Water leveling?

[LDR812]

Hi - I’m trying to lay a bit of field tile - the 4 inch junk that Homedepot and Lowes sells. Also I’m putting some catch basins and running them into schedule 40 (4 inch) . I’ve watched it rain out here a couple years and have a basic idea of run off / grade. I’ve also checked it using 100 ‘ of clear poly vynal 3/8 id tubing for a “water level” driving metal posts and securing the poly hose at 100’ or so. Looks like I have about half a degree of fall. That complicates things. The a schedule 40 is just being used where I know it will be driven over - but in that same trench I’d like to put perforated pipe.
Anyway - any experience using water levels and accuracy? I’m in the 1/2 degree slope by what I read. Both by water level and string line. Metal post set about 100 foot apart

 

[dodge man]

It doesn’t take batteries so it can’t be accurate.

Im a land surveyor and in my 40 years of experience I’ve never used a water level. I’ve read about a water level though and if you set it up correctly it’s 100% accurate and as good or better than anything else. Set up correctly I would take it to mean the tube isn’t dry anywhere or the water isn’t hitting the top.

If my math is correct a 1/2 degree slope is about 10 inches of fall in a 100 feet which is doable.

 

[ponytug]

@LDR812 What is the project? Why do you want perforated and solid in the same trench?

If the perforated is above the solid pipe, it can be done, but I would never, ever, use flexible perforated pipe underground. It crushes and wears out too quickly. There is a flexible 3x8" geotextile wrapped material that both drains and channels water, but it needs a cover depth of gravel to not crush, and it needs to drain into solid PVC/ABS below that, all of which pushes your exit depth lower.

I have used water levels and level transits. Both are quite accurate. Like anything, there is always the opportunity for user error.

Like @dodge man, I get 10.4"/100ft for your half degree slope. Water isn't going to move quickly at that slope, but it will move. The challenge will be leveling the pipe in the trench to that level of accuracy. String sags, and an 8' level only gets you so far. If you have more than a little water, you might be happier with a larger pipe.

I had a similar project, and bit the bullet and bought an adjustable rotating laser and stick. That enabled me to dial in the target pipe slopes easily, and quickly, and it was absolutely worth the price. The project was subsurface drainage under an outside arena, requiring two different slopes in two perpendicular directions. I've used it a few times since, and once it absolutely saved me tens of thousands on a concrete pour that the contractor was sure would work, and I was sure wouldn't work. With the laser, and stick, I was able to show him that he was not going to get the slope that he needed over about fifty foot portion of the project which was a non-starter. With the laser and stick, I was able to quickly lay out the slope that he (and I) needed, and things could go back to working.

You might consider renting a laser level if you do not see the need recurring, but I would use one either way for this because I suspect that the pipe laying will be very, very, fiddly otherwise.

All the best,

Peter

 

[LDR812]

I’m going to lay lay some catch basins in the low spots and have those run out threw solid pipe. Beside that I plan to lay some perforated pipe to gather up and drain the slop that is left over

 

[dodge man]

There is no reason you can’t put catch basins on a slotted pipe.

 

[LDR812]

I’d like to have it all 18 inches buried in the ground - but will most likely have mounds over the pipes because I don’t have enough fall

 

[LDR812]

Dodge Man - yea, trying to think through that. For sure if we get 3 inches or more an hour - want that to have a clear path and then the perforated drain can clean up- that’s what I’m thinking

 

[grsthegreat]

I have used water levels in the past, and still own a 100’ kit. The only issue ive had in the past is when temps swing drastically during the day.

when i built my house i used a water level to set the foundation as i did not have any help to view thru my transit. This was in the days before laser levels. When i got all done i shot points all around and it was all level. Could not have done any better with a laser level.

 

[bcp]

About the tubing for a water level: Instead of a very long clear tubing, get about 4-6 feet of 1/2 in clear, cut it in half, add a male hose fitting to one piece and a female to the other. Use one or more of your garden hoses in between. You can use more hoses with a valve and a garden hose Y to fill the water level from your house faucet after you get it into place.



Bruce

 

[ponytug]

About the tubing for a water level: Instead of a very long clear tubing, get about 4-6 feet of 1/2 in clear, cut it in half, add a male hose fitting to one piece and a female to the other. Use one or more of your garden hoses in between. You can use more hoses with a valve and a garden hose Y to fill the water level from your house faucet after you get it into place.

View attachment 856931

Bruce

That's how mine is rigged!

 

[CliffordK]

What is the range of rotary laser levels? Perhaps they work best in low light conditions, so dusk, dawn, or after dark.

 

[hosspuller]

I used a water level kit that's two clear tubes connected by garden hose. The nice thing about the garden hose is one can use a faucet to fill the hose with water. Let it run to get all the air out. Getting the air out is key to it's accuracy.

 

[LDR812]

If my math is correct a 1/2 degree slope is about 10 inches of fall in a 100 feet

 

[LDR812]

Messed that reply up - was explaining that I’ve been saying degrees slope when I meant percent! Wasn’t following the 10” per 100 ft = .5 degree. I’m only going to have about 6 inches drop on a 100ft run, so half a percent

 

[newbury]

I started using water levels in about 1963, helping my Grandfather lay the foundation & basement for our 60'x30' duplex. He used it for keeping the cinder block absolutely level. Laser's would have been nice, but water and hose worked.
With the advent of cheap plastic tubing, like for aquarium air pumps, we moved to using a roll of tubing, a adequate food coloring in the water, and a gallon jug. Didn't work well at lower temps because the hose got stiff. But rolled up small, easy to deploy and very accurate.

 

[NoTrespassing]

I started using water levels in about 1963, helping my Grandfather lay the foundation & basement for our 60'x30' duplex. He used it for keeping the cinder block absolutely level. Laser's would have been nice, but water and hose worked.
With the advent of cheap plastic tubing, like for aquarium air pumps, we moved to using a roll of tubing, a adequate food coloring in the water, and a gallon jug. Didn't work well at lower temps because the hose got stiff. But rolled up small, easy to deploy and very accurate.

A cheap gallon of colored windshield washer fluid won't freeze.

 

[bdhsfz6]

What is the range of rotary laser levels? Perhaps they work best in low light conditions, so dusk, dawn, or after dark.

I have a Bosch rotary laser that I use for ceiling & flooring installations. To use it outside, I bought this laser line detector:

DEWALT DW0892G Laser Detector, Green - Amazon.com

DEWALT DW0892G Laser Detector, Green - Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

It works well outdoors in bright sun with a range of over 250'. It clips to the range rod and is easily moved to spots anywhere along a trench.

 

[4570Man]

What is the range of rotary laser levels? Perhaps they work best in low light conditions, so dusk, dawn, or after dark.

The laser transit systems have a receiver to pick up the beam. They can work fine in full sun. I just got done using mine on a job yesterday in full sun. Mine claims to shoot a 2600 ft radius so in theory you can work in a circle almost a mile in diameter. I’ve never actually tested that claim. I usually work within a hundred ft radius.

 

[MossRoad]

I've used a water level several times when laying out foundations. I keep 100' of maybe 3/8" clear vinyl tubing coiled up in a kitty litter bucket. When I want to use it, I remove the tubing from the bucket, fill the bucket with water and some food coloring. Then I siphon the bucket with the tubing to fill the tube. Works great.

I used it a few years ago on our 24x24 garage addition. It's within 1/4" everywhere, so I was happy.

 

[dodge man]

A rotary laser does have its limitations for accuracy at long distances. For technical reasons the accuracy beyond 300 starts to drop off. This is the case with optical levels also. For dirt grading, laying field tile and other rough work. For something like paving you should keep your shots under 300 feet.

1/2 a foot in a 100 feet is pretty flat but if you lay the pipe carefully it will work.