Stick welding questions

[accordionman]

JIM,
have you tried 7014 in 3/32 rod? this is what i use all the time for
any stick welding. i have some 1/8 rod in 7014, but it seems to me, the
smaller diameter just runs better. i know, it will take longer because of the
smaller diameter, but it seems the smaller diameter "fits" into places that a larger
rod will not. on this rod, you have to hold a very short arc. have you tried the
"drag" rods? i think anyone starting in welding should try those, at some point.
good luck with your projects.
accordionman
william l. brown
wright city, mo.

 

[Soundguy]

I'm not familiar with 'dragrod' but when i started welding I couldn't draw an arc to save my life.. The guy at the welding store suggest a rod called sure-strike...what a difference.. I could practically draw an arc on anything... I figure they were not the best rod for all purposes.. but were a 'compromise' rod.. mild steel.. etc.

Soundguy

 

[wroughtn_harv]

I've always heard them called mud rod or drag rod. A rod that you didn't have to work but just drug it a long watching the puddle. 7014 and 6013 are the most common ones I know of.

Of course you can drag or work any of them. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Lazy]

Hi
Common electrodes used for general work include 6010, 6011, 6013, 7018 and 7024, each of which has specific properties: 6010 electrodes penetrate deeply, while 6013 electrodes penetrate less. For much better bead appearance and work on higher strength steels (say for a hitch), use a 7018 rod. For better penetration on thick material, grind the joint to a 30 degree bevel (leave a nickel-width land on the bottom of the groove) and make multiple passes. Alternatively, make the first pass with a 6010 rod, then make a "cap" with a 7018. The 7024 rod is perhaps the easiest to use. Also known as a "drag rod," this electrode’s thick flux automatically maintains the correct arc length, which allows you to drag the rod directly along the work piece.

Charlie.

 

[_RaT_]

Charlie, the 6010 root pass and 7018 successive fill passes are the way many industrial hevay plate and pipe are welded. It's how I was certified. The gap you mention being a nickels width can also be established by using the welding rod you will use. For example, a 1/8" rod (flux knocked off) can be used to space the two pieces apart and the part tacked. Now that I reread your post, you say a nickels-width land at the bottom of the groove. Perhaps you were talking about facing the two pices with the 30 deg. bevel and about a 1/8" flat face. For critical welds, that is the way to do it. Face and gap the two parts. Rat...

 

[Lazy]

Hi
thats it you got it. Sounds like you might be a welder I just know enough to be dangerous.

charlie.

 

[reedfish1954]

Everyone should note that 6010 is a DC rod that CAN'T be used on an AC welder. 7018 is also a rod that is tough to use on a 220 volt welder. You need 7018AC for it to work properly on a 220 volt AC Welder. 6013 and 7014 or what the industry calls "contact electrodes" in the fact you keep the electrodes in contact with the base metal. This is unlike 6011 where a arc gap diameter of the electrode is necessary. Too much gap and slag ALL over too little gap and it sticks to base metal. Holding the gap is what is called EXPERIENCE. Some times you hear contact electrodes refered to as "Granny Rods" since they are so easy to weld with your Grandmother could weld with them. If you are looking for a cheap way to drive out moisture from your 7018AC rods look no further than a used toaster oven found at a garage sale or goodwill store. I store all my eletrodes in PVC pipe containers with pipe caps on the ends with duct tape to seal them for long term storage. Moisture can't get in and if you put one of those silcate packets in with the rod the moisture will be absorbed by the silicate packet if there' is moisture in the air trapped in the tube. I always heat my 7018Ac rod for 2 hours at 300 before I use it and I NEVER heat more than I plan on using.

Now. lets talk about why lately guys are rushing out to buy to small or expensive MIG welders without the intention of welding thin sheet metal nor are they in the production welding business. The simple reason this is happening is because that they are short cutting their lack of welding experience and are trying to substitute it with paying more for a welder "BECAUSE THEY CANT HOLD AN ARC WITH A STICK WELDER NOR DO THEY HAVE THE TIME TO TRY OR PRACTICE. I know tons of guys that want that "stacked dimes" weld and think they can do it themselves. Well guess what Guys? That will NOT work in the year 2004. 95% of us would get by nicely with 220AC volt welder for the limited amount of welding we do in a year. I consider myself a VERY GOOD hobby welder and I burn 15 to 25 pounds of electrode per year making all sorts of tractor accessories and othe "stuff. 95% of my welds are on 3/16 to 3/8ths angle and plate are less than 4 inches in length. If I am in the 95% average weekend group and if I can't financially justify a 175 to 220amp 220 volt Mig welder with proper shielding gasses why is everone rushing out out and buying a MIG welder then???? A bad looking 6011 weld is 20 times better than a good looking Mig weld that peals off like bathtub caulking because you had no pentration on a poorly set up or too small a Mig welder with poor welding experience. Think about it. A Hobart 220 AC stick welder is on sale at TSC for 199.00 and you can do many more things with it on thicker steel than a 400.00 dollar 120volt Mig welder.

Check out my pix of a 7014 1/18 electrode @120 amps on 1/4 flat plate with my 220AC hobart welder. Even if I say it myself that is a darn good stick weld without being MIGed.

 

[40Kchicks]

Something that I did before I got mig was to use my stick welder to tack weld my projects together. Then I took the projects down to the local fab shop and had them quickly finish welding the assembly together with their quality mig welders. I built a couple of loader buckets this way and was satisfied with the result. This is just a suggestion for some of those larger projects. Maybe I was just impatient but it kind of drove me nuts going through stick after stick on those long welds.

The mig is so much faster. It has defiantly justified the cost to me but then I use it for some pretty big projects.

Eric

 

[Lazy]

Hi

E6010 This electrode is used for all position welding using DCRP. It produces a deep penetrating weld and works well on dirty,rusted, or painted metals

E6011 This electrode has the same characteristics of the E6010, but can be used with AC and DC currents.

E6013 This electrode can be used with AC and DC currents. It produces a medium penetrating weld with a superior weld bead appearance.

 

[Lazy]

Hi

E7018 This electrode is known as a low hydrogen electrode and can be used with AC or DC. The coating on the electrode has a low moisture content that reduces the introduction of hydrogen into the weld. The electrode can produce welds of x-ray quality with medium penetration. (Note, this electrode must be kept dry. If it gets wet, it must be dried in a rod oven before use.)

You shouldn't have any problems using this rod on a 220 volt welder (note its an AC/DC rod) It should be the easiest rod of all to use.

 

[reedfish1954]

Lazy,

If what you say is true then why is Lincoln producing a SEPARATE 7018AC electrode? Read what Lincoln says about the characteristics of their 7018 rod. Plain 7018 rod without the "AC" flux is tough to use on a AC welder. It may work on a 440 volt welder but since I don't have any such welder I will have to take the word of the folks from Lincoln. All I know is that I tried plain 7018 rod on a AC 220volt welder with poor results intil I went back to the 7018AC rod. There is a point in time when 7018 or any rod for that matter, has absorbed so much moisture it is much better to just throw it away. Some guys believe that you can only heat 7018 ONE TIME then it needs to be thrown out. I never preheat more than I can use at one time and I never heat it twice.

The following is the official description at the Lincoln website of 7018AC rod. A low voltage power source is considered by Lincoln to be a 220 volt welder.
========================================

Lincoln 7018 AC E7018 H8 AC, DC+ AC? DC? This electrode performs beautifully either way! Lincoln 7018AC is a great choice for low open circuit voltage power sources. Cold restrikes are no problem with this versatile, all-position electrode.

 

[Lazy]

Hi
Use whatever works best for you I don't have any problems using the rod on a 220 lincoln a/c welder I have had since 1967, maybe the new welding machines are made different. I use coat hangers for welding rods when I gas weld

charlie

 

[reedfish1954]

LAZY,

Didn't anybody ever tell you the paint on the coat hangers contaminates your gas weld making it a really POOR substance to gas weld with? With what you said about coat hangers I can see somebody doesn't have much knowledge about welding and it is not me.

 

[wroughtn_harv]

I remember back in the old days of discussing E7018 with other guys who weren't experts but still skilled at welding. The consensus was the tombstones (Lincoln buzz box A/C machines) would burn plain E7018 okay. But, and again this was from guys quite skilled but not necessarily in anyone's opinion, expert, for some reason the Thunderbolts (Miller's A/C buzzbox) wouldn't.

I don't know the why or how come of this. I just know I wasn't the first to observe it.

Maybe someone really really knowledgeable on welding can explain it for us.

 

[_RaT_]

Harv, you just described my Lincoln 180. A early 60's vintage machine. A simple transformer with multiple taps.

 

[wroughtn_harv]

RaT I woke up this morning with muscles hurting that I never even knew I lived in the neighborhood.

One of our pumpers at the fire department had it's front bumper removed by an at the sleep at the wheel semi a year or so ago. It was repaired by professionals. Those repairs were repaired by other professionals.

Chief asked me to look at it.

So last night I spent four hours fixing the fix. Two and a half of those were under the truck welding.

I will confess a little bile came up over how experts will judge a weld for undercut etc. Nine hundred and ninety times out of nine hundred and ninety eight they couldn't do a good weld unless it's under the perfect conditions.

I was lucky last night though. I was on concrete and not in mud. I made the brackets out of three quarter inch plate and welded them up. After they were welded up we bolted them in with grade eight bolts. When they got the battery on the truck disconnected I got to go underside and weld the plates between the fab'd brackets together.

The height was just wrong, too high for a comfortable reach and too low for a sit down approach. I know the discomfort has nothing to do with being fifty five. I'm even more sure the after effort discomfort isn't age related. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

I see my donation of time and materials as an investment. If and ever there's a situation where I might need CPR I'm sure the responding officers would take one look at this face and decide I was dead or so close that taking a chance wouldn't make a difference.

But-t-t-t-t-t-t-t-t now they'll have to deal with that face belonging to that funny old guy who fixes the trucks.

I'm always looking for an edge....... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Jim_in_Omaha]

Thanks to all that have contributed to this thread about stick welder rods. Didn't mean to create a hot topic of debate.
thx
Jim

 

[_RaT_]

Very good Harv, you deserve a healthy dose of thanks. Most of the time, thats all I need or want.