Water Well 101......A few questions from a water well newbie

[Valveman]

The average life of all pumps is seven years. There are lots of people who get 20-30 years out of their pump. But for everyone of those there is a pump that was cycled to death in just a few months or even days. Pressure tanks only hold 25% water. So, a 20 gallon tank only holds 5 gallons, and causes LOTS of cycling as it goes on and off for every 5 gallons used. Areas with cold water and very little irrigation can have pumps last a long time. Areas that need lots of irrigation or other uses for water don't last nearly as long. Also, the smaller the pump, the more cycling it can tolerate. I guarantee you a 1.5 or 2HP pump with a 20 gallon tank won't last through the warranty period.

And yes the old pressure tank is simple and proven. The only problem with pressure tank systems is that they cycle on and off too much. This cycling greatly shortens the life of pumps, causes up and down pressure fluctuations as well as water hammer. Adding a simple spring operated Cycle Stop Valve to the old traditional pressure tank system is also very simple and solves all the problems.

People who have pumps that last 20-30 years are not the best placer to get advice. Talk to people who have had lots of pump problems and you will see how bad cycling on/off can be. If you never had that problem your just lucky and you won't understand how big a problem it is to most people.

 

[MarkF48]

I got 35 years out of a Gould's submersible I installed back in 1986. Replaced it in late 2019 when I had the well hydro-fracked simply on the premise I was on borrowed time with a pump that old and wasn't sure of the condition of the impellers at the age. Fed into a 40 gallon bladder tank and adjusted to about 30-50. Pressure switch has a low pressure cutout which a couple times prevented the pump from sucking air (toilet fill valve got stuck open one time). Well guy that did the recent work attributed the longevity of the pump to the tank size and not cycling the pump as much as would happen with a smaller tank. I also have a cistern tank and pump setup that collects rain water from roof gutter runoff for summer garden watering and filling a small swimming pool.

 

[lakngulf]

I got 35 years out of a Gould's submersible I installed back in 1986. Replaced it in late 2019 when I had the well hydro-fracked simply on the premise I was on borrowed time with a pump that old and wasn't sure of the condition of the impellers at the age. Fed into a 40 gallon bladder tank and adjusted to about 30-50. Pressure switch has a low pressure cutout which a couple times prevented the pump from sucking air (toilet fill valve got stuck open one time). Well guy that did the recent work attributed the longevity of the pump to the tank size and not cycling the pump as much as would happen with a smaller tank. I also have a cistern tank and pump setup that collects rain water from roof gutter runoff for summer garden watering and filling a small swimming pool.

What is the process for replacing a submersible? I am assuming all the pipe has to come out. Is it all then replaced with new? Knock on wood I am working on 25 years (so good to know I still have 10 more.....ha)

 

[MarkF48]

What is the process for replacing a submersible? I am assuming all the pipe has to come out. Is it all then replaced with new? Knock on wood I am working on 25 years (so good to know I still have 10 more.....ha)

These guys replaced the pump and pipe. I went deeper with the pump, so new pipe without a coupling was the best way to go. Previous work I needed done (chafed and broken wire from the pump torque/twist) the pump company had a rig that pulled up the pipe and pump and it was laid out across the lawn.

 

[Valveman]

Well guy that did the recent work attributed the longevity of the pump to the tank size and not cycling the pump as much as would happen with a smaller tank.

Exactly! And 30 years ago installing a larger tank was the best option. But even with the smaller tank a CSV system will cycle less, which according to your well guy will make the pump last even longer.

 

[Valveman]

Knock on wood I am working on 25 years (so good to know I still have 10 more.....ha)

Sorry but you are already working on borrowed time. And they don't make pumps like they did 25-30 years ago and they will take even less cycling than they use to. Set aside some money. Research VFD's or variable speed pumps so you don't get talked into one of those. Unfortunately you will soon get to see the process for replacing a submersible pump. It will be at the worst possible time and you won't have 5 minutes to make up your mind. Do your research now and be ready when the time comes.

 

[Valveman]

Previous work I needed done (chafed and broken wire from the pump torque/twist) the pump company had a rig that pulled up the pipe and pump and it was laid out across the lawn.

Almost every problem you could have with a pump system is caused by cycling on and off too much. If it doesn't get the motor first, the wire will chaf like yours did or something else. Failures to pressure switches, tank diaphragms, check valves, start capacitors, start relays, and nearly every component of a pump system are destroyed usually sooner rather than later by the pump cycling on and off.

 

[lakngulf]

Almost every problem you could have with a pump system is caused by cycling on and off too much. If it doesn't get the motor first, the wire will chaf like yours did or something else. Failures to pressure switches, tank diaphragms, check valves, start capacitors, start relays, and nearly every component of a pump system are destroyed usually sooner rather than later by the pump cycling on and off.

Must a well pump be submersed? Are some wells run with pump at top? Or would that take too much power to pull water up?
I have an irrigation pump with pipe about 200 feet into the lake and it does well. But I know horizontal pull and vertical are day and night.

 

[MF RED in MT]

Sorry but you are already working on borrowed time. And they don't make pumps like they did 25-30 years ago and they will take even less cycling than they use to. Set aside some money. Research VFD's or variable speed pumps so you don't get talked into one of those. Unfortunately you will soon get to see the process for replacing a submersible pump. It will be at the worst possible time and you won't have 5 minutes to make up your mind. Do your research now and be ready when the time comes.

I thought there was a way to check the life and/or performance status of a submersible pump by using an amp meter on each leg of the pump while it's running?

If you or someone knows about this, please school us homeowners, thanks.

KC

 

[turnkey4099]

What is the process for replacing a submersible? I am assuming all the pipe has to come out. Is it all then replaced with new? Knock on wood I am working on 25 years (so good to know I still have 10 more.....ha)

Yes, all the pipe has to come ouit as the the pump hangs from the bottom of it. Well service peope have trucks with booms and make the operation look very simple.

I am in the "Palouse" of easstern Washington. Soil and water here eats galvanized pipe for breakfast. I had a major system leak a few years ago. Traced to a hole in the down pipe right above the pump. I had them replace the galvanized with a special plastic just for down pipes.