The next guy that claims "green (or orange) paint doubles the price"

[DanMc77]

Wow, this thread is really going! I'm going to jump back in to reinforce my earlier post arguing to buy a machine that is produced in high volumes ---- Aftermarket parts!!!!!

When I picked up my JD2210 it had a non-folding ROPS. The first day I had to take it off because I have a low doorway into my storage area. I just received a folding ROPS on ebay that was specifically built for JD 2210/2305 tractors, and that for a happy $180. This saved me from cutting the original bar and welding in hinges and then repainting. Well worth it.

Purchase price is a big deal, but living with the machine for many years is a bigger deal.

 

[two_bit_score]

Wow, this thread is really going! I'm going to jump back in to reinforce my earlier post arguing to buy a machine that is produced in high volumes ---- Aftermarket parts!!!!!

When I picked up my JD2210 it had a non-folding ROPS. The first day I had to take it off because I have a low doorway into my storage area. I just received a folding ROPS on ebay that was specifically built for JD 2210/2305 tractors, and that for a happy $180. This saved me from cutting the original bar and welding in hinges and then repainting. Well worth it.

Purchase price is a big deal, but living with the machine for many years is a bigger deal.

You make a great point! More aftermarket parts will be produced for popular machines. Of any kind!

 

[hosspuller]

I crushed the canopy of my 5065 ... If I had ordered the replacement from a dealer at distance, the shipping alone would have been north of $200. Using the local Deere Construction dealer, the huge box was delivered with their regular parts delivery costing me $zero extra shipping.

The Deere dealer network allows any dealer to order any part. Of course, the Construction dealer doesn't stock AG or L&G parts. But many parts are common across many machines. ex. filters, hardware, etc.

 

[Torvy]

Wow, this thread is really going! I'm going to jump back in to reinforce my earlier post arguing to buy a machine that is produced in high volumes ---- Aftermarket parts!!!!!

When I picked up my JD2210 it had a non-folding ROPS. The first day I had to take it off because I have a low doorway into my storage area. I just received a folding ROPS on ebay that was specifically built for JD 2210/2305 tractors, and that for a happy $180. This saved me from cutting the original bar and welding in hinges and then repainting. Well worth it.

Purchase price is a big deal, but living with the machine for many years is a bigger deal.

Or just use the huge savings to build a bigger garage door. Most of the competition has the folding ROPS standard.

 

[Yander]

The way I feel about JD and Kubota, they really don't even belong in the same conversation.

Kubota is the real deal and build 100% of their tractor and they have a very strong/long history of building and supporting outstanding tractors. They put their engines in a bazillion other things, mowers, other tractors, various equipment of all sorts. When I went tractor shopping my first choice was a Kubota. They just didn't have any, at that time, with loaders near me. I see Kubota and Yanmar in the same light though Kubota has a much better dealer network. Though I do believe whole heartedly that Yanmar builds a better tractor, it isn't by much. Just my opinion.

JD on the other hand, who I would say is historically one of the greatest tractor manufacturers of all time, probably the best in the US, has been resting on their laurels with regard to small tractor production. They have been outsourcing their parts for years now. I still think they build a great tractor and I've even shopped JD even recently. I was in the JD salesman's office about to sign papers on a used JD when a CL seller called me about an ad I had put out about my JD Gator. We ended up trading even for my little Case IH DX24e. I just don't think that their dealer network, their availability of parts and all of those ancillary things are enough to get this buyer to pay the premium price for their product.

I've read through enough of this thread to see that a some JD guys act like those of us who don't buy JD can't afford it. I think that is a foolish comment/thought. Many guys like us who choose to put our money into a more prudent investment could walk in and pay cash for a JD, if we choose to.

This is coming from a home owner who, though I live on a farm and maintain a farm, don't farm. I could easily not even have a tractor and just burrow my MILs when I needed one. For those of you who make a living or even a partial living with a tractor, that scenario is completely different. In that case you need the good dealer support, the parts availability etc. etc. and if I were in that case I would buy a Case IH : ) or a JD or a Massey or... whatever dealer supported me best.

I think green tractors are great, I just don't think they are worth their price. They have outsmarted a lot of the other tractor makers with their marketing.

The above comment is only in regard to Compact tractors and below. The Large JD tractors, I have no experience with but I do know the guys who farm my MILs acreage have nice big shiny new JD tractors and they seem to be broken down every harvest in the past two year, good thing they have good dealer support : )

 

[Hay Dude]

The way I feel about JD and Kubota, they really don't even belong in the same conversation.

Kubota is the real deal and build 100% of their tractor and they have a very strong/long history of building and supporting outstanding tractors. They put their engines in a bazillion other things, mowers, other tractors, various equipment of all sorts. When I went tractor shopping my first choice was a Kubota. They just didn't have any, at that time, with loaders near me. I see Kubota and Yanmar in the same light though Kubota has a much better dealer network. Though I do believe whole heartedly that Yanmar builds a better tractor, it isn't by much. Just my opinion.

JD on the other hand, who I would say is historically one of the greatest tractor manufacturers of all time, probably the best in the US, has been resting on their laurels with regard to small tractor production. They have been outsourcing their parts for years now. I still think they build a great tractor and I've even shopped JD even recently. I was in the JD salesman's office about to sign papers on a used JD when a CL seller called me about an ad I had put out about my JD Gator. We ended up trading even for my little Case IH DX24e. I just don't think that their dealer network, their availability of parts and all of those ancillary things are enough to get this buyer to pay the premium price for their product.

I've read through enough of this thread to see that a lot of JD guys act like those of us who don't buy JD can't afford it. I think that is a foolish comment/thought. Many guys like us who choose to put our money into a more prudent investment could walk in and pay cash for a JD, if we choose to.

This is coming from a home owner who though I live on a farm and maintain a farm, don't farm. I could easily not even have a tractor and just burrow my MILs when I needed one. For those of you who make a living or even a partial living with a tractor, that scenario is completely different. In that case you need the good dealer support, the parts availability etc. etc. and if I were in that case I would buy a Case IH : ) or a JD or a Massey or... whatever dealer supported me best.

I think green tractors are great, I just don't think they are worth their price. They have outsmarted a lot of the other tractor makers with their marketing.

The above comment is only in regard to Compact tractors and below. The Large JD tractors, I have no experience with but I do know the guys who farm my MILs acreage have nice big shiny new JD tractors and they seem to be broken down every harvest in the past two year, good thing they have good dealer support : )

They don’t build 100% of their tractors. Larger models now have Cummins diesel engines in them. Earlier large models were built in collaboration with SAME. My guess is other lines have some outside suppliers.

Machine of the Month: Kubota M8 series tractor | Cummins Inc.

Earlier this year Kubota unveiled its largest tractor, the 19,510 lb. (8550 kg) M8. Powered by a 190 hp (141 kW) or 210 hp (156 kW) Cummins B6.7 Performance Series engine, the M8 delivers the power and reliability that Kubota customers expect.

www.cummins.com

Kubota also uses Kawasaki gas engines in some zero turns.

Kubota Expands Gas-Powered Z400 Line of Zero-Turn Mowers

Kubota introduces two new models in its Z400 Series with upgraded components and deluxe comfort features now standard from the factory. The Z400 Series is backed by an unlimited hour two-year commercial warranty and a 500-hour four-year residential warranty. ..Read more

www.kubotausa.com

 

[Yander]

They don’t build 100% of their tractors. Larger models now have Cummins diesel engines in them. Earlier large models were built in collaboration with SAME. My guess is other lines have some outside suppliers.

Machine of the Month: Kubota M8 series tractor | Cummins Inc.

Earlier this year Kubota unveiled its largest tractor, the 19,510 lb. (8550 kg) M8. Powered by a 190 hp (141 kW) or 210 hp (156 kW) Cummins B6.7 Performance Series engine, the M8 delivers the power and reliability that Kubota customers expect.

www.cummins.com

Kubota also uses Kawasaki gas engines in some zero turns.

Kubota Expands Gas-Powered Z400 Line of Zero-Turn Mowers

Kubota introduces two new models in its Z400 Series with upgraded components and deluxe comfort features now standard from the factory. The Z400 Series is backed by an unlimited hour two-year commercial warranty and a 500-hour four-year residential warranty. ..Read more

www.kubotausa.com

My post was in relation to Compact tractors, not larger models and not ZTRs. I prefer the Kawasaki engine to all other gas engines in a ZTR, but again, not talking ZTRs. Even my case and my Massey don't have engines built by Case or Massey (Shibaura) and I'm guessing they have some of their parts sourced outside of Case/Massey. But I didn't pay a JD price for them either.

 

[dodge man]

The only thing I’m sure of no maker makes all their parts. To compare any of them and say it’s made more in house than another brand just isn’t possible. On my JD I always notice the quick connects are made in Italy, doesn’t make the tractor Italian. I know people would bash Kubota for being Japanese even though they were made in Georgia.

Trucks and cars actually list the parts content and place of assembly on the window sticker.

 

[Yander]

The only thing I’m sure of no maker makes all their parts. To compare any of them and say it’s made more in house than another brand just isn’t possible. On my JD I always notice the quick connects are made in Italy, doesn’t make the tractor Italian. I know people would bash Kubota for being Japanese even though they were made in Georgia.

Trucks and cars actually list the parts content and place of assembly on the window sticker.

No doubt this is true, but they are not charging JD prices for them either. To know some tractors are built more by that manufacture is absolutely possible depending what tractor you are buying. Does that mean 100% of that tractor was built by the brand, probably never true.

 

[LD1]

It all depends on how far down the rabbit hole one wants to go in terms of "who makes what".

None of the manufactures make their own nuts, bolts, bearings, seals, tires, light bulbs, etc.

The thing people like about Kubota and with regard to "built in house" is the fact that, even though Kubota doesn't make bearings and seals, the engineering and design of the drivetrain is 100% theirs.

But probably more important than that, is the fact that they got a reputation of making a very good engine, so people expect nothing less with the rest of the machine.

Other companies that outsource the engine, or other major components, are a bit different in that aspect.

There is nothing wrong with JD using a yanmar engine. They both have the reputation to back up their product. Or a Massey using a Perkins, etc.

But what happens when the engine maker and mfg have a falling out? Becomes a logistic nightmare.

Probably why those companies go back to the drawing board and completely revamp a lineup more frequently, because they have to constantly build a machine around the engines they are choosing.

JD went from making their own tractors, to rebadging yanmars, to now just using yanmar engines.

Massey used to make tractors and used Perkins for engines, then they started rebadging iseki's....then some just use iseki engines, some use shibauru, some use Mitsubishi, etc. It's a lot to try and figure out.

Massey 1200 in the late 90's to early 2000's were rebadged iseki's

Then Massey went to a 1300 series that used a Mitsubishi engine in 2002-2004.

That became the 1400 series that switched to a rebadged iseki, and then the 1500 same thing.

2009 they changed to 1600 series which just used the iseki engine only

Then in 2013 they went to the 1700 series and went back to a Mitsubishi engine.
Then without changing the "series", the 1700's started getting shibauru engines in 2018.

Constantly changing the engine doesn't give a customer any good piece of mind.
So in 20 years, for their ~30hp/2500-3000 pound compacts, it went:
Rebadged iseki→mitsubishi engine→back to rebadged iseki→just iseki engine→back to Mitsubishi engine→now a shibauru engines.

Not knocking Massey, they make a fine product. But it's about customer perception, and assuring the customer you are gonna be there to support them in the future