Splitting Rock Questions

[Haoleguy]

To complete a vineyard project I have 6-8 large rocks(20-40K lbs each) that are on or near the land surface and in my way. I need to get these split down to ~12K lbs for me to dig them out and/or move them. It appears there are rock demo people in my area. Before I get them over to give me quotes I have 2 questions for this experienced group. First, how many methods are there to split rocks of this size and is there one preferred over others? And secondly, what should the cost be per split or per rock? Oops third question. How long should this take? Thanks for the replies.......Gary

 

[MikeD74T]

Do a search for rock splitting & Egon. He used feathers & wedges. There are links to resources. MikeD74T

 

[Whitnel]

Really two options use explosives or use a hammer (hydraulic or air).
You could have the rock hand drilled and loaded with small charges. When set off they will break the rock up.
Or the mechanical method. The hard way, get an air compressor and jack hammer and start to work. Or the easy way, get a back hoe or an excavator with a hydraulic hammer. These are more powerful and faster.
The main question is do you really need them completly removed? If you got a hoe ram you could demo them 6" to a 1' below the surface then backfill the drive with rock.

 

[Egon]

My experience has been with smaller rocks using an electric SDS Hammer Drill and 1/2in. feathers and wedges.

For the size of rocks you have mentioned consider a much larger commercial type drill and then use "Dexpan" in the hole to do the cracking. Pease note I have no experience using Dexpan but some others here should have.,

Basically you drill a line of holes, 5/8 or 3/4 in. in your case and probably two feet deep???. These should take about 20 minutes each depending on the eqipment. Fill with the Dexpan and wait for it to expand. No idea on the time factor for expansion.

Do a Google on splitting rocks and there should be quite a bit more information on the topic.

I'm thinking you may be into commercial type methods with the size you have mentioned and reasonable time taken into consideration

In my misspent youth in another life I was involved in some road projects that required blasting but those methods are a little different from a small shoot.

 

[leonz]

To complete a vineyard project I have 6-8 large rocks(20-40K lbs each) that are on or near the land surface and in my way. I need to get these split down to ~12K lbs for me to dig them out and/or move them. It appears there are rock demo people in my area. Before I get them over to give me quotes I have 2 questions for this experienced group. First, how many methods are there to split rocks of this size and is there one preferred over others? And secondly, what should the cost be per split or per rock? Oops third question. How long should this take? Thanks for the replies.......Gary

There is another very effective demolition method for stone and concrete that is called Dexpan which is a powder mixed with water that is pored into the drilled hole and expands the rock with massive force to safely breakk the rock or reinforced concrete that needs to be demolished.



whoopsie :0) I was not trying to steel your thunder EGON.
Dexpan® Non-Explosive Demolition Agent, Concrete Cutting Diamond Blades, Core Bits, Granite Cutting Diamond Baldes by Dexpan Diamond Blades

 

[Whitnel]

We tried using the expanding material on a sewer line project once. It did not work very well for us. I am not sure it it was the dexpan product or not, I was not the manager of the project. I do know if you are going to used the expanding material you will need to dig around the rock you are wanting to break. This will give the rock a space to expand to so it breaks. If you don't dig the soil around will be pushing back on the rock helping it stay intact.

 

[DaveOmak]

If you have a lot of time, drill many many deep holes, fill with water, let mother nature freeze and crack the rock.
I'm not sure if we are young enough to wait for the final report on this method.

 

[Egon]

I was not trying to steel your thunder/QUOTE

I got no Thunder. Just a very small meek voice in the wilderness.

 

[Haoleguy]

We tried using the expanding material on a sewer line project once. It did not work very well for us. I am not sure it it was the dexpan product or not, I was not the manager of the project. I do know if you are going to used the expanding material you will need to dig around the rock you are wanting to break. This will give the rock a space to expand to so it breaks. If you don't dig the soil around will be pushing back on the rock helping it stay intact.

Whitnel - Yes I have already dug around most of the rocks. Couple more to do once I have an idea on what the hired rock splitter's needs are. I'll post pictures later to show sizes....Gary

 

[Haoleguy]

So it sounds like a hired contractor would either drill holes and use expanding compound or take a hydraulic hammer on an excavator to the rock....is that what I'm hearing? I'll post pictures later today or tomorrow to show representative sizes.....Gary

 

[Haoleguy]

I've added some pics below that show (1) largest rock, (2) medium rock, and (3) rocks I can manage with rented 14 ton excavator. My JD 5325 is shown in each pic for scale. As I said before I have 6-8 rocks I need to make smaller so that I can move them with excavator....Gary

 

[Whitnel]

Haoleguy,
It looks like you know how to operate machinery pretty good. Why not just rent a hoe ram for a day and break them up your self. Any rental house should have one. Around here a 1,500 lb hammer on a backhoe would be around 300 to 400 for a day before delivery and tax. I rented a takehuchi 175 with a 2000 lb hammer on it for around $800 a day. It was more money but the 500 lb's of difference was worth it.

 

[jwinner]

I'll let you in on a little secret. We use this method to "mine" our way through constrictions in cave passages to find new cave. Get some pyrodex pellets, I think they are .50cal? Anyways they are 1/2" in diameter pellets. Get a long 1/2 SDS+ hammer drill bit and drill. Drill the hole as deep as you want or can. The pyrodex has holes in the center that happen to match up with cannon fuse. Feed 5 or 6 onto the cannon fuse (or 10 or 12), slide them into your hole in the rock. Pack plumbers putty into the hole but being careful not to tear up the cannon fuse. Light and hide behind something. Your rock will be shattered. May have to take it apart in sections....

 

[Haoleguy]

Haoleguy,
It looks like you know how to operate machinery pretty good. Why not just rent a hoe ram for a day and break them up your self. Any rental house should have one. Around here a 1,500 lb hammer on a backhoe would be around 300 to 400 for a day before delivery and tax. I rented a takehuchi 175 with a 2000 lb hammer on it for around $800 a day. It was more money but the 500 lb's of difference was worth it.

Whitnel - Good idea! I'm a bit naive on using the hammer.... how does one choose the size for the job? I assume larger means it can break off larger chunks of rock and make the job faster? My local United Rentals might have the Takeuchi 175 hammer setup you described. I will check with them and compare pricing to having a local contractor do the job. Thanks for the idea. ...........Gary

 

[Whitnel]

The number is the lbs of force the hammer hits with. The higher the number the bigger the hammer.

I would say you can get by with a hammer mounted to a back hoe. Just ask them what size the hammer is. The 2000 lb hammer I got was a bit of an odd ball. It is the only one around Nashville that I know of. The next size up from the back hoe is usually a 5000 lb mounted to a 200 class excavator. You might find a middle of the road you will just have to call around.

This may sound wierd but it also depends on how hard your rock is. Some rock is softer and breaks up easier. Some rock is super hard and takes more time and force to break up.

Here is what I broke up on my driveway when I started with the backhoe.

 

[Carl Bert]

I suppose it works because the gasses expand so quickly that the rock cracks before it has time to expel the putty. If you don't pack enough putty or don't pack it sufficiently it can blow back out the hole. It takes practice - how much pyrodex to use or how many holes to drill or how deep to drill depends on the size of rock, type of rock, and whether you're talking bedrock, or loose boulders. Loose boulders are good, they are much easier to shatter with fewer pellets. If you use too few pellets or try to take too much rock off at once, it will just make a muffled sound and nothing will crack. If you use too much, it's best to be in a safe place, as rock projectiles will fly everywhere. Sometimes we use too much on purpose heh heh. Obviously you can't use this method next to a home or in town, etc. If you use just the right amount, it makes a relatively quiet noise and cracks the rock with no projectiles. I use a Bosch 36 volt lithium-ion hammer drill with a couple spare batteries for the holes. Having a generator and line powered hammer drill would be faster...

Where can I get the cannon fuse? Heres a pic of my rock.

 

[radioman]

Where can I get the cannon fuse? Heres a pic of my rock.

I just googled cannon fuse and there seems to be a bunch online you can buy. I just wonder If you need to register or something before buying.