WalMart Shoplifting

[Bird]

I know I'm just being a radical jerk

I really don't like having to stop and show my receipt at the door at Sam's Club, nor do I want to be stopped to show the receipt at Walmart. However, when you talk about honest Americans giving up rights, how about the rights of the owners of businesses. I figure it's their "right" to check the receipts if they want to, and if you don't like it, it's your "right" to go elsewhere.

So, yeah, I may not like it, but I can handle it without being a jerk.

 

[jdbower]

I'd just use my right to shop elsewhere if they did something I didn't like, in fact around here the WalMarts aren't all that clean so I shop at Target where the quality of the store and the merchandise are a bit better. I put up with the receipt examination at Costco because all the warehouse stores around here do it and I can't live without 50 gallon drums of mayo. Amusingly the Costco here doesn't check to make sure every item in the cart is on the receipt, they check to make sure everything on the receipt is in the cart. It seems like they're more concerned that I dropped something on the way out than that I could be shoplifting! Fundamentally it's their store and their rules so the onus is on me to find alternatives if it bothers me, and with so much available online it's pretty easy these days.

 

[LMTC]

I know I'm just being a radical jerk, but I refuse to show or hand over my receipt at a Walmart exit. I paid for the merchandise and they are entitled to watch me from the register to the door. If they want to look in my bags they must call the police & accuse me of shoplifting. Honest Americans give up too many rights today without considering why they have any. MikeD74T

And where in the Constitution is the right to not show a receipt? Don't like it, don't shop there. The business (which is really people, whether it is a sole prop, partnership, or corp., it's owned by people) likely owns the property, and short of violating the law can pretty much make policy as they choose. I fail to see how being required to show a receipt at the door violates a Consitutional right...and the remark about Americans giving up too many rights seems to imply a Constitutional right. If I misunderstood, please feel free to clarify where you think the right to not show a receipt upon leaving a retail store comes from.

 

[MikeD74T]

I have a Constitutional right to unreasonable search. Walmart takes my money & packages my merchandise, meaning it's no longer theirs including the receipt. I don't give the elderly checkers a hard time, when they ask to see my receipt I just say no thank you & keep walking. Granted the management could refuse me reentry to their store but they don't. As for business man's rights Sam's Club, has a membership clause that gives them the right to surveille my purchases - Walmart does not and as previously stated they can watch me walk from the register to the door. MikeD74T

 

[dooleysm]

There's the idea of personal property at issue here I think. Yes, you are on their property, but just because it's private property doesn't mean that the owner has his own sovereign nation and can make laws as he sees fit.

What if a walmart employee came up to you on the street and asked to see the contents of your walmart bag and a receipt to prove that you own it. They don't have any special authority to compel you to prove your ownership of merchandise, regardless of where they ask you, on their property or someone else's.

That said, I think it's a pretty fair request, and if I had a problem with it, I would stop shopping there.

 

[Bird]

I have a Constitutional right to unreasonable search.

First off, I think you meant a right to avoid unreasonable searches, not have a right TO them.

But, nope, you do NOT have a Constitutional right to avoid them at Walmart. The Constitution only prohibits unreasonable searches by or for the government. So it has nothing to do with whether Walmart or any other private individual or company conducts any kind of search.

Now, in addition to that, the words are "unreasonable searches"; reasonable searches ARE allowed, even by the police. And IF the Constitution applied to the current discussion; i.e., Walmart, which it certainly does not, many of us, and quite likely the courts, would NOT consider what Walmart is doing to be "unreasonable".

 

[MikeD74T]

Bird, You're right about "avoid", I'm a little brain dead today. As for "unreasonable", how could anyone think it reasonable that WalMart needs to challenge every customer to determine whether they might have stolen something between their register & the door. Removing merchandise from that area would be more reasonable. I know of no other store in New Hampshire that feels the need to challenge every customer ( not counting Sam's Club which is WalMart anyway). Maybe the Texas motto, Friendly" serves WalMart better than NH's "Live Free or Die".MikeD74t

 

[jdbower]

"Reasonable" is open to interpretation. Are they searching your things or their cart and bags (after all, you didn't pay for the bags they're just letting you use them)? In fact, they stop searching once you present evidence that it's your stuff. To me this implies that they believe that the loss of revenue from customers who don't like this enough to shop elsewhere is less than the amount of lost revenue from the shoplifters this catches or deters. Since they're not losing your revenue they probably don't care too much about you, if, on the other hand, you talked to the manager and told him what your issue was and then went to another store to shop until they made changes they may care more. It may be more expensive or less convenient, but I know I couldn't in good conscious shop at a place if I had a moral objection to their policies - principles have a price.

 

[Bird]

how could anyone think it reasonable that WalMart needs to challenge every customer to determine whether they might have stolen something between their register & the door.

Mike, maybe they do things differently up there than down here. I've been in Walmarts just about all over the country except in the northeast, and I've never known of an instance in which they challenged anyone except when a customer is going out with something fairly valuable and too big to be bagged; i.e., things such as TVs, microwave ovens, etc. While I'm sure it's probably happened, I've never personally known of them to check anything in a bag.

Of course, I'm certainly not saying that everything Walmart does is "reasonable"; only that you aren't protected by the Constitution from their "searches".

I've been known to be a bit of a "jerk" with a few of their other policies myself. After having been a regular customer in quite a few Walmarts, there was one (and only one) in which the cashier would ask to see my drivers license about every third time I was in there. No other Walmart had ever asked for other ID when I used a credit card. So I just wondered why, since it only happened occasionally, never when buying anything that cost more than a few dollars. So I sent an e-mail to Walmart's headquarters and a day or two later a fellow who identified himself as the manager of that store called me. He first told me they "always" asked when a credit card was used; a very obvious lie and I told him so. Then he told me they had to do it on every 5th customer; another lie. A couple of days later, a different fellow called and also identified himself as the manager of that store. He told me the computer randomly selected people to ask for ID. So the next time a cashier asked to see my drivers license, I said, "No" and walked out, leaving the merchanise sitting there (I hadn't yet scanned my credit card). No one in that store has ever asked to see ID since.

But then a brand new Walmart opened closer to our house, and lo and behold, the second fellow who called from the other store became the manager in the new store. So, sure enough, about the 3rd or 4th time I was in there, the cashier asked to see my drivers license. I told her, "Call your manager." So I got to meet him in person, and was never again asked for other ID.

And then Walmart started selling beer and wine. And they had a policy requiring ID of anyone who purchased any alcoholic beverage. Now I'll be 68 before this month's over, so I asked a couple of cashiers if they really thought I could be under 21. And when they told me of the policy requiring ID of everyone, I told them it must be tough to have to work for a boss who thinks you're too much of an idiot to know that I'm over 21. The policy now is to require ID of anyone who appears to the cashier to be under 40.

 

[dooleysm]

Bird, you said, "Of course, I'm certainly not saying that everything Walmart does is "reasonable"; only that you aren't protected by the Constitution from their "searches"."

I know that neither one of us is a lawyer, but I believe think that I'm in no way compelled by any law to submit to a 'search' by a Wal-Mart employee, regardless of where I am standing (in their store, on their property, or elsewhere). If you come over to my house, do I have the right to demand you empty your pockets for me to see? I don't think I do. I can ask you to, and if you refuse the best I can do is ask you to leave and then if you don't, have you arrested for tresspassing.

Again, I'm not lawyer, but this is my take on the situation.