The WICKED Root & Debris GRAPPLE!!!!!!!

[aeblank]

That's a very good point!

Perhaps worth noting, I originally wanted a 72" double lid. Convinced myself that a smaller (66" in my case) made sense for woods maneuverability. Got a good deal on a single lid, and accepted it for that reason. In hindsight, I think I dumb-lucked into the exact right combo for me. For example, I don't care if the log is clamped tight, I care that i can pick it up and get it where it needs to be.

But as always, to each their own.

 

[Xfaxman]

------------ I like my single lid because I can open it a slight amount (like when I slip off a log and need to re-grip). I don't have to open all the way up. I feel that 2 lids would almost always require one to open all the way before the second would open that 4" that I need. Then it has to re-close. Lots of times, there is brush or other shi....er, crud in the way of the lid opening.
------

My two lids open together. They close together until one contacts something. Keep the pivots greased and they will move together.

 

[Mad Mac]

After one day of use, here is our experience so far. We are very pleased.

The 72 inch single lid Wicked Grapple has exceeded our expectations. The Mahindra 5555 to which it is attached is 79 inches wide, so we wanted a grapple wide enough to keep brush off the sides of the tractor.

The grapple is plumbed to the existing rear hydraulics. Operating the single lid with the lever next to the seat became second nature in a matter of minutes. Not missing the third function so far.

The single lid seems to be adequate for us and to this point have not regretted the lack of a double lid.

We first grappled loose brush already pushed out with a 72 inch Ratchet Rake tooth bar strapped to our 78 inch bucket. The tooth bar had done a good job but the Wicked Grapple went on to take out more Yaupon. The operator said he could see better and pull up more roots with the grapple than with the tooth bar that cost me $400. Now not sure we needed the tooth bar. So if anyone is mulling over which one to get, I would have to say apply the money for a tooth bar toward a Wicked Grapple.

 

[aeblank]

My two lids open together. They close together until one contacts something. Keep the pivots greased and they will move together.

What's your flow though?
I'd bet that your flow is high, such that any small difference in the force required to open is overcome by the volume of fluid.
Maybe that's the case with all tractors, but I don't think so. I'm at some 9 gpm and you run a front bush hog, which must make you at 20+. You are overcoming the path of least resistance with more fluid volume.

Anyway, I'm out. We all like what we have, for various reasons. Nothing wrong with that for sure.
I *love* seeing all the grapple pics.

 

[Xfaxman]

What's your flow though?
I'd bet that your flow is high, such that any small difference in the force required to open is overcome by the volume of fluid.
Maybe that's the case with all tractors, but I don't think so. I'm at some 9 gpm and you run a front bush hog, which must make you at 20+. You are overcoming the path of least resistance with more fluid volume.

Anyway, I'm out. We all like what we have, for various reasons. Nothing wrong with that for sure.
I *love* seeing all the grapple pics.

Check this Thread for grapple pictures: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/attachments/211635-grappling-fun-picture-thread.html

Pressure is what moves the lids, faster flow makes it happen quicker, but they still move one at a time if there is anything against one lid.

 

[Mad Mac]

Take that, Yaupon!

 

[IslandTractor]

Perhaps worth noting, I originally wanted a 72" double lid. Convinced myself that a smaller (66" in my case) made sense for woods maneuverability. Got a good deal on a single lid, and accepted it for that reason. In hindsight, I think I dumb-lucked into the exact right combo for me. For example, I don't care if the log is clamped tight, I care that i can pick it up and get it where it needs to be.

But as always, to each their own.

The big problem with buying a grapple is that one does so only once. That means virtually none of us have vast experience with lots of grapple types and sizes before making a purchase. Dealers and manufacturers just want a sale. Can't blame them but the bottom line is that they will sell you virtually anything they can and if you express interest in a certain size or type of grapple they have no interest in talking you out of it unless it is wildly inappropriate for your tractor. As most of our tractors can physically mount and operate just about any size and type of grapple that means there is little useful guidance from the people for whom you are a potential customer. They'd rather sell you a little too much than nothing at all.

Another problem is that grapple use on CUTs is a relatively recent phenomenon (ten to fifteen years) while grapples have been used on skid steers for decades. Skid steers are used for different purposes, often in construction, and generally are doing different types of tasks than CUTs. All manufacturers and most dealers have more experience selling grapples to skidsteer owners than to CUT owners so they tend to err on the side of making skid steer relevant recommendations. The choice of double versus single lid grapple I think is biased by a lot of skid steer experience rather than CUT experience. I note that EA now has three lines of grapples. Compact, medium and extreme. I cannot imagine any CUT needs an extreme size grapple but I bet that a lot of guys are buying them because they have a big powerful CUT and need the matching grapple. Kind of like buying a F250 to drive to the grocery store. I rather doubt EA talks many of them out of it either.

I know that skid steers are commonly used for debris clean up at construction sites and that is a setting where wide double lid grapples are certainly useful. Collecting and picking up lots of smallish objects like leftover ends of 2x4s etc is best done with a wide grapple. CUTs on the other hand generally are not doing daily construction site clean up and CUTs more typically are picking up brush, pushing over saplings, digging out rocks or roots. These are all tasks that are done perfectly by a narrow single lid grapple. A 48" grapple puts 50% more force into the ground than a 72" grapple mounted on the same tractor. A narrow grapple is easier to maneuver between trees. Brush is "sticky". If you rip it out of the ground it stays together and requires barely any clamping to hold in place. Check out photos below of what a 48" single lid grapple can do with brush and tell me that a 72" with dual lids can do any more. Folks often worry about the grapple covering their whole wheel base but a grapple is like the prow of a ship. It doesn't need to be as wide as the max beam. And, a narrower grapple pushing into brush will not be stopped as soon as a wide grapple. Another shibboleth is the notion that asymmetric objects require dual lids to lift. Malarky. In ten years I haven't found an object yet that I couldn't clamp with my little 48" single lid. Dual lid fans point to stumps as odd shaped objects but a stump is way easier to lift and clamp with a small single lid. Don't grab it sideways so the weight is lopsided and dangerous, grab a stump from either the bottom or top so the load is perfectly symmetrical. Finally, wider and dual lid grapples are heavier than their narrow single lid siblings. That means the smaller grapples leave you with the biggest net lift capacity. Not an issue for brush but it is for big rocks or trees or logs.

Everybody loves their grapple, whatever type it is, and that is a good thing. What you will virtually never see is someone buying a narrow single lid grapple and then complaining that they need bigger. If anyone knows of someone on TBN over the past ten years who has "upgraded" please let us know. TBNers upgrade virtually everything except grapples. I think that says something. When it comes to grapples, small is beautiful.

 

[Helitech]

Thanks for your insight IslandTractor. Some excellent points for sure. 100% correct that a large portion of people purchasing a grapple have never used one, me included! Love the pictures of your work with a grapple. One of the things that haven't thought that much about is removing small trees from the ground. I fight small sweet gum trees all the time. How much work is involved to remove say a 10-15 foot tall tree?

 

[IslandTractor]

Thanks for your insight IslandTractor. Some excellent points for sure. 100% correct that a large portion of people purchasing a grapple have never used one, me included! Love the pictures of your work with a grapple. One of the things that haven't thought that much about is removing small trees from the ground. I fight small sweet gum trees all the time. How much work is involved to remove say a 10-15 foot tall tree?

I don't know exactly what a sweet gum tree is. If I were trying to remove a 10-15 foot sapling or cedar or choke cherry, I would first position the grapple about 6-7 feet above the ground and push on the tree. Keep pushing if the tree bends and push until either you've knocked it down or you've popped some roots up. Once you can see where the supporting roots are, just stick the lower grapple tines into them (here is where a 48" grapple is far superior to wider) and drive the tractor forward while simultaneously curling the grapple. With a sapling (2-4" trunk diameter) just pushing on the tree to knock it over will do most of the work. With more mature trees of the 10-15ft size, you may need to push and work on the roots from different angles. Key goal is to get the grapple tines under the root structure and then curl and drive forward in 4wd low range.

I find that I can pop out a tree that size and move it to a pile in about 5 minutes but time needed per tree will depend a lot of soil type and root structure so YMMV. I should note that I use a Kioti DK40se which has a pretty strong loader and is a moderately heavy tractor both of which are important. I'd think the Branson is probably about the same frame/weight and loader strength but I haven't checked. Not familiar at all with the International.

 

[Helitech]

Yep, looked up the specs on your tractor. Branson a touch heavier. Not sure on the loader specs. I would guess the Kioti loader is stronger, Branson uses the same loader from a 31 horse 20 series through my 55 horse 20 series. It shows 2100 lbs at full lift and 3531 lbs breakout. No loader on the old International! That old beast pull my 12 and 14 foot tillage equipment and a very heavy John Deere 1518 batting cutter. 115 PTO horsepower and about 12,000 lbs.