splitter fitting questions

handirifle · Apr 25, 2015

OK so my recently purchased splitter, that had the 3 qt hyd tank is getting closer to being done. I am going to use an old 5 gal propane tank I had laying around, and I am going to put in a 1 1/2" filler tube and cap on it and 3/4" suction line and 5/8" return line. I need fittings for those lines, for the tank, but no one seems to have a clue around here, about what I need.

The existing fittings on the valve are a barbed type but the barb is really a smoothed out bulge in the tube really. More like an automotive fitting. These are the low pressure side fittings. Does anyone know of a source for these?

Also sine talking to the prev owner, he said that he'd recently put on the new Honda motor (I knew that part) and he said the pump went out right after that. I knew that also, BUT you guys got me to thinking, that the small reservoir and no filter might have been the cause of the pump failure.

So! With the said, what's the best way to plum the filter, and a source for those materials as well. Trying to keep costs down on this project. This is an 18K splitter.

LD1 · Apr 25, 2015

3qt tank is definatally too small.

What size is the pump? the suction line sounds small to me. As does the return. 11gpm pump should be ~1-1/4" line for suction and 34 or 1" for return.

TSC sells kits for return line filters. As does lots of places online. I bought my suction strainer and filter setup from splitez.com

As to the fittings. You dont have to use the exact style that is on there. Any barbed fitting of the right size will work.

J_J · Apr 25, 2015

Volume of tank should be equal to or greater than the pump volume.

triptester · Apr 25, 2015

When considering hydraulic reservoirs tank design is more important then capacity. Most splitter manufacturers have hydraulic tanks that are 1/2 to 3/4 the volume of the pumps they supply. Old propane tanks are about the worst choice for a hydraulic reservoir.

J_J · Apr 25, 2015

triptester said:
When considering hydraulic reservoirs tank design is more important then capacity. Most splitter manufacturers have hydraulic tanks that are 1/2 to 3/4 the volume of the pumps they supply. Old propane tanks are about the worst choice for a hydraulic reservoir.

Can you show references for your statement.

It is not good logic or good sense.

The exchange factor used to be 3 to 5 times the pump volume.

What is your logic for a smaller tank than the pump flow?

5 GALLON HYDRAULIC LOG SPLITTER RESERVOIR
Brand new, superior quality log splitter hydraulic reservoir. Constructed of 14 gauge, black powder-coated steel. Push on breather cap. Integral mounting foot on each end. Select a reservoir with usable capacity at least equal to pump flow GPM (e.g. 5 gallon usable reservoir capacity minimum for system with 5 GPM pump). Made in USA.

I see statements like this all over the Internet about tank size.

LD1 · Apr 25, 2015

In an industrial setting, tank size is still 3x pimp flow if no cooler. But two differences between that and a splitter.

1. Designed to run 24/7
2. Flow rating at high pressure.

A log splitter isn't 24/7, and an 11 GPM pump is only 11 GPM up to a listed pressure around 700psi or so. The high pressure flow is much lower.

With a 2 stage pump, rule is 1 gallon for each GPM of high flow capacity. I would want at leat that if you split for several hours at a time.

handirifle · Apr 25, 2015

Why is it everywhere I look at splitters, with 11GPM pumps, rated for 22 tons, they have 6 gallon hyd tanks? I'm no expert by ANY means on hydraulics, but if 6 gallons works for a 22 ton, 5 ought to work for a 18 ton.

Out of curiosity, what makes a propane tank so bad for a reservoir? I am NOT going to spend $100 on a tank for this thing. I have used it hours on end as it is, with it's cheap gas can 3/4 gallon tank that the PO had on it. I have actually borrowed it several times with the current motor and pump. This is not a commercial rig by any stretch of the imagination.

But if by 3 times the pump rate, you mean 33 gallons of fluid for an 11 GPM pump, it aint gonna happen. The fluid would cost more than the splitter did.

J_J · Apr 25, 2015

Rules are rules, but everybody does not go by the rules.

So whatever works for you.

The main problem is heat, so if you can keep the hyd tank fluid below about 180 degrees, you should be alright.

What is the cost comparison between a couple of gal of fluid to a pump, or larger hyd tank.

I doubt that very many people would care if you burned up your pump, but use what you have.

You have been given good info on the merits of more fluid/tank. Just more cooling potential.

Work that splitter in soft wood about 1 per minute using low pressure, and you should be good.

Now start splitting some hard wood and using the relief more than usual, and you will soon see the merits of a larger tank as the fluid will heat up, and thin out and you will lose efficiency, power, maybe speed, etc.

If the splitter is yours, then do what you can with it. .

handirifle · Apr 26, 2015

I would correct that to nobody goes by those rules, not as far as home use splitters. I have never seen one with a tonnage of 25 or less with anything more than a 6 gallon tank. I understand what you are saying and appreciate the info, and do not want to seem ungrateful, but I have to do what I can afford. If I could find a better tank, reasonable, I would use it, but $100 for an empty tank isn't reasonable for me, neither is 33 gallons of fluid.

I can get a new pump for less than 33 gallons of fluid.

J_J · Apr 26, 2015

Why are you using the 33 gal of fluid.

What I said was years ago, 3 to 4 times the pump. No one is suggesting you purchase 33 gal of fluid.

I would suggest pump flow to size of tank.

FarmWrench · Apr 26, 2015

Good tanks, do more than hold and let the oil cool.

They keep water out, not only out but by release of the water vapor the hot oil boils off. And let water stay separate from the oil not being turned in a emulsion (mayonnaise) until it can vaporize away.

Prevent cavitation of the pump. The tank should not let a suction vortex form or otherwise provide air to the pump. This includes preventing air bubbles being put into the oil by the return line.

Propane tanks will work if plumbed correctly.

LD1 · Apr 26, 2015

Just to be clear, whatever tonnage the splitter is claimed to be rated at has nothing to do with sizing the reservoir.

Pump flow and pressure are what decide

muddstopper · Apr 26, 2015

What you need to remember is how much fluid you need to extend your cylinder. A 4in bore cylinderr will take 0.653 gal of fluid per foot of stroke. A 24instroke will take 1.3 gal of fluid just to extend the cylinder. Everything else returns to tank. If your tank only holds a couple of gals of fluid, and you use over half of that just to extend your cylinder, then you are recirculating the remaining .7 gal thru the pumps, reliefs and all the other heat generating parts, 15 times per min with a 11gpm pump. This doesnt leave the fluid much time to give off any heat generated. with that fast of circulation rate, the fluid is spraying into the small capacity tank, mixing with air. This causes foaming of oil and cavatation of the pump. Hot oil, sucking air= pump failure, sooner rather than later. A gas grill tank will hold about 5 gal of fluid. That 5 gal capacity compared to actual fluid needed to make your parts move is about a 5:1 ratio. This is still exchanging the entire tank capacity about 3 times per min, but it does give the oil some time to cool down between circulation. With a tall narrow rectangle shaped tank, the surface area of the tanks sides exposed to the atmosphere is greater than a round tank of the same capacity and will provide more cooling effect for the oil. Double the surface area will equate to a quadruple cooling effect. If your going to use a small hydraulic tank, go for a tall, narrow, rectangle shaped tank instead of the round propane tank. Ask yourself how many round factory hydraulic tanks have you ever seen, and if you have seen a factory round tank, did the equipment also have a oil cooler installed.

handirifle · Apr 26, 2015

I was going to plumb it properly, and with a vented cap, but I see what you are saying about cooling surface. I HAVE BEEN (unsuccessfully so far) looking for suitable donor metal to make a rectangular one.

From what you guys are saying, its a miracle this thing worked with a 3qt the reservoir it has had for years.

triptester · Apr 26, 2015

While I agree that a good designed hydraulic reservoir with ample fluid capacity should be used on a splitter there is always something out there that wants to prove us wrong. Back in the 70's Didier made splitters for John Deere , Sears Robuck , Montgomery Ward, and many others with a 1 1/2 gallon capacity and 45 years later 1000's are still working.

4570Man · Apr 26, 2015

My splitter has some black pipe, barbed fittings, and the high pressure hydro hose. The black pipe, and barbed hose leak. If I was doing it again I would spend a little more and use the high pressure hose for everything. The propane tank should work. The aluminum beer kegs would be better.

handirifle · Apr 27, 2015

triptester said:
While I agree that a good designed hydraulic reservoir with ample fluid capacity should be used on a splitter there is always something out there that wants to prove us wrong. Back in the 70's Didier made splitters for John Deere , Sears Robuck , Montgomery Ward, and many others with a 1 1/2 gallon capacity and 45 years later 1000's are still working.

That looks almost identical to mine. At least before the PO raised it to waist level. My tank looks like that one, but my measurements calculate it at only 3/4 gallon.