,500 inc tax for a CK30HST w/FEL

very much in line with other Kioti quotes that I have seen here )
If I didn't know better I would say you are being elusive. I have done my best to search threads that you have posted. I can't come up with the numbers you got. However, I did see people telling you to compare L2800/L3400s instead of Grand L's (L3130) to be more fair.

Can you do me a favor and tell me which tractor you were comparing to the CK30 and what the price difference was?
I am pretty sure most Kubota dealers will easily quote you at least 15% below list. Which puts a L2800 at around the same price you paid for the CK30.

DrewL · Oct 12, 2005

look........ to the best of my abilities answering your questions. It has been 6 months since I made my purchase and have disposed of my notes seeing as I don't need them anymore. I can tell you this, when I asked a local NH dealer what hp range range I was looking at giving the SAME information to EVERY dealer of my needs, NH was over the $28,000 mark. I asked if he was undersatnding my questioning properly and that's when I got the attitude. Am I supposed to police their responses? That is not my responsibility and if they, who by the way are in the tractor buisness, can't answer a simple question accurately than what am I supposed to do? Again, my point is, if dealers (again, the ones I spoke to...........and I can give you the names if that would help you) choose to pick their customers I can't help them. As a matter of fact, e-mail is a bone of contention of mine. If the dealer is going to have a website with a contact address, answer it. Of the handfull of e-mails I sent regarding info and pricing, ONE replied..........ONE. The models I was comparing to was framed as my lead off question to my search. "I'm looking at the 30hp range HST, can you give me your model that meets this with a price." I see you are trying to question my buying criteria but I left that up to the sellers to provide me with the info. One thing I did know is what hp range, other than that I wanted the dealer to educate me. Many chose not to

OrangeAlex · Oct 12, 2005

I understand what you are saying. You would be surprised how many dealers don't really understand their competition and how they stack against what they have to offer. Or even, how each product they sell differ from each other. Perhaps, I research large ticket items more then most sane people. In that end, I am able to take what the dealer says with a grain of salt and using my background research via the Internet. Ironically, I educated my dealer quite a bit after doing my own research online about cavearts of certain models in their line-up and how they stack to each other and the competition. Strange but true.

To make things worse... manufacturer know people shop HP without knowning what to ask about the rest of the tractor. So we start playing HP games. Large engines bundled on smaller stripped down tractor. However, rest of the tractor does not matching up well with the Engine HP. Just look at the cheap lawn tractors out there that are 25-27HP for $1500-$2000. Yet the more expensive dealer models start at 15HP and don't even approach that kind of HP in their most expesive models costing 3-4x as much. What gives?

I said it once I will say it again. I started out looking at 30ish HP tractors.. I had no other criteria. I went to my local Kubota dealer and was interested in the L2800(28 HP) and L3400 (34 HP). The dealer kept telling me that I really should take a look at the L3130(30HP). I asked now much? He said $4k thosand more then the 28HP L2800 and $2k more than the 34HP - L3400. OK.. so its less HP and more money. yeah.. ok... that makes complete sense to me. Why the heck would I want that overpriced thing when I can have this one over here with more HP and less money. The L2800 was $4000 less with almost the same HP as the L3130. Well 3 months of research later, I looked at Kiotis, JDs, Chinese, and grays. I had a better idea of my requirements and needs and was more than happy to hand over thousand of dollars more for a tractor with less HP. Overall, the conclusion that I came to with all these tractors is -- you get what you pay for so understand what you are getting and how it compares to others. Look at every spec and understand how a large difference may affect you.

When I was done, I knew enough to have them I customize the L3130 quite a bit prior to delivery. I think people on TBN who have been around a while can easily look at my tractor setup which I posted about a few weeks ago, and can easily understand why I customized what I did. Anyhow, it took the dealer quite a while to deliver it because they were not used to people doing so many customizations to their machines. The dealer said, "yes, this one was a bit more challenging.. most people just come in and buy the stock tractor with little modifications. We propose them a stock configuration and they just take it. " Am I unique and insame in what I wanted in a tractor? Maybe. Maybe not. But I like to think I had a thought out reasoning for all the modification that I made prior to delivery and will like have a better chance at not regretting the decisions that I made.

Take a look if you have any interest:
Link

Donnyj · Oct 12, 2005

I believe it is impossible to give you an honest "correct" answer. The CK30 is great tractor if it serves your needs. If the dealer does not serve you well, then the tractor does you no good. As far as the Kubota, Kioti pricing issue............. Well that just goes on and on. Both sides can never agree that maybe someone got a better deal than they did. Both sides accuse each other of lying or misrepresenting info. Time and time again. Really gets old. My Kioti DK45S was over 4K cheaper than a Grand L 3830 Kubota. So what... Who cares? Point is I got what I needed for what was comfortable for me and my finances. I read on here about Kubota's being cheaper in other areas. If that was the case in my area, guess what would be setting in the barn............. You got it. Kubota. Both are great tractors along with many other makes and models. Pricing is so different around the country. Case in point. I bought my tractor for under 18K. Dealer in TN wanted 26K for same tractor!!! Pricing is only one piece of the puzzle to making a level headed buying decision. In my case that piece was a big part of the puzzle as I only had x amount of money to spend. I have no doubts about the reliability of either tractor. Take your time, rent if need be {great idea} and make a informative decision based on your needs and wants. Good luck and keep us informed!
'

IH3444 · Oct 12, 2005

Follow Donny's advice, and try some tractors out. I came so very close to buying a DK45S, and had looked at all the brands. If I was buying in the 30hp range, the dealer that sold Don his is about impossible to beat on pricing. He was 1-2.5K less than all the others. The CK Hydro with the sloped down boom in my opinion wins hands down. Plus the Kioti is so very stout, and heavy built. So what if it followed Kubota on some design, nothing suceeds like success. The Kioti also sports many standard equipment niceties that others consider options, and charge dearly for them. I had to be quite firm in my negotiations to get a rear remote for the TC48 thrown in, although the machine was already low balled to me, and I knew that. You'll find the loader control on the Kioti placed on the fender to be very friendly to your wrist. One more thing to consider that I haven't read, but know about is the fact that Kubota, and Deere have aluminum rear axle cases, whereas Kioti and New Holland have cast iron (steel) cases. The many thermal cycles your tractor will go through in it's life will cause the rear case to expand and contract. The cast iron (steel) cases handle this much better retaining their geometric design tolerances in the long run, as well as being able to absorb abrupt high shock loads. Nuff said!

Highbeam · Oct 12, 2005

I looked at your 3130 Orangealex, nice tractor. Pretty much the same as the CK30 I have less all your fancy additions that I am very jealous of. I can't see why you think the 3130 is any different than the ck30. Please enlighten me. I sat on both and chose Kioti. If the price was the same, I would have gone 3130. Your tractor looks like mine.

Don't be defensive, just the facts please.

This picture is also thread related.

OrangeAlex · Oct 12, 2005

This is EXACTLY why manufacturer's play HP/$ games. People don't care to spend the time evaluating the tractor beyond HP and price. This is funny and very disappointing at the same time.

I spend my time trying to help people make good decisions which are based beyond HP, price and to encourage them to study exactly what they are paying for and why things cost more. And I feel like the message is falling off deaf ears.

Can anyone here tell me why I picked a tractor with less horsepower for more money? Does anyone care? It is starting to look like the answer is "NO". Why the heck does Kubota make 4 different series of tractors all in the 30s HP range??
At the end of the day the answer is still CK30 is the best 30 HP tractor deal. Very sad.

Somebody, please stop the insanity.

Hey.. just go an buy what is cheap, has the most HP and the reliability you think it has. Just, keep on truckin.

Highbeam · Oct 12, 2005

That's what I thought.

I do recall the 3130 had somewhat higher 3ph lift numbers and the base loader was a bit more capable. Other than that, and of course several thousand more dollars and a larger dealer network, I consider the ck30 pretty much the same as the GL3130. I have been wrong before though.

I paid just over 15000$ for my tractor and in the photo I am towing that stump to the pile. I dug it out with the loader.

OrangeAlex · Oct 12, 2005

( I looked at your 3130 Orangealex, nice tractor. Pretty much the same as the CK30 I have less all your fancy additions that I am very jealous of. I can't see why you think the 3130 is any different than the ck30. Please enlighten me. I sat on both and chose Kioti. If the price was the same, I would have gone 3130. Your tractor looks like mine.

Don't be defensive, just the facts please.

This picture is also thread related. )

THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!! I am so happy you care enough to ask.

1. Loader Capacity. My Grapple weighs around 700#.
The L3130 can lift 1870# at the pivot pin. The CK30 can only lift 1155# at the pivot pin. However, the actually lift capacity is even less because the weight is beyond the pivot pin. So subtract maybe another 200#. If you do the math, and subtract the weight of the grapple and another 200# because the weight will most likely be beyond the pin, the L3130 will lift roughtly 970# of junk inside the grapple. The CK30 will max out at around 255#. That is a huge difference. Almost 4x the weight. For all practically purposes the CK30 with the Grapple I wanted wont lift much and the tractor can't do what I need it to do.

2. CK30 FELdoes not allow use of Quick Attach Skid Steer style attachments. So this makes switching out buckets, forks, grapples, a real pain. I have currently have 3 things I currenlty switch out on a normal basis.

3. Tractor stance/stability. I want this to help me on sloped land and to help stabilize the tractor when lifting heavy objects with the FEL. The CK30 Max Rear Track is 51.3" on center. The L3130 is 58.3. That is a huge advantage. Increasing the CK30 track through other means does not help much as the Max FEL Bucket size is 60". The L3130 is 72" Enough to cover the max track.

4. I need to use forks to lift stuff into a loft in my shop. Max loader height at pin. CK30 is 92.5" not quite 8'. The L3130 is 102.4" Almost 10" higher. This also helps with reach into things like brush. 10" more reach.

5. Independant PTO.. dont remember if CK30 offered this or not.

6. Turning Radius. CK30 was 9.5' L3130 8.9' Always nice when you can get around easier and not accidently run over stuff quite as easy.

7. Weight. L3130 Tractor is 300# heavier. Bonus.

8. PTO. 1.5HP more on the L3130. Bonus.