Window/door question

[tommu56]

Andy

I use this stuff but you shoukd put it on sill before the window go's in then shingle it up side over sill piece then header go's over side pices

http://www.graceathome.com/pages/downloads/TP-083L.pdf

tommu

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Dan,

You are so correct.

You are so correct.

You are so correct.

I just went to the Andersen link above. Also went to the Pella and Marvin sites and printed out their installation instructions. They are all almost carbon copies of each other. Basically, when the builder installed the windows, he cut the Tyvek, folded it all inside and stapled it, then put the windows in. No sill sealer, no caulk, no nothing.

tommu, that looks like good stuff. I'm going to look for it around here.

 

[tommu56]

Andy
I usually get it at lowe's

tom

 

[WVBill]

..and Protecto-Wrap is the equivalent. Got mine at Home Depot. Also available on-line from hardwarestore.com.

WVBill

 

[ray66v]

Those are all versions of the tape flashing I spoke of. If you use those by them selfs, (without the calk), gaps can and do, open over time. And you can still get leaks. Believe me, I have been through it.

 

[EddieWalker]

I've seen guys who just nail in the window and rely on the siding to keep out the water. When I asked them about it, I got "it's fine" type of reply and allot of attitude. I didn't work with those guys again, so I have no idea how the house ended up or if the homeowner has any leaks. I imagine that there are leaks and it will be 20 years before the homeowner learns abou them.

I always use house wrap on my siding, then use silicone on the window. I also use screws on windows since I don't trust nails. Then after the silicone has dried, I use flashing tape. It's special tape designed for sealing windows that you put on at the bottom first, then the sides and the top last. I'm told the tape is all you really need, but I've seen to many homes with tape of one kind or another in them that is falling apart after just five years.

Tape and silicone are both cheap, so cutting this corner really doesn't make any sense.

If you do not trust your contractor, fire him now. Every job that I've done where another contractor was there first and something failed or needed re-doing, the homeowners all talked about wanting to fire their contractor, but didn't. They hoped it would get better or work out. Hope is nice, but in never stoped a leak or fixed a broken timber or stoped parts of a house from moving.

I've also been on jobs for fairly big name local custom home builders that had a bad crew who just got it wrong. Sometimes the contractors get more work then they have crews who know what they are doing and take the gamble that hiring somebody new who claims to be an expert, actualy is. Allot of homes get built this way, and allot of homes have all sorts of issues because of this.

Take some pictures and let us see what he's doing. It could be something as simple as you're just not familiar iwth what he's doing. Other people on here have done this with their homes and it turned out that the contractor was actually taking extra steps to do it right, and then some. bmac is a good example of this when he had his house built. Then there is the situation where the contractor is a total idiot, but really good at BS'ing you. If you take a picture, a question can be asked that you might not have even thought of, or known was an issue.

If you live in an area with building codes, the integrity of the home shouldn't be a problem. Of course, the quality of the finish might be.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Eddie,

Thank-you for replying. I've actually been waiting for you!

When I first considered building, the first thing I did was went out and bought a code book. It is the big blue one for the UCC codes which is what Pa follows. The code for windows is to be installed as per manufacturers instructions. Now I don't think I'm being picky here, but he didn't even come close to following the instructions. He never even glanced at them, he knows everything. Just ask him, no, he won't give you time to ask, he'll tell you he knows everything before you ask. He told me something halfway thru the job and he was serious. He said, "those that think they know everything really tee off those of us that do."

Eddie, you are again so right. I was going to fire him when he didn't know what he was doing with the I-joists. I had to download and print the info and he still didn't think he was doing anything wrong. As far as the windows go, I thought maybe I was being too picky. I looked not only at the Andersen install instructions, but Pella and Marvin too. They are all almost carbon copies of each other. I will take pics and post and you tell me what you think. As far as codes and inspections go, the inspectors around here are worthless. My house should have never passed a framing inspection but it did. Only half the hurricane straps and joist hangers were installed. The inspector never even went into the basement. I think it took him more time to write the sticker than the inspection took. The builder wasn't even going to install any joist hangers or hurricane straps until the excavator digging the porch footers told him he needed to install them for the inspection. The excavator is one of my customers. He told the excavator that his buildings don't need them. The excavator told him that the inspector does need them, so he put in half of them.

Here is where I went wrong. I have been friends with this guy for at least 12 years. Anytime he needed anything mechanical, I was always right there. Pulling axles and doing bearings and seals at 10 pm so his wife could run the mail route the next day, loaning him my 2004 truck for 3 months after he crashed his, and countless other things. I thought he would do the right thing. I guess I put too much trust in people to do the right thing. Now even getting him to show up is difficult. I locked the house and everything else when I left last night so he can't get in. It's after 9:00 am right now and he hasn't called or stopped by to see what's going on. He rarely shows up before 10:00. It's not like he's going to other jobs because he has no other projects going on. In the beginning he worked okay, but that didn't last long. He has also stolen lumber and materials as he is building his mother's house next. I can't prove it enough to call the police, but I know for a fact he has stolen. Last night I set-up a 4 mp game camera. I hope he keeps up his light fingered ways now. I get angry thinking about it and think of things to do to him, but I'll never do it. Just because he is acting like a lowlife doesn't mean I will. Situations like this, I like to take the high road, it always pays off in the end.

 

[dmccarty]

i thought house wrap was to stop air infiltration, but allow moisture to escape?
heehaw

I think we can both be right and wrong. The house wraps are a changing. There are a many more different types now vs back then. When I was designing our house in 2002-2004 I read up on house wraps. And what I read at the time I did not like especially the warrenty. If it was not installed correctly, no warrenty which is reasonable. The problem was that few if any of the houses I saw being built did it per the manufactuer's instructions. Furthermore, at the time the stuff I was looking at was not a water barrier yet the house wrap was the only thing between leaky vinyl siding and the wood structure of the house. That could not be good.

Better than the houses with plywood/OSB exteriors with stucco on the wood. You could see the 4x8 sheets swelling at the edges from water. Entire subdivisions built this way. Lots of houses for sale....

I used the framing details from http://www.buildingscience.com/bsc/.

The PE at this company has a few books on building in given climates. He said use either house wrap or the old fashioned building paper. I think it was 40# material. We use building paper and the other details. We are not likely to have water issues due to the 28 inch roof overhang. Only very very very windy rain is going to touch our wall and its brick veneer with the proper gap to handle water so our walls, windows and doors should be ok.

BSC is the place to go for details and other issues regarding construction.

Later,
Dan

 

[EddieWalker]

It sounds like you got yourself into the trap of hiring a friend or family member. I've seen this through too,and the problem is that even though you are being an upstanding person, he doesn't care. The nicer you are, the more he will take advantage. It won't matter if you fire him or keep him to the end of the job, he's not a friend and he doesn't respect you. My advice is to fire him and get somebody in there who can go through the place to find the mistakes and fix them before it gets REALLY EXPENSIVE.

Not useing joist hangers or straping is just plain stupid.

A basic understanding of how a stick built home is held together. Nails DO NOT have structural strength to support a load. They are to hold the wood together, but never to support anything. A joist hanger is designed and aproved to support a load. If a piece of wood is not resting on top of another piece of wood, then it needs additional support. Look at it this way, if there was no wind or movement, you could almost stack the wood framing together on a house and it would stay there. That is because proper framing is designed so that the wood rests on other wood on down to the foundation. Gravity is holding it down, but the nails are there to keep it in place. That's very simplified, but if you think in those terms and look around at the framing, you will easily spot amature mistakes.

Things to take pictures are and post them here should be your window and door frames. Especially the exterior doors. The floor joists, and how they tie into the foundation and the top of the wall in second story applications. Garage door headers, and a line down the wall. You should be able to stand at the end of a wall of studs and not see any bow or curve. Anything that you can see in the framing, you will see when the sheetrock is installed.

What type of roof did he install? Rafters or trusses? A common mistake is to use the wrong size lumber when building either. It changes from one to the other and also for the amount of span.

Did he frame for the utilities, vents, drains, shower and kitchen so that everything will be able to go in after the sheetrock is installed?

What do your eves look like? Is your roof peak straight? Did he get the decking on the roof and is it flat? Are the fascia boards flat, are the soffits straight?

With what you have said, I also think you should hire a home inspector. Most will charge between $250 to $500 for a home inspection, but I've never had one come in during construction of a home. They go through allot of schooling and testing to get liscensed, so that would be a really good source to find out what's going on and if your builder has a clue.

Don't put your head in the sand and don't hope it will get better. It gets worse. If he's steeling and doing a half wit job, his next step will be to stop showing up, then to stop answering his phone and then probably disapear completely. This is how it normally happens and when I get the call to come help and finish the job.

It's very sad, especially when I have to start tearing stuff out that they paid for and replace it with new material that they have to pay for again. I have just such a job coming up this fall where a builder who has years of experience, built allot of custom homes, and either got lazy or just never know what the heck he was doing. The homeowner is sueing him for doing such a bad job and when that's done, I'll tear down his work and build it right. She probably won't get a dime out of him, but she's going to try.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[asylum575]

I'm just finishing up windows and siding on my house. I housewrapped, cut and stapled the wrap along the interior of the window opening. Installed window and nailed/screwed along nail flange. I then used the protectowrap stuff around the nail flange and onto the wrap, then I sided. I'd be surprised if water gets in. I didn't caulk the interior of the windows. Should have, but didn't. Did the candle test during the last storm and all is good.
Following the manufacturers instructions is always a good idea, though.

Ed