Tire ballast weight

[CobyRupert]

Does anybody have a chart or a link that relates the tire size to the weight (of the liquid ballast) that they will hold?
Example: This size tire holds x gallons, x gallons weighs y pounds.
Is there a standard on how full the tire is filled. 80%?

 

[Tx Jim]

Google is your friend http://www.firestoneag.com/webres/File/Inflation-Tables/TireInfo-LoadInflation-A.pdf

 

[George2615]

Here is a list someone else posted for Titan tires of various sizes

 

[mrmikey]

One size I can comment on because I just filled mine with WWAF last weekend is a 8.5 x 24, it holds 45 liters each, level to the valve stem at the 12:00 position, and adds 90 lbs per tire.....Mike

 

[toomanymachines]

Use steel wheel weights.. they will be easier than fluid for fuel consumption.. plus the tires last longer as they are more flexible, and less likely to impact on rocks etc. you also won't rust your rims when the do leak. and they will leak. if you ever rolled a tire with fluid in it you will understand how it will never act like a flywheel. it will always suck power.

 

[RG1]

Rim Guard - Liquid Tire Ballast

 

[RedNeckRacin]

Use steel wheel weights.. they will be easier than fluid for fuel consumption.. plus the tires last longer as they are more flexible, and less likely to impact on rocks etc. you also won't rust your rims when the do leak. and they will leak. if you ever rolled a tire with fluid in it you will understand how it will never act like a flywheel. it will always suck power.

Thats great if you can get enough weight with them. I was looking through my loader and tractor manual yesterday and there is no way to get enough weight on the machine without running weights and fluid. I needed 1500lbs of weight plus 200lbs of wheel weights for the loader, PLUS a 3pt attachment that weighs 2k lbs. My tractor is only rated to have 2 wheel weights per side at 100lbs per weight.

 

[toomanymachines]

How large are the tires you intend to fill? Most of the guys around here farm 2000 plus acres.. most of the tires are 18.4/38 and larger.. so they have room to add weights to the frame or the wheels. My suggestion is to avoid fluid if you can. I have seen old versatiles with 7000 hours with original tires that were dry. the old tires were resold for dual usage as well. wet ones will last half of that on average. I have seen wet tires last 5000 hours, but they were bald, 3 to 4 k hours is normal.

 

[Gary Fowler]

How large are the tires you intend to fill? Most of the guys around here farm 2000 plus acres.. most of the tires are 18.4/38 and larger.. so they have room to add weights to the frame or the wheels. My suggestion is to avoid fluid if you can. I have seen old versatiles with 7000 hours with original tires that were dry. the old tires were resold for dual usage as well. wet ones will last half of that on average. I have seen wet tires last 5000 hours, but they were bald, 3 to 4 k hours is normal.

Bald tires are not bald because of water in them. Water doesn't wear the outside tread, slipping does. If tires with water were bald it was because they needed more weight in addition to the water weight to prevent excessive slipping. I have no idea how you jumped to the conclusion that water inside a tire causes the tread to wear out faster than using wheel weights just because a tire ran with only water wears faster than one with wheel weights. Put the same amount of weigh on the axle with iron weigh as with water and the wear will be comparable. Tires flex as well with water as with air since they are when properly filled at 70% there is still plenty of air to compress to prevent damage. Most knowledgeable tractor operators will use water ballast primarily and then add iron wheel weights as needed to load the tractor to the maximum weight. Rolling tires with water will cause a bit of friction loss with the water flowing around the tire but it is negilible in the short distance (circumference of the tire)that it travels. The difference in ease of movement by hand is mostly because of the extra weight that you are moving, not because of the friction of the water moving in the tire.

 

[CobyRupert]

I was wondering on the weight of liquid ballast, because another poster here with a 5075 was calculating the weight of his tractor in order to size a trailer and listed tire ballast as (I think) 1000lbs total, for 2 tires. Whereas, I was thinking each tire was around 800lbs. This link Rim Guard - Liquid Tire Ballast says 16.9-28's are 700 lbs + each.

 

[toomanymachines]

I never stated that fluid makes tires wear... What you misunderstood was that dry tires do not have as much stress on them because they can flex to absorb rocks and lumps in the soil. That is why football players do not suff themselves before they play. Would you like to burst open? the same applies to tires. When they are filled to above the rim or very near it you have a very small envelope of a gas.. (air) liquid does not flex. When you drive over something the pressure spikes, stressing the tire.
Most new tractor come with weights around Manitoba. Between radials and lower pressure, traction is attained with that. If you need that much ballast you are pulling too much.
My father ran a tire shop for 39 years, and I continue. I am now 47 so between the two of us we have seen a lot.

Calcium Chloride mixes 150 lbs per barrel.. so we would put about 40 imp gallons and the rest water. that would be 550 lbs for a full barrel. That was always strong enough to prevent freezing at minus 40. I did know of someone who did flatten their tires on a 4wd. They had it parked in a shop (cold) all winter. They had to take it out one early march day, went down the road with it and had the 4 wet tires start leaking. I guess from sitting many months the salt started to settle or was never strong enough and formed ice at the top. When they drove it down the road the chunks of ice smashed the tube against the rim.
I have taken a few tires apart in the winter and early spring that did not have strong enough fluid. Had chunks of ice in the tube about the size of pails

 

[RedNeckRacin]

I understand that the larger AG tractors have MUCH heavier weights avaiable to them. My owners manual stated that I have to have 1500lbs of ballast in the tires, plus another 200lbs of wheel weights and another 2k lbs on the three point hitch to run my loader. How in the world do you get 1500lbs of weight on the tires when the wheel is only rated to handle 2 95lb iron weights per wheel? Liquid ballast is not optional on the smaller machines to get them ballasted correctly.

 

[toomanymachines]

I understand that the larger AG tractors have MUCH heavier weights avaiable to them. My owners manual stated that I have to have 1500lbs of ballast in the tires, plus another 200lbs of wheel weights and another 2k lbs on the three point hitch to run my loader. How in the world do you get 1500lbs of weight on the tires when the wheel is only rated to handle 2 95lb iron weights per wheel? Liquid ballast is not optional on the smaller machines to get them ballasted correctly.

It sounds like you manual is asking for too much.. 2000 lbs on the three point hitch? and that is way out there. plus the fluid and the weights.
What do you plan to pick up with the machine? How many hp is it and is it a front wheel assist? They are suggesting 3700 lbs of weight? With a laaarge portion of that very far back.
from the way you are suggesting you should be able to pick up two large round bales with your loader.
Remember that the front axle is the pivot point, and think of the leverage from that point forward and that point backward. You have far more leverage to the rear.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I understand that the larger AG tractors have MUCH heavier weights avaiable to them. My owners manual stated that I have to have 1500lbs of ballast in the tires, plus another 200lbs of wheel weights and another 2k lbs on the three point hitch to run my loader. How in the world do you get 1500lbs of weight on the tires when the wheel is only rated to handle 2 95lb iron weights per wheel? Liquid ballast is not optional on the smaller machines to get them ballasted correctly.

The tire ballast chart from Messicks says that your 16.9x30 rear tires will hold 609# per tire (water ballast)+ your 190# of steel weights would just about get you to the 1500# per tire per manufacturer. I rather doubt that using the max ballast in tires and the 2000 # rear 3PH ballast is required to operate your FEL safely in most instances. Perhaps if you are loading it to the max capacity of lift at all times you would need that amount but hardly anyone uses their FEL lifting the max capacity ALL the time. The 2000 # ballast on the 3 PH needs much clarification, ie if you have a ballast box staged basically between the lift arms, you wont get as much counter-leverage off the front wheels as having a 2000# bush hog or other long implement hanging back behind you. I would dare say that a 1000# bush hog would give as much countering force as a 2000# ballast box.

 

[RG1]

It sounds like you manual is asking for too much.. 2000 lbs on the three point hitch? and that is way out there. plus the fluid and the weights.
What do you plan to pick up with the machine? How many hp is it and is it a front wheel assist? They are suggesting 3700 lbs of weight? With a laaarge portion of that very far back.
from the way you are suggesting you should be able to pick up two large round bales with your loader.
Remember that the front axle is the pivot point, and think of the leverage from that point forward and that point backward. You have far more leverage to the rear.

That's not exactly true. The pivot point for the FEL and the weight is lifts is the loader mounting arms which are located more centrally on the machine. The front tires are more like a cam over point. There's not as much weight too the rear of the pivot point as you suggest.

Still, that does seem like a lot of rear ballast to me too. It is possible he might have mis-read the manual. Mine have all given an either/or scenario ie; a certain number of specified weights per rim & tires filled with fluid OR a certain amount of weight on the 3 pt, OR any combo of either that gives the required rear ballast.

 

[Gary Fowler]

Your tractor has 2 pivot points when using the FEL, the first being the front axle that takes all the weight of the tractor/wheel weights/liquid ballast + what ever you are lifting with the FEL. The only way to remove some of that weight it to put a counter weight behind the rear axle so that it becomes a secondary pivot point which is what JD wants you to do by adding 2000# to the 3 PH. You need much of your ballast weight on the 3 PH lift arms rather than on the rear tires. While weight on the tires will keep the tires on the ground, it does nothing for unloading the front axles, in fact it allows extra force to be applied before the rear wheels will become unstable and rise off the ground.
Adding weight to the 3 PH lift arms takes that amount of force off the front axle which is what you want to do when using the FEL. The further back from the rear axle this load is centered, the more counter-active force is applied to the front axle so the better it is for your tractor.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

The operators manual for the 563 loader is where I am quoting the specs from and yes it does call for that much weight. The loader has a capacity somewhere in the neighborhood of 4klbs (a little bit higher I believe) Its a 5083E. The 3pt hitch is rated to lift 3200lbs at 24" so no 2klbs is not asking anything of that machine.



Currently I have Rim guard in the rear tires whigh gives me 800lbs per rear tire, not 600. I am also running a 1700lb concrete counter weight and with the 563 NSL I have managed to pick the rear end up off the ground so don't tell me I am running to much ballast. I'm just telling you guys what my loader manual is stating the MINIMUM requirements for safe operation of the JD loader that is spec'd out to run on my 5083E tractor. I can scan the page if you think I'm nuts.


I think we are getting a bit off topic from the OP though.

 

[RG1]

The operators manual for the 563 loader is where I am quoting the specs from and yes it does call for that much weight. The loader has a capacity somewhere in the neighborhood of 4klbs (a little bit higher I believe) Its a 5083E. The 3pt hitch is rated to lift 3200lbs at 24" so no 2klbs is not asking anything of that machine.



Currently I have Rim guard in the rear tires whigh gives me 800lbs per rear tire, not 600. I am also running a 1700lb concrete counter weight and with the 563 NSL I have managed to pick the rear end up off the ground so don't tell me I am running to much ballast. I'm just telling you guys what my loader manual is stating the MINIMUM requirements for safe operation of the JD loader that is spec'd out to run on my 5083E tractor. I can scan the page if you think I'm nuts.


I think we are getting a bit off topic from the OP though.

No, I don't think you're nuts if you were referring to me. Just saying it doesn't hurt to double check the manual sometimes. I wasn't sure which of the tractors listed in your sig line you were referring to, but can definitely see the weight being needed for the 5000 series machines and loaders. I am surprised that they only say two weights can be mounted on your rear rims though. My manual for my 4500 called for three 110 lb weights per side on the rear rims. Your center dish/plate is every bit as thick as the ones on my 4500 were, maybe thicker, so I wouldn't think it would hurt anything. I have here a bunch of old JD brochures that show the 5X10 and 5X20 series machines with 3 of the same exact 110 lb weights I had per side in the pics, and have seen them set up that way at several of the large dealers around here. Have any idea why you can't do the same thing with yours?