Winch Modifications

[BobRip]

Bob,

Did they say it was alright to pass fluid into the PB port?

I am still not understanding this. I WAS WRONG IN THE WAY THIS FLOWS. I MUST RETHINK THIS WHOLE SYSTEM.

Any fluid used by the work ports will flow out the tank/Out port. You can not just vent it. Tank port should go to tank/reservoir. I WILL DO THIS.

The PB port is used to pass fluid downstream.

Your rear valve will work as a winch valve if you do not use the QA valve to reverse the flow through the rear valve. I AGREE AND NOW UNDERSTAND

JMHO

J_J, see my comments above in caps.

After studying the valve drawing again, I realize I misunderstood how it works. Hopefully I will be able to salvage something here. At this point I am not sure. Back to the drawing board.

 

[J_J]

Bob,

I believe the valve will work if you run a hose from the PB port on the FEL valve, and back to the P port winch valve. The flow out of the winch motor will exit out the return/tank port on the winch valve and go to reservoir. I would remove the PB plug and plug the PB port and let all fluid from the rear valve tank port go to tank, if that is the last valve inline.

 

[MossRoad]

Why not just run the winch off of the AUX PTO valve only? That would require just the two hoses and that's it. Once you get more than an arm length away from the winch, the rear valve will do no good anyway. If you need to be near the winch, you could easily put a tube on the end of a bent golf club shaft and just slide the tube onto the AUX PTO valve handle and fix it with a wing bolt. Then operate it from the rear/side of the tractor.

Seems like excessive plumbing and valving going on here.

 

[J_J]

Bob,

I really did not intend to mess up your plans, but it should work if you run the hyd into the P port, and let the motor expended fluid exit the out port to tank. If the rear valve should go to neutral, the fluid would flow out the PB port with the front valve activated.

It's really no different that a remote valve locked down for a 3pt log splitter to use the tractor hyd flow.

 

[J_J]

Why not just run the winch off of the AUX PTO valve only? That would require just the two hoses and that's it. Once you get more than an arm length away from the winch, the rear valve will do no good anyway. If you need to be near the winch, you could easily put a tube on the end of a bent golf club shaft and just slide the tube onto the AUX PTO valve handle and fix it with a wing bolt. Then operate it from the rear/side of the tractor.

Seems like excessive plumbing and valving going on here.

That would work and the winch could still be operated from the seat in a one way pulling condition, with the rear valve locked on. Could reduce the engine rpm to lower the GPM's if necessary. I don't think the PB would be necessary, just let the OUT fluid go back to the PTO valve and then to tank. It's the revers thing that puzzled me.

 

[BobRip]

Bob,

I really did not intend to mess up your plans, but it should work if you run the hyd into the P port, and let the motor expended fluid exit the out port to tank. If the rear valve should go to neutral, the fluid would flow out the PB port with the front valve activated.

It's really no different that a remote valve locked down for a 3pt log splitter to use the tractor hyd flow.

J_J, you did not mess up my plans. You saved me from damaging a valve and possibly creating a hazardous situation. This is one of the reasons I post this stuff. If I had listened to you a little better and read the valve schematic more carefully, I could have fixed it sooner. Thanks so much for your input and that of Moss too of course.

I am actually going back to how I had it valved before with the PB port and tank port plumbed together (just remove a plug) and then back to the aux pto. Of course the P port will be fed from the pressure side of the aux PTO outputs (that is pressure when the handle is held down). I just will only use it in the mode of pressure to the P port (again handle held down). I have made a wood block to hold the aux PTO handle down.

I will be able to use the aux handle PTO by setting the direction with the new valve in back (just figured that out this second). Of course I must always push the aux handle down when doing this. As an alternative I can just use the quick connect hyd fittings and take the new/back valve out of service. Not very difficult to do.

Only problem now is I drilled a hole in the plug going to the T port during my total misunderstanding of the valve. I have to get a new plug. Hopefully I can get one on Monday.

Again thanks for being patience and persistent. I have learned a whole lot of things during this project. I actually value that more than having the winch.

 

[toy]

Bob It may have been already mentioned but have you tried to hook the two hoses going to the motor together so that when you were pulling off the cable that the oil would just recirculate around in the winch motor and not have to pull the oil through the pump and then to the motor? If that might be a solution seems like someone on here has put a ball valve that would with stand the hydraulic pressure on their machine for a different application, maybe you could adapt that to your situation. Maybe an electric sylenoid valve so you could work the valve remotely. Probably everything that I have mentioned has already been mentioned sorry if it has. Just thought I would suggest it if it hadn't.

 

[toy]

Seems to me like when the machine is turned off, without any valves that you have added , when you start the machine the oil that goes to the quick attach circuit from the pump flows freely through that valve and then straight back to the tank. At the quick attach valve the flow to the quick attach coming from the valve is blocked until the lever is either pushed or pulled. The motor on the winch itself is like a pump [when the machine is off] and pulling on the spool of the winch in that state is pulling against a blocked circuit unless the valve is pushed in or out. The open center in the quick attach circuit goes straight through the valve when the valve is in neutral position. When you push or pull the handle on the valve on the QA circuit you are stopping that open circuit and causing the oil from the tank and through the pump to the QA valve and on out to the winch motor where it is called on to do work with the machine running. With the machine off and you are pulling on the winch cable you are trying to pull the oil through the winch motor [which is now a pump] and if the valve is in neutral you are trying to pull against a dead block in the valve chest. With the lever either pushed or pulled you have opened up a flow path from the winch motor through the valve chest and to the pump motor in the engine compartment and that pump is going to pull oil from the tank, that is a lot of resistance to overcome. If you plumed a bypass at the winch motor so that the oil could freely flow from the outlet hose to the inlet hose on the winch motor then the resistance in the winch motor would be all you are pulling against, and not a dead block at the valve chest or pulling through two pumps. I hope that makes sense and I hope it helps since I assume you can't pull the cable out with the power of the pump unspooling it.

 

[J_J]

Wireless hyd control would be the answer, power in and power out. They aren't cheap.

A solenoid valve, and 2 way wireless from up 100 ft.

 

[BobRip]

Bob It may have been already mentioned but have you tried to hook the two hoses going to the motor together so that when you were pulling off the cable that the oil would just recirculate around in the winch motor and not have to pull the oil through the pump and then to the motor? If that might be a solution seems like someone on here has put a ball valve that would with stand the hydraulic pressure on their machine for a different application, maybe you could adapt that to your situation. Maybe an electric sylenoid valve so you could work the valve remotely. Probably everything that I have mentioned has already been mentioned sorry if it has. Just thought I would suggest it if it hadn't.

This was about the first thing I tried. Yes it works but it takes about all the strength I have to pull the cable out ( I guess about 100 lbs of force). To pull it out 25 feet would exhaust me. I have a manual winch that would be much easier that that. This is a very high torque motor and does not turn easily by manual effort.