What size fire Extinguisher???

[SPIKER]

Hi All;
I had a car fire about 2 monts ago, it was totaled but was junk anyways. it too fire dept about 15 min to respond by that time the car was nearly out. burnt everything that could for the most part. they managed to save the front licence plate was about it...

I had a 3 lb dry extinguisher which barely knocked down the fire and I've had lots of training (ex airforce mechanic on the crash team too) Halon was great at putting out the fires. didn't know they out lawed it.

anyhow I would keep at least 4 of the big units on hand like others said also if you're welding then keep water handy, (not for gas/oil fires though) also if you are working UNDER a car with heat then keep extra person with you as a fire spotter. (very easy to set off un seen fumes or rubber undercoating which you can not extinguish with out dirrect acess to the flames! (that is what kept burning on my car. the fuel fire went out. the rubber under coating didn't/wouldn't go out with the dry chem. as once it was/is burning it will flame back up faster than you can knock it down.) when it is UNDER SIDE burning then the heat spreads across the under surface VERY FAST.

Anyhow you can never be too safe!

Mark M /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[zuiko]

I would also be interested in knowing how temp affects the performance of them. Seems like when they are very cold (say 0 degrees) they wouldn't have as much pressure in them.

Where do you all get your fire extinguishers? I have a couple 10# ABC ones I got at Costco a few years ago but I'm not a member any more.

It would be also be good to have a couple water (type A only) ones around but I haven't seen those.

Also where do you get them recharged? I haven't had to do it yet since mine are still in the green zone and these are the first rechargable ones I've had.

 

[Soundguy]

I like that idea about the 10# minimum.. and an abc fire extinguisher. The idea of two of them is even better... perhaps one at each door, i'e, from the house, and outside.. that way someone running into the garage from outside, or inside the house has immediate access to an extinguisher.

I carry a fire extinguisher in my truck and on my tractor.... just never can tell when you will need one.

Soundguy

 

[Bob_Skurka]

In Indiana (or maybe just Lake County, IN?), for commercial buildings, we have to have a fire extinguisher at every door and no more than 75' apart around the perimeter of the building. If you have 2 doors side by side you only need one extinguisher adjacent to them. I know we are talking about a private structure in this thread, but if you apply the commercial code to a 25 by 36 pole barn and you measure the perimeter walls, you'd need a minimum of 2 extinguishes just to go around the perimeter assuming you had no doors. So, I guess I would error on the safe side and say for a detatched pole barn that is of moderate size 3 to 4 extinguishers are not unreasonable.

As for where to get them, you should be able to check the Home Depots and Lowes and find them there. You can also look in your phone book and find a fire equipment servicing company, they sell them and they recharge them too. Prices are lower at the home centers, just make sure you get one that can be recharged.

By the way, a 3# fire extinguisher will only shoot a blast of chemicals that lasts a few SECONDS before it runs out. You can probably put out a small kitchen fire in a few seconds if your wife burns the pot roast, but I would think you'd need considerably more time to put out a bunch of oily rags or any other type of workshop fire I can think of.

 

[Dave___in___CT]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Hi all...

Hey... what's the coldest temperature a fire extinguisher can be stored at and still be functional ? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Like in an unheated building or vehicle in winter...


What's a good type and size of extinguisher to have onboard a tractor ? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif


Thanks...

Dave... )</font>

Any info. on this ?

Thanks...

Dave...

 

[JDgreen227]

I carry a 1A10BC in all our vehicles and on my tractor, while I would prefer something larger space does not permit that. Your question of how cold an extinguisher is still functional at is a good one. One of my Kidde dry chemical models says on the tag: "Do not store at temperatures less than -40 degrees or greater than 120 degrees Fahrenheit".

 

[JDgreen227]

Bob,

My understanding is that the only fire extinguishers that should be recharged (cost effectively) are the type with metal handles and valves.

I could be wrong, but I was told by a building manager one time that the cheaper type that uses black plastic for the handle and valve need to have those parts replaced if recharged and it is less expensive to just buy a new one.

Can anyone confirm this?

 

[Bob_Skurka]

I can't speak for all manufactures of extinguishers, but when we buy them we make sure they can be refilled and every one of them has the metal top end. I just checked the one in my bedroom, it is a 20# First Alert brand and is rechargable. (I keep 3 extinguishers in the house)

By the way, the UL listing on the side says it is suitable for use at temperatures from -40 to +120 degrees and it is filled with compressed nitrogren (UN 1066)

 

[frank_f15]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I believe that there is an exception to the law for Halon use in computer rooms......

)</font>

junkman i beleive that is a grandfather type thing. if it is an exsisting system it is ok, but new systems must use something else. halon along with refigerants such as R12 are now outlawed.

 

[frank_f15]

all my extingushers are 20 lbs. dry chem, 2 in the house 2 in the garage. (course i got them for free) dry chem is a pup to clean up, but so is a burnt down house or garage. i recently had cause to use one of them(last saturday) my neighbor had a fire start in his drive way right next to garage. called FD and went over with extinguser, amazing how fast they run out, and this was a 20 pounder.another important thing is where the extinguser is! place it where u can get at it , mine for the basement is right at the bottom of stairs, the one for the main floor is actually in the bathroom closet., least likly rm in the house to have a fire , thus always accessible. REMEBER RULE #1 if u need an extinguser, if at all possible call FD first.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

Frank. . . funny you said you were amazed how fast a 20# extinguisher runs out. Most people only see extinguishers used on TV or the movies and think they keep spraying as long as you squeeze the handle . . . Go try one of those little 3# jobs, they literally give you a shot that only lasts about 2 SECONDS.

I guess I look at fire extinguishers the same way I look at guns . . . you don't need them very often, but when you NEED one, you NEED IT NOW.

 

[hosejockey2002]

[blue]junkman i beleive that is a grandfather type thing. if it is an exsisting system it is ok, but new systems must use something else. halon along with refigerants such as R12 are now outlawed. [/blue]

Frank is right. Most computer rooms use Inergen, which is a proprietary blend of nitrogen, CO2 and other gases. It's safe for the environment and non-toxic, although it could be fatal to be in a room when an Inergen system activates, because it will displace the oxygen in the room.

 

[BIGUN]

If you want the ability to reliably fight and extinguish a fire I would recommend going with good quality extinguishers from a company like Ansul. Don’t buy the plastic handle/valve types available in the discount stores. I am sure the commercial quality extinguishers cost considerably more than the plastic throwaways, but I have heard on the cheap variety, that after aging for a few years, that the valve may stick and the handle will then break when squeezed.
I have successfully extinguished several large diesel fires using the Ansul Red Line 20 loaded with Purple-K. These are designed to be refilled and recharged by the user. If you keep the supplies on hand you can refill the same extinguisher in 3-4 minutes and immediately reuse it if necessary. The powder is poured in through the top hatch and a new CO2 cartridge screwed on and you are ready to go again. The CO2 cartridges are refillable at the factory.
Of course Ansul makes many sizes and types of extinguisher if this isn’t what you are looking for. We used this brand exclusively during all my years in the power plant and we regularly trained fighting fuel oil fires so I know they work.
They should be available through specialized fire & safety type stores.
Ansul Red Line

 

[RobertN]

Good point. Call the FD. One, yes the fire extinguisher may run out. Two, it is better to have them show up and not need them than to risk a fire getting out of control. Three, in any fire you will have a lot of smoke. The FD will set up an exhaust fan and ventilate the building very quickly to advert smoke damage to the house/contents.

 

[frank_f15]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( If you want the ability to reliably fight and extinguish a fire I would recommend going with good quality extinguishers from a company like Ansul. )</font>

all mine are from ansul! but , any extingusher is better than none. i wonder why a lot of people don't think of fire extingushers as an integral part of their home? like smoke dectors, or carbon monxide dectors?

 

[zuiko]

I picked up a couple 10# ABC extingishers today. They have a different kind of foam in them. It's some other kind of sulfate, not ammonium. They are much higher rated... 8a70b vs about 4a60b for the regular 10# type.

Supposedly the cleanup is easier, not sure if they damage electronics. They are not rechargable and the temp range is pretty bad though (only down to +14) so they'd be good for indoor only around here.

 

[NY_Yankees_Fan]

As a firefighter and an insurance professional that has provided many hours of fire extinguishers training and who advises clients on a daily bases about fire protection in commercial applications, my comment are as follows:

First off call the fire department, and then fight the fire, if that is what you choose to do. By the time you determine your efforts are not working, it maybe too late. As a firefighter I would rather be called to a fire that is out or nearly out then pulling up and being told a person is trapped because they stayed too long to fight a fire. I investigated a fire a while back where the security staff used 40 fire extinguishers on a fire and THEN decided to call the FD, WRONG!!.

The best fire extinguisher is a garden hose, unlimited supply of agent, can handle wood, paper, etc. The NYC FD has a firefighter assigned to a 2.5 gallon water fire extinguisher on each ladder company. They call him/her “The Can Man”, they put a lot of fire out using this simple fire extinguisher. They have quick knock down of the fire often before an engine company gets on the scene. For grease, combustible metals and electric DO NOT USE WATER.

For a garage of your size I would recommend at least 4 ABC fire extinguishers, minimum 2-A:10-B:C or higher. Why four? National Fire Protection Association, NFPA would call for a minimum of 2 fire extinguishers for your size building. Remember NFPA is the MINIUM. The fire extinguisher I recommended would last about 10-15 seconds, not much time to do a lot of firefighting. REMEMBER you have called the FD and they are on the way. If the fire is not getting smaller with the first fire extinguisher, get out and close doors as you leave. I recommend 4 only so they are close by and not behind something or out of sight. Also make sure you get a new fire extinguishers every few years especially if you buy the cheap ones at the big box stores. Also look at the gauge monthly to make sure it is in the green area. If you have not had fire extinguisher training, read the label on how they work BEFORE the fire. Now that may sound like common sense, but I investigated a fire where the person said the fire extinguisher did not work. I asked the person to show me the extinguisher he used. The pin was still in the handle, the plastic handle was broken from him trying to squeeze the handle. Guess he will not forget to pull the pin the next time. Application of the agent is very important to extinguish the fire. Aim at the base of the fire, sweeping motion left to right, if the fire gets smaller move in on the fire if not get out. REMEMBER always have the exit at your back and not in front of the fire.

Regarding Halon systems currently installed in computer room or any other application and located in the United States, the following applies:
You are under no legal obligation to remove systems from service.
There is no federal legal requirement to remove systems from service by any specific date.
You may legally recharge your system in the event of a discharge
Recycled agent is still commonly available for fire system recharge.
No new agent 1301 is being manufactured.

The most common replacement gas now being used as a replacement for Halon is a gas known as FM 200. See this web site for the info on the gas. link

 

[LAGEORGE]

Chico922, I have seen many a thing burn and know that you can stop the fire if you have the right gear. So outside my tool shed is not one but 3 fire extinguishers. 2 are water type I think 2 gallon and one is a 10-pound ABC chemical type. These are all in addition to one ones in the house, cars and trucks. It is always nice to be able to grab the water one and take it up the hill if you know you are going to be brush cutting or use a cutoff saw. I have started many small fires with the cutoff saw so having a fire extinguisher is a must. I have attached 3 photos of where I place them on the shed to give folks a better look at commercial quality fire extinguishers.

George

 

[LAGEORGE]

Closeup of Fire extinguishers

 

[LAGEORGE]

Second water type on side of tool shed.