Comparison weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage

   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage
  • Thread Starter
#21  
OkieG, I just noticed in your bio that you're an anesthesiologist. I got something you may enjoy. I recently heard of a new drug coming out in the Fentanyl family to join Sufenta, Alfenta, etc. It's going to be a "designer" drug, Oscar de la Fenta . (Sorry for the corn! I am a hospital pharmacist, BTW.)

UncleAl
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #22  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

<font color="blue">Interesting. Have you tryed moving snow w/ the turf tires yet? </font>

Nope. Got them in april. Also, don't have to. Price was so good on the turfs that I kept the R4's for the wintertime (already had chains for them).
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #23  
i would go with the samller tractor with UNLOADED R4's any tire will pretty much rip up a wet lawn. as wet as it has been here even my walk behind trim mower leaves marks /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #24  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

April huh...I still had feet of snow then...the coast must be much warmer than inland a bit.

So you run chains w/ your R4s? Do you push or blow the snow?
jimg
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #25  
I might have missed something, but, has anybody thought about what kind of loader work are we going to do? That would seem to me to make the difference here. What kind of weight, how far travel when loaded?? I have a 48" bucket on my FEL and it seems to do fine with the ballast box. No loaded tires, but, I didn't want turf tires either. I have not had a problem with the turf.
My tire distributor said if it gets to be a problem you can use a tire groover and take off the edges of the bars.
As far as the gravel being spread, It took me just about an hour to level and spread 20 tons the other day, sure was fun, I mean work!
I cut 4 acres Saturday up north in less than two hours, several out buildings, 28 trees. Terrain somewhat rolling, nothing too awful bad.
Just my .02
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #26  
I forgot one thing, there is a whole thread on the plastic vs steel issue. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #27  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

<font color="blue"> the coast must be much warmer than inland a bit. </font>

yup - we got tons of snow this winter (8-9ft), but we tend to warm up faster in the spring near the coast. I am pushing the snow with a rear blade & the FEL. I've started to piece together a front blade for the tractor w/ hydraulic angle.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage
  • Thread Starter
#28  
Hambone, thanks for "weighing in." Sounds like your 62" MMM rig will cover mowing about 2X faster than I presently can.
Just for starters for loader: <ul type="square"> [*] As mentioned, I will be using loader to level out the yard some, maybe get a box blade as well. I have a dirt pile left over from building my shop that I can spread out, will get more hauled in as needed. [*] We have an old 3' tall cinder block retaining wall, cracked, leaning pretty bad. I'm going to pull it down and reshape the bank, probably replace the wall with something else, using the loader to move the junk off and move new materials in. [*] I have a stand of bamboo that is taking over one corner of the yard. I've been hacking at it for years. The roots only go about 6" deep. The loader + tooth bar should make short work of this pest. [*] The area around our garden is in need of reshaping, needs loader attention. [*] Our driveway (gravel) is 400' long. I promised several years ago to get it paved, will use loader after the paving guys finish. [*] I have other projects in mind, but don't want to get too long-winded. [/list]

UncleAl
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #29  
R4 tires are a scam and abomination. If most of your work is pulling and dirt engaging with rear implements in dry soil, get R1's. If the foregoing in wet soil, R1W's. If mostly mowing, definitely R3's. If you are doing lots of continuous and heavy loader and backhoe work in rubble-strewn construction sites or rock quarries, then and only then get R4's.

With a ground contact mower, whether MMM or RMM, the weight of the mower will be supported by the mower's wheels, not by the tractor's wheels. Hence you don't need to add the weight of the mower to the weight of the tractor.

90% mowing on 6.7 acres, four finish mowing. The answer is lighter tractor with R3's and no fill. More specifically, the Kubota B7800.

Now you can torture yourself over the question of whether to get a MMM or RMM.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage
  • Thread Starter
#30  
glennmac,
I agree that the weight of the mower is borne by the mower's wheels, concede that the tractor + mower weight is not valid. Truly, the tractor weight is the significant question. Throwing around extra weight = more turf turmoil. I think you're right about my needing a lighter tractor. MMM vs RFM, I've used MMM all my life and I feel it's better because of all my trees (present and future) and the need to break in my 14 year old son to "the joys of mowing." Feel that it would be easier on him and my other younger (future mower) kids to go MMM. Is an R1W the same as the "Galaxy" tire I see in the brochures?

Just curious: I noticed in your bio </font><font color="blue" class="small">( Hours: 350 on B2910; 35 on former BX2200 )</font>. My guess is the BX didn't work out for your needs and you moved up to B2910. Comments please? (I checked out / priced a BX22 today, not bad looking except lack of cruise control will make for tired right leg/foot.) Thanks for your input.

UncleAl
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #31  
This crusise control thing is a non issue. The pedal effort on the BX is so low I could mow for days and not have a tired foot--it is a non issue---especially if you have trees and obstacles to mow around.
Oh I love that R4 tires are an abomination and a scam!!! This could get real good /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif. There are times I wish I had turf tires on the 2410 and love the R1Ws on the BX. I wish there were a tire with more puncture resistence and slightly stronger sidewalls than the typical turf I have seen. All in all, R4s ride rough even deflated and have marginally better traction than turfs but they don't get flats often and I like that. Turfs on a 7500/2410/7800 might be a good choice or a BX with the fat little R1 they come standard with is also fairly mild on all but the softest turf. You said 90% finish mowing so I still recommend the BX with it's fully suspended deck. J
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage
  • Thread Starter
#32  
TresCrows,
Thanks for your input. I'm really leaning hard toward the BX22. I understand limitations of loader and backhoe on this machine (I read glennmac's past threads after my reply), but I think I would cover my needs with the BX. I've also come to peace with lack of cruise, based on my reading last night and your comment. I was just thinking about my past mowing experience: set the hand throttle, feet are free to dance around on the tractor, prop on the hood, whatever. About the tires, I asked the dealer about including a second set of tires & wheels (turfs installed, R1's on the side). He offered to include 2nd set for $265. Worth it to have 2nd set or should I just stick with turfs? My yard is usually not too soft, but this spring has been exceptionally wet.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #33  
glenmac,
Great reply, for most of what we do on our small machines turf tires are highly underrated and the dealers really do "oversell" the r4's.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #34  
Just my 2 cents. I've been struggling with the same issue. I need to mow 4 acres, need loader & backhoe as well. I don't recommend a garden tractor. I have a JD 400 with a 60" deck, and it still takes me 6 hours to mow. I found the new CUT's to be much more nimble and can mow much faster, as the weight keeps it from getting thrown around.
I'd pretty much decided on the BX until I demo'd it. The loader seemed too small and I want a full cat. 1 for some ag implements.
Anyway, I'm now leaning towards the JD 4115 or 4110. A little bigger than the bx, bigger 3 pt. with position control and a much bigger loader bucket (61") and greater lifting capacity with the FEL. I also need to get pallet forks, and I can do so with the 4110/4115. Plus the deck is still suspended, you can still get a mulcher, and it is still real manuverable. And, if I add the front snow thrower, it has hydraulic chute rotation. They also weigh a lot less than the other bigger tractors you are looking at. They are also coming out with a model 46 backhoe for the 4100/4115, so that option is open (there is a thread in JD buying.)
That being said, the BX is still a heck of a machine, and it did mow well. At about twice the speed of my Garden tractor. Hope this helps. Of course, it seems that a soon as I lean one direction, something comes up to change my mind...
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #35  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

Well, this all all rather interesting. I asked this question (which tires are appropriate) in the recent past and most of the replies were along the lines of R4s are a no brainer. Heres what Im doing....loader work, pulling stumps and rocks, mending rock walls, blowing snow (lots of it), finish mowing, some brush cutting (mostly just high grass) and moving hay wagons around. Most of what Im doing says ag tires exc the finish mowing which Id estimate at less than 50% of the time. OTOH I dont want to destroy what passes for a lawn either. So, do you think turf tires are up to this? Im not sure they are. Id really like to use ag tires but dont have a clue how hard theyd be on the lawn. Any input would be appreciated. jimg
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #36  
UncleAl, if he is going to give you two sets of tires for that price, take them.
Big, little, it is all a compromise. I love my BX and find that it is about 90% capable of my 2410 and sometimes it is actually faster at moving dirt and it mows faster also. The 2410 kicks it's rear with the boxblade and hogging.
I somehow, being a nice person in person, have become saddled with mowing, thanks to my wife, about 20 acres of hay since none of my immediate neighbor's Sears riding mowers can take on the task. I was sitting there looking at the unit drinking coffee my wife had just brought me when I said something like "you know, I think I need a bigger tractor". She ran into the house and called my mother /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif to tell on me.
Hmmmm, if I had a bigger tractor, I could sell the 2410, keep the BX and get a riding mower ZD thingy and----------- /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
J
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #37  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

Jim -- I have loaded aggies on my L3010 and use a rear discharge finish mower on my 7 acre meadow, about 3 acres of which is lawn. Unless I'm mowing after a protracted spell of rain, I really don't see what all the fuss is about. Aside from a couple of strips where the grass gets torn up -- more a function of the fact that my tractor lives in 4WD than a problem with the aggies -- my lawn looks great! And the funny thing is that when I mow too soon in the season when the ground is still mucky from snowmelt, the ruts are caused by my skinny mower tires and not from the ags.

BTW: I had turfs on my last tractor (a little B1750) and they spun going uphill if the slope was wet. I had more damage from the turfs than I ever had with the aggies. Of course, my land is anything but flat...

Glennmac got it right on this call. Pete
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #38  
Re: weight for loader work versus mowing yard dama

Pete,
Thanx very much!! My land is slopes off rather abruptly...flat at the top and bottom. The soil is also sandy and in spots the grass is rather thin mostly from the dry conditions of the past few yrs. I ujst didnt want to destroy the little grass there is on the hill and create an erosion problem. Thanx again! jimg
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage #39  
In the interest of full disclosure, my evolving and negative views of R4 tires are contrary to conventional wisdom and practice. Most CUTs sold today are sold, lemminglike, with R4's. I will publish a rant against R4's separately when I finish my radial tire research. In short, my view is that they are not much better for traction on wet grass or slide-inducing diagonal slopes than turfs, they are just as bad (useless) in mud, get flats in the front like any other front tire, are usually cheap Titans, have no special virtue in snow, and mark up lawns the same as R1's (assuming R1's will mark a given dry lawn much at all, which is unlikely). Moreover, they are a profit pack for the dealer. Note how R4's cost $860 dollars more than than R1's for the Kubota 3130, half that for the 3830, and half that again for the 4630.

No, R1W tires are not offered by any CUT manufacturer that I am aware of. R1W's (the "W" is for wet soil) are wider and have much deeper lugs than R1's. CUT manufacturers all offer an R1 tire/wheel package (now mostly as a price teaser to yuppies and other weekend diggers), one or more overpriced R3 packages (a Galaxy Turf is a very wide, high flotation, shallow tread R3), and an extremely overpriced and usually low ply R4 package.

The BX is a great and nimble mower for 4 acres. The BX22 is an especially clever multi-machine for people who need only modest fel and bh capability. I traded my BX for a 2910 because I quickly realized that the BX did not have the hydraulic capability, power, or size to do all the other-than-mowing chores I realized tractors could do (but only after I had bought one)--namely, cutting acres of very heavy woody brush and digging out stumps, logs and rocks.

I briefly considered getting a RMM for my 2910 when I bought it, but at that time issued a fatwah declaring jihad against myself for considering such heresy and blasphemy. Now, three years later, I am very seriously considering moving up to the 3130, one key reason being so I can use a blessed and sacred RMM mower (as well as installing custom R1W tires). The change in faith was caused by all the experience I have gotten driving backwards with my shredder and backblade, and by the type mowing obstacles I have to negotiate (the kind you have to mow under--like bushes, small trees, evergreens, and crouching supermodels--or the kind you have to mow over from a safe distance--like creek banks, pond edges, muddy holes, and cliffs).

I would get turfs in my current situation (now mostly lawn and field mowing about 7 acres) in a heartbeat were it not for my wet and muddy Oozama Ver Boten.
 
   / weight for loader work versus mowing yard damage
  • Thread Starter
#40  
glennmac, you obviously have put alot of time and thought into this subject. Thanks for the reply and I look forward to future info from you regarding this. I don't want to steal your thunder, but I took a minute to ask Google about "R1W tire" attached is a picture that is on the MichelinAG site
 

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