Why no Cub Luv?

[Scooby074]

Ive been researching for the last year or so, options for replacing a 20 +year old Craftsman(MTD) 18Hp, 44 " rear discharge, Garden tractor.

This machine has gone above and beyond over these many years, but its getting to the point where parts are getting obsolete, and its truly showing its age (steering, engine smoke etc)

I was leaning towards a Deere x324 for its 4 wheel steering and great reviews.

This leads me to this thread.

On the pro forums, Cub is essentially laughed at. Why is this? Deere Marketing? Or is it due to their relationship with MTD?

As a MTD owner, i have to say theres no way id buy a Current MTD so i can see where some of this MTD hate comes from.

However Cub seems to be speced to a higher level, much like my current old craftsman MTD (heavy frame, cast iron, serviceable, trans, etc).

To me, in order to get these same things, in a current generation machine im looking a the Cub 2554, or the deere x500's.

My previous intrest in the x324 was because it had the 4ws, and my lot has many tight trees to get around.

Since that time ive added another property, that has a very steep and bumpy yard. So now i have that to contend with.

During my research ive found that the 300 series has the same trans as the 100 series, at a greater price. And the k49 (?) trans dont handle hills well.

so that means x500 which is $$$

All in all the Cub 2500's seems like a bargain? or am i wrong? Why no Cub luv?

So to sum up this rambling post

I want to replace my existing GT with a machine of equal quality and durability.

Quality of cut / anti scalp is very important.

must be able to mow "rough" lawn. all grass, but many rabbit holes/rough ground so deck flotation is required

Must be able to raise the deck high for curb and trailer loading clearance.

Turn radius is also important for the trees, but now not as important as durability on hills.

Ability to climb steep hills is required. existing MTD has problems climbing some areas of the yard (front end becoming light), forcing me to go across or downhill.

Diff lock or 4wd would be a plus, if it doesnt raise prices too much. But i dont think thats available on the cub 2500's, only the deere x500s

Approximate areas to be mowed:

3/4 acre trees and tight turns.

1 acre steep hills


Any opinions on the 2554 for my needs?

Im open to all suggestions including deere models or other brands, however about all thats locally available are: Cub, deere, Massey, kubota, sears, husquvarna, and the various MTD private labels

 

[petegoud]

I just replaced a 20+ year old John Deere 112L with a Cub Cadet 1050 (Both of these have a Kawasaki engine). To keep that JD going that long required a bit of work (such as welding a frame that cracked in half, rebuilding the steering a couple of times, new starter, Lots of minor electrical problems, etc). Looking at the new models of either, they both seemed comparable. I'll let you know in 5 years if I made the right choice. Doug

 

[JTKub]

On the pro forums, Cub is essentially laughed at. Why is this? Deere Marketing? Or is it due to their relationship with MTD?

That's your problem right there. If you want to read-up on the strengths, weaknesses, capabilities, etc.. of Cub lawn/garden tractors, DO NOT read the "pro forums". They don't know squat about Cub lawn/garden machines because very little in the realm is used in this type of service. I've read the commercial forums for years and have to laugh at their general lack of knowledge associated with this stuff. They know their business, they know their $10K commercial ZTRs, they don't know non-commercial Cub.

Joel

 

[beenthere]

Scooby074
I think your long post gives your answer quite well as to "why". After going to MTD, Cub coasted on their reputation. And today, there are likely higher price models that will hold up to tender care.

Talked to my welder friend the other day, and he gets a lot of Cub business welding the stress cracks here and there. To the point, he chewed on a regional rep about the crappy design of the Cubs they were selling. Must be he was tired of fixing them.

But one can buy cheap with about any brand name on it. The competition for the market share even drives Deere to produce the cheap lines. Just the old adage, ya's gets what ya's pays for.

 

[Scooby074]

Im a firm believer in you get what you pay for:thumbsup: Thats why i went right past the 1000 series Cubs and 100 series deeres. I also went right past the various MTDs and AYPs .

however if i can get a better deal for equal money than why not? I have to say that when i found out about the same trans being used in the 100 (home depot) series and the x300 (dealership) series i was more than a little miffed.

Basically the x300 deeres arent the machine i thought they were. Thats what lead me to look at Cub again. Seems like more bang for the buck?

But if there are problems there, like weak frames, than no amount of savings will make up for that.

about the pro forums. I understand that those guys run commercial ztr's/ walk behinds however theres still some that have garden tractors.

Nothing from Cub, even the "professional" Tank ZTR's get no respect, yet the x500 and 700 deeres and even the "residential" ztracks do?

What am i missing? Are the cubs that bad? Are the deeres that good? Is it marketing?

The tank seems like a pretty decent, commercial machine yet still no love.

Allowing for inflation, my $3000 Craftsman back in the day would be $5700 today. So thats about where my budget falls. I SHOULD be able to find an equivalent machine for that much money?

Beenthere: The Cubs your friend is welding, are those 1000,2500 or 3000 series? Or are they from all models?

On thing i can say, my current GT has a very heavy frame, especially when it flips back and pins you under it while loading

 

[deepNdirt]

I am a beginner on the cub cadets but have admire them for some time now , always looking trying out for size when at the TSC, I pay close attention to the parts that frequently needing welded on my old poulan,
I noted the much stronger built front axle made of I-beam on the cub instead of hollow molded 2 pc and mig weld together one on my old Poulan,the mowing deck and frame itself looks to be built from thicker guage steel than the craftsman/poulan mowers are made with,
I've always when time come to buy a new mower looked at what I could afford and then went 1 step better then that. Been lucky so far, My poulan last 12 years and still would be using it had I not got tired of welding on it, the 17 hp Intek engine sure out last the frame...... for some reason the JD just never grabbed my attention, I always thought of them as an overpriced name brand, JD did although but not sure if they still do offer a Scotts make JD mower at a lesser cost, but still I had no interest in it either, the IH cub was a design that last for decades I figured their reason behind that was due to good workmanship, JD is always on the move to better improve something or another,

 

[2manyrocks]

Cuz the newer cubs aren't built like tanks like the IH cubs. But they don't have to be to just cut grass in the yard. In a sense, the IH cubs were scaled down farm tractors and overbuilt for today's average homeowner.

 

[Thomas]

I had the older cubs in the past..127,682,1450 than went to wheel horse,couple years ago purchase new cub 2042,its okay unit but not comfortable also parts $$'s plus very compact to work on if need be..older cubs would out work operator every time.

If you get chance check out older cub metal thickness etc. on tractor also mower deck.

 

[philipb]

Something else to look for is the capacity of the hydrostat, the oil capacity. I've had a cheap hydrostat that would not pull any kind of a hill on a hot day. This prompted me to go to the Cub GT 2544 which has a much higher capacity transmission and it pulls hills with no effort. The deck is very heavy as is the suspension. Cub did have a recall on mine and they did install a much needed heat shield around the exhaust system gratis. I notice that the newer machines have eliminated the need for that. I mow 3+ acres regularly and I am satisfied.

 

[BungeeII]

For a home-owner lawn tractor, cub used to have an elite name. They used to have a product that seemed "overbuilt", but now you better make sure you've matched the machine to your needs, because they'll just barely cover it.

This is 100% opinion and I reserve the right to be wrong.

I happen to own an LT2180 and found the deck to be extremely lacking in strength and cut quality.

 

[Scooby074]

Wow. Some varying opinions for sure.

Thanks to those that posted.

I definitely understand that things have changed over time as far as quality is concerned.

Now more confused than ever...lol

So then, i understand that this is the cub forum, but i wonder, "Whats the best value / heaviest built machine in a sub 6k Garden tractor?"

 

[BungeeII]

Wow. Some varying opinions for sure.

Thanks to those that posted.

I definitely understand that things have changed over time as far as quality is concerned.

Now more confused than ever...lol

So then, i understand that this is the cub forum, but i wonder, "Whats the best value / heaviest built machine in a sub 6k Garden tractor?"

I'm fascinated with the Ingersoll tractors, though I've never owned one. They maintain that "overbuilt" status that Cub once had. They're virtually identical to their early Case models... 40 year of tractors and attachments out there.

 

[JTKub]

So then, i understand that this is the cub forum, but i wonder, "Whats the best value / heaviest built machine in a sub 6k Garden tractor?"

You can get a new shaft driven everything Cub 3100 for ~$5200 or a 3200 with aux hydraulics, power steering and diff lock for ~$6200. Your choice of cutting decks are extra. I'd hold off for a couple year old used one for half the price though. IMO, having owned one, the most bang for your buck is a Cub 2544 or 2550 for around $4K. Here's the 3100:

Joel

 

[JTKub]

I'm fascinated with the Ingersoll tractors, though I've never owned one. They maintain that "overbuilt" status that Cub once had. They're virtually identical to their early Case models... 40 year of tractors and attachments out there.

They're very cool. I've got a Case 220 that I use as a yard horse. Thing is, once you get used to foot controlled hydrostatic for mowing service, you'll hate the 'column shift' speed and direction control on the Case/Ingersolls. HyDrive takes some getting used to over hydrostatic drive. Case/Ingersoll guys get all bunched up over this, but Hydrive isn't all smooth and dummie proof like hydrostatic is. Here's my 220 (freshly rebuilt J40 deck not on it):

Joel

 

[2manyrocks]

Another consideration is that a zero turn is just faster at cutting grass in an obstacle filled yard than a garden tractor. If I had a choice between a new IH Cub 1650 (if IH was still around) and a zero turn of any quality for cutting grass, I'd pick the zero turn.

 

[SHUNKSTER]

I to had a Craftsman 18hp tractor that after about 15 yrs the transmission just gave out. I spent about 4 months researching the various models and decided on a GT2554. Shaft drive, Horizontal shaft Kohler Command engine, Cast Iron transmission with large oil capacity, the deck is built like a tank and gives a great cut, and is very comfortable to drive. Just a great machine. I have a 100 hrs on it, the only problem was throwing 2 belts due to very bumpy yard. I would recommend it to anyone.

 

[Thomas]

Another little thing...
Cub LT 2042 other models 3-4 years ago,dang brake pedal to high up if one kinda long legged.

 

[JTKub]

Another little thing...
Cub LT 2042 other models 3-4 years ago,dang brake pedal to high up if one kinda long legged.

The pedal is up and out of the way because the brake on the 2 and 3K series Cubs are meant to be a parking brake. That's typical of all modern day hydrostatic drives.

Joel

 

[deepNdirt]

The pedal is up and out of the way because the brake on the 2 and 3K series Cubs are meant to be a parking brake. That's typical of all modern day hydrostatic drives.

Joel

LOL yes first time ever my wife sit on the cub she ask where is the clutch pedal? and more importantly where is the brake? she had never driven a hydrostat trans. mower she was pleased to know it was as simple as mash the pedal to go and let off to stop:thumbsup: she ask why I didn't get one like this years ago maybe then she wouldn't have bumped into so many things things :laughing: I told her these kind were not an option the year we bought our last mower ( 1998 ) the big deal then was the ( shift on the go )
although the first time she took it around the yard she stop to ask me if she must keep her foot on the gas control always?
I told her yeah! always, then after 3-4 more times around the yard I stop her to point out the cruise control....
she has cut with it 3 times now and all 3 times when first having to crank it she comes tell me the engine will not turn over..... for some reason she keeps forgetting about the parking-brake needing to be pressed in before it will start...I tell her its a saftey just like the old one having to press the clutch in before starting..... she will be cutting grass again today and I'll find out if she has remember this time.

 

[JTKub]

That's the truth. After ~30yrs of gear drive GTs and LTs, once you go foot pedal hydrostatic for mowing service you'll never go back. Like 2manyrocks says, if you kick it up a notch further and go ZTR it gets even better yet!

Joel