What is latest opinion/position on BX series slow braking (is it an issue or not)?

4570Man · Sep 25, 2015

My L3240 stops abruptly when you let of the pedal. The only time I use the brakes to slow down is when I am running on the road in high gear going downhill. It still stops abruptly, but it redlines the engine. The B7100 stops more abruptly. If you completely let off the pedal it actually locks the wheels and skids to a stop.

SLIMSHADIE · Sep 25, 2015

Found it in the workshop manual,
Pretty much full rpm's and full bore in 2wd in high and stop within 10', on level ground preferably concrete. Mine was 9.xx something. Again I'm used to mine so its not as issue for me.

Toolguy · Sep 25, 2015

The stopping distance will be more or less depending on what gear you are in. Just like engine braking, the lower the gear the more braking you have. The higher the gear the less braking you will have. My B3030 stops abruptly in low, less abruptly in medium and even less in high. Seems normal to me. About the only time I use the brakes is for parking. It will slowly roll even if on a slight incline. I would never rely on the HST to stop me in a panic situation. That is what the brakes are for. I don't understand some of the comments regarding needing to stop quickly to avoid running into a building or a person. I slow down when I get near stationary objects that are in the way. If I run into something I consider it my fault, not the machine's. We are only moving very slowly when doing close loader work. I have no problem controlling my tractor with just the HST pedal. Higher speeds are for open areas away from obstacles. That is how I do it anyway.

TripleR · Sep 26, 2015

Toolguy said:
The stopping distance will be more or less depending on what gear you are in. Just like engine braking, the lower the gear the more braking you have. The higher the gear the less braking you will have. My B3030 stops abruptly in low, less abruptly in medium and even less in high. Seems normal to me. About the only time I use the brakes is for parking. It will slowly roll even if on a slight incline. I would never rely on the HST to stop me in a panic situation. That is what the brakes are for. I don't understand some of the comments regarding needing to stop quickly to avoid running into a building or a person. I slow down when I get near stationary objects that are in the way. If I run into something I consider it my fault, not the machine's. We are only moving very slowly when doing close loader work. I have no problem controlling my tractor with just the HST pedal. Higher speeds are for open areas away from obstacles. That is how I do it anyway.

To clarify my position at least, I am not talking about a "panic situation", but rather normal operating procedures including slow operation in which the machine continues to creep after you release the pedal. When I first bought my BX2200, it would continue to move slowly after releasing the pedal at even very slow speeds. A visit by the dealer where he adjusted it properly and no more problems.

Here is one of the videos some are possibly referring to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTW799DEwNM

One working properly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i989UEPtPLg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQJdQ7PSAvQ

k0ua · Sep 26, 2015

TripleR said:
To clarify my position at least, I am not talking about a "panic situation", but rather normal operating procedures including slow operation in which the machine continues to creep after you release the pedal. When I first bought my BX2200, it would continue to move slowly after releasing the pedal at even very slow speeds. A visit by the dealer where he adjusted it properly and no more problems.

Here is one of the videos some are possibly referring to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTW799DEwNM

One working properly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i989UEPtPLg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQJdQ7PSAvQ

I agree with Paul shorts, his machine is NOT SAFE. I would not own that machine.

I had no idea the problem was that bad.

mshumack · Sep 26, 2015

Yup - those are some of the videos I watched.
My concern is that the grounds I maintain are heavily overgrow with hanging vines and such. I have been mowing close the edge of woods and had vines tangle on me (once around my neck and around the controls). When this happens my instinct is to let go of the forward speed control (my current lawn tractor is a hand operated fwd-rev lever).

I would like the machine to stop quickly when I "release" everything (whether pedal or hand throttle) otherwise the vines, or whatever could cause me injury. I don't know if I would be able to hit the brake pedal fast enough. Usually by the time I figure out what happened the event is over. I would have a better chance of a quick stop if the brake pedal was next to the HST pedal like in a car. I use the vines as an example but there are many examples of needing the tractor to stop due to unexpected obstacles.

Toolguy · Sep 26, 2015

Wow! If my tractor acted like the one in the first video, that would be a problem. I did not realize it was that bad . Seems like the pedal is not going into neutral quick enough. My tractor is more like the second and third videos. Thanks.

JOHNTHOMAS · Sep 26, 2015

k0ua said:
All I can tell you is of the three hydro tractors I have owned. A New Holland, a Kubota and now the Kioti. It is not normal. The hydro should stop you rather abruptly if you jerk your foot off of the pedal even on a hill. After a few seconds on a steep enough hill they will drift downhill like a snail if you do not press the brake or a little reverse direction pedal. But we are literally talking a snail's pace of the downhill drift. To come to a smooth stop in a hydro tractor you release the directional pedal slowly or the stop will be quite abrupt. This is the way all three I have owned have worked.

AGREE

TripleR said:
I have had four Kubotas, still have three, two John Deere SCUTs and still have one and pretty much agree with James k0ua. I would be very uncomfortable with one on which you had to brake to stop, I can't remember the last time I use brakes on any of them beyond holding absolutely still on a steep slope.

AGREE

Code54 said:
It seems the dampener they put on to avoid the abrupt stop now makes it slow so gently it creeps - they just need to find the happy medium!

The BXxx50 series from several years ago did the abrupt stop in reverse only. Then Kubota corrected the problem with the BXxx60 series for several years and now has came out with the BXxx70 series so why would a corrected problem from years ago in REVERSE ONLY even be considered as having anything to do with todays issue?

k0ua said:
I agree, loading a truck or working with a groundman doing landscaping could really be bad.. I would not like it at all.

I don't like it at all when doing close work where close counts

4570Man said:
My L3240 stops abruptly when you let of the pedal. The only time I use the brakes to slow down is when I am running on the road in high gear going downhill. It still stops abruptly, but it redlines the engine. The B7100 stops more abruptly. If you completely let off the pedal it actually locks the wheels and skids to a stop.

Working like an HST has always worked for almost or around 17 new Kubotas HSTs I've owned

Toolguy said:
The stopping distance will be more or less depending on what gear you are in. Just like engine braking, the lower the gear the more braking you have. The higher the gear the less braking you will have. My B3030 stops abruptly in low, less abruptly in medium and even less in high. Seems normal to me. About the only time I use the brakes is for parking. It will slowly roll even if on a slight incline. I would never rely on the HST to stop me in a panic situation. That is what the brakes are for. I don't understand some of the comments regarding needing to stop quickly to avoid running into a building or a person. I slow down when I get near stationary objects that are in the way. If I run into something I consider it my fault, not the machine's. We are only moving very slowly when doing close loader work. I have no problem controlling my tractor with just the HST pedal. Higher speeds are for open areas away from obstacles. That is how I do it anyway.

And that's how I've always perated and this one doesn't work like all the others I've owned in the HST transmission. I always work very slowly when doing close work and have hit buildings before and it was my fault. Still my fault now because I know this current BX25 doesn't totally stop, it just reacts like all other HSTs stopping depending on releasing the pedal speed except the final pedal release doesn't totally stop it like all othe HSTs I've owned does. Compound the non "total" stop with the brake being moved makes it even worse for me. I know people that have one tractor and don't know different have opinions and that's great but people that have bought and owned several have opinions of proper or expected operating features based on actual use over years and many hours vs the manual. Most of us buy based on experience and don't buy a manual first to study and learn and determine the changes that are often times hidden in the small print on a back page.

TripleR said:
To clarify my position at least, I am not talking about a "panic situation", but rather normal operating procedures including slow operation in which the machine continues to creep after you release the pedal. When I first bought my BX2200, it would continue to move slowly after releasing the pedal at even very slow speeds. A visit by the dealer where he adjusted it properly and no more problems.
This is what I'm talking about but now adjustment doesn't work and no one admits it's wrong even though it's different than every other HST on the lot.
Here is one of the videos some are possibly referring to: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTW799DEwNM

One working properly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i989UEPtPLg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQJdQ7PSAvQ

I don't mow with my tractors. I use the FEL and BH which operates OK above an idle. I don't know why anyone would expect to operate the FEL or BH at an idle or just above. I rev my engine to operating rpms but that's just me. Any way, I expect my HST tractor to stop by releasing the forward go pedal, quicker based on quicker speed of foot release and slower based on slower speed of foot release and to stop when the pedal is totally released. Even back push at super slow speed is doable with me but when it then starts going forward again after the back push tells me something is WRONG with the operation of the HST. My BX25D-1 is usable. It would be great for someone that has never owned one before that won't realize it's not functioning properly and just because a company tells you it is within proper parameters doesn't make it operating properly for what it is.