What is latest opinion/position on BX series slow braking (is it an issue or not)?

[BXpanded]

I own a BX 2350 so my comments might or might not be revelant. I suspect the setup is similar.

First off, mine is the kind that is supposed to stop suddenly and it does but I also had problems with it creeping forward.

This problem is worse when cold. It also worse when just partly pushing the Hst pedal down. If the pedal is floored and let go of suddenly, it stops quickly. It's worse in high range because you are less likely to have the pedal floored, as you feather it mine will often still creep forward.

I've spent quite a bit of time studying the linkage and think the main large return spring isn't stretched very much at light pedal applications, hence poor return.

I disconnected the dampener on mine and that helped, but it's still a problem.

Greasing the linkage doesn't seem to help. I disconnected the linkage from the pedal and it pivots freely, grease or no grease.

I think cutting part of a coil out of the main return spring would cure it. It might also cause problems, such as aggravating the sudden stop, increased pedal effort, and probably other things I've haven't thought about.

Is having the tractor creep forward a safety issue? It seems so to me.

The manual for the BX24 which is a 50 series machine, (50 series includes BX24, and BX2350) calls out the adjustment of the neutral spring as a 100 hour "Service Intervals" maintenance item in the "Maintenance of the Tractor" section. The same maintenance requirement is shown in the manual for the 70 Series BX25D (the 70 series includes the BX25D and BX25D-1, BX2370 et al.) .

I have performed this adjustment on the 50 Series and it is quite easy.

The 60 series(BX25, BX2360,..) implemented the dual action damper that is apparently still used today in the 70 series. Although I don't have a 60 series manual, I would guess that the warnings are the same as those in the earlier and later series. (Citation needed from a 60 series owner)

There is a diagram in each manual that shows the HST Neutral adjusting nut. The diagrams are different for the 50 series than for the 70 series due to the change in the damper but are very similar.

Both of these manuals state, "WARNING To avoid personal injury: Do not operate if tractor moves on level ground with foot off speed control pedal. If tractor moves on level ground with foot off the pedal, or, is too slow in returning to "NEUTRAL" position when removing the foot from the pedal, consult your local KUBOTA dealer."

Whether it's a 50, 60 or 70 series machine, If it "ain't stopping" on flat ground, it is out of adjustment or some part is malfunctioning.

WARNING is the 2nd highest ranking, 2nd most serious, notice flag used in the KUBOTA manual so it is not to be ignored. If your dealer can't fix it, contact Kubota. I'm pretty sure they'll find someone who can

 

[dodge man]

I've played with that adjustment on mine, it helped a little but not much.

 

[SPYDERLK]

The manual for the BX24 which is a 50 series machine, (50 series includes BX24, and BX2350) calls out the adjustment of the neutral spring as a 100 hour "Service Intervals" maintenance item in the "Maintenance of the Tractor" section. The same maintenance requirement is shown in the manual for the 70 Series BX25D (the 70 series includes the BX25D and BX25D-1, BX2370 et al.) .

I have performed this adjustment on the 50 Series and it is quite easy.

The 60 series(BX25, BX2360,..) implemented the dual action damper that is apparently still used today in the 70 series. Although I don't have a 60 series manual, I would guess that the warnings are the same as those in the earlier and later series. (Citation needed from a 60 series owner)

There is a diagram in each manual that shows the HST Neutral adjusting nut. The diagrams are different for the 50 series than for the 70 series due to the change in the damper but are very similar.

Both of these manuals state, "WARNING To avoid personal injury: Do not operate if tractor moves on level ground with foot off speed control pedal. If tractor moves on level ground with foot off the pedal, or, is too slow in returning to "NEUTRAL" position when removing the foot from the pedal, consult your local KUBOTA dealer."

Whether it's a 50, 60 or 70 series machine, If it "ain't stopping" on flat ground, it is out of adjustment or some part is malfunctioning.

WARNING is the 2nd highest ranking, 2nd most serious, notice flag used in the KUBOTA manual so it is not to be ignored. If your dealer can't fix it, contact Kubota. I'm pretty sure they'll find someone who can

Based on perceptions from reading this thread and related links, Id place this in the "Famous Last Words" category.

 

[mshumack]

Both of these manuals state, "WARNING To avoid personal injury: Do not operate if tractor moves on level ground with foot off speed control pedal. If tractor moves on level ground with foot off the pedal, or, is too slow in returning to "NEUTRAL" position when removing the foot from the pedal, consult your local kubota dealer."

I believe this is referring to "creep" not the braking issue discussed here.

 

[TMGT]

Seems like a lot of misinformation being put out by a few people in this thread. From what I've seen and drove non of these tractors are "freewheeling". While it might not stop as abruptly as other models it still stops (if it creeps too much then it needs to be adjusted), if you need to stop faster then there is a brake pedal.

My truck slows quicker then my commuter car but that doesn't mean it's dangerous, just have to adjust to what you're operating.

I'm failing to see how these tractors are "dangerous", people should be aware of how their equipment operates as most operate differently. Seems these threads are full of opinions on how people WANT or THINK their tractor should operate and less on that it's operating as intended by the manufacture (as has been shown by the owners that have taken the time to actually test stopping distance).

Seems when something doesn't operate the way they WANT, they condemn it as dangerous.

Guess this comes from operating different hydro and gear tractors, including hydro's that aren't designed to center to neutral when there isn't any input.

 

[AxleHub]

Seems like a lot of misinformation being put out by a few people in this thread. From what I've seen and drove non of these tractors are "freewheeling". While it might not stop as abruptly as other models it still stops (if it creeps too much then it needs to be adjusted), if you need to stop faster then there is a brake.

. . . .

Guess this comes from operating different hydro and gear tractors, including hydro's that aren't designed to center to neutral when there isn't any input.

Well I'd probablybe considered "one of the few"

So if as you say you've driven/operated many different units, then I assume you had one or two you liked better than the others.

Its that way with those who have owned or driven Kubota BX product for years and years. Their hst operated well on hills and slopes. Now if they have or look to buy a new BX25 product they find it changed.

You're putting the responsibility on the customer to "make do" with their 18,000 dollar investment on something that was fine for many years. Why shouldn't Kubota have to "make it right" rather than the customer "make do" ?

If Kubota never had it right then its a different story. But they always hadit right and now don't.

Just yesterday I drove an 1800 dollar lawn mower down a 19 degree slope and the hst didn't require me to touch the brake. So for a dozen years Kubota bx25 type models was the same way and now it doesn't even match an 1800 dollar mower's hst.

 

[tractorshopper]

Wow, interesting thread. Just read it all.

Before finding this thread, I didn't know this "problem" existed.

I have a BX-2370-1. I previously had an L3800. My BX does not stop as abruptly as my L did. That is a fact. It feels more smooth to a stop. I noticed this difference right away. Comparing to my old lawn mower, it may be a little more smooth as well. Either way, I wouldn't consider this to be free wheeling per se. If I let up on a slope, the tractor smoothly stops. I'll need to measure this now that I know I have a problem. I consider free wheeling where the tractor would literally run down a slope with no resistance while not using the pedal. Mine hasn't done this.

Maybe I haven't had this issue because I use 4X4 most of the time. I do have slopes both at home and at the property. Pretty good ones indeed. I haven't found anything yet that I would say has been unsafe; just different.

When mowing, I have been able to stop and reverse on some of my steeper slopes to make a turn. Something my old lawn mower would never have done. I think you just need to learn the feel of it and if the feel bothers you, then it is a problem for you. It hasn't been a problem for me as I've learned the feel of it and am perfectly comfortable.

It is very true that all our pucker factors are different. I am very satisfied with mine so far. Others may not be. That is okay for us to be different. I feel like someone else already mentioned, that the HST controls movement, the brake is the ultimate device for stopping and staying stopped.

I do use my brake very infrequently, but haven't ever noticed it being in an emergency situation or a situation where I wouldn't have just expected I did need to use it.

Going forward, I will pay more attention to when and why I am using it since my awareness is up so I can report back here with facts instead of feelings. All I can say right now is that mine feels just fine to me and I got used to it very quickly.

Mine doesn't roll backward like Paul Shorts. It does probably roll forward similarly, but it's hard to tell from his video because he's farther away from the camera in the forward motion check.

 

[AxleHub]

Wow, interesting thread. Just read it all.

Before finding this thread, I didn't know this "problem" existed.

I have a BX-2370-1. I previously had an L3800. My BX does not stop as abruptly as my L did. That is a fact. It feels more smooth to a stop. I noticed this difference right away. Comparing to my old lawn mower, it may be a little more smooth as well. Either way, I wouldn't consider this to be free wheeling per se. . . . . .

Greetings Tractorshopper. A nice and informing post. At this point it appears that the issue is reported on multiple BX25D-1 units. Nothing is known one way or the other on the other BX 2015 (-1 version) products. It would be nice for readers to know if it is limited to just one model (even if it is the most popular model the BX25D-1).

 

[tractorshopper]

AxleHub, thanks. Please note that the only difference in a BX-25D-1 and a BX-2370-1 is the sub-frame addition on the 25D for the backhoe. The units are identical otherwise. My brother has the BX-25D-1.

 

[AxleHub]

AxleHub, thanks. Please note that the only difference in a BX-25D-1 and a BX-2370-1 is the sub-frame addition on the 25D for the backhoe. The units are identical otherwise. My brother has the BX-25D-1.

See and thats part of the confusion in wht its only been the BX25D-1.

And here's another part of the confusion is that a couple difgerent posters gave gone thru the parts list of the bx25d versus the bx25d-1 and the ckaim the parts are identical on hst and components tedto the hst.

The 25d didn't have the problwmbut the 25d-1 is reported by numerous users to have it. AND in some of the eeoirted cases they've been taken to the dealers for repair once or twice and STILL its not like the 25d. Maybe its inrernal settings not dealer adjustable or maybe the physical placement of the parts (redesign) or maybe the moving of the brake created some changes (but not on the other brake-moved models).