Won't Start after Stall

   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#21  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Alright here is what I have found.
I cracked all lines one at a time working back from the tank. I worked the pump at each fitting. I got fuel flow at all banjo fittings.
I took the fuel filter housing off the tractor hoping to break the filter from the housing. I was starting to bend the cast metal hanger with it attached to the block so before it broke I removed it, still can't get filter off but it was/is full of fuel.
Next I removed all lines and checked for blockage and kinks. I blew them all out with compressed air. No blockage or kinks, the screen filter was clean.
Put it back together, pumped till my hand hurt, individually cracked all lines, pumped some more till fuel came out of each one, tightened them all, made sure no leaks.
Next came the injectors; I don't have an open end wrench larger than a 19mm and it was too tight to get my cresent wrench up to the injectors at the head. Hope this is not a major item. I losened them all at the injector pump, I pumped the primer many times but do not get any fuel out of any of the injectors.
Next since my compression release leaver is non existant, but there is a lever with spring attached on the back of the head, I rigged a screwdrver through the hole and jammed it open. I turned the engine over, got the oil pressure up, stopped starting to remove screwdriver, then immediately went back to starter. I really did not notice any difference in load but the oil pressure went up like Greg said. There was really no difference in sound.
On last thing before this post. I opened all the injector fittings at the pump and rigged the decompression valve open with a screwdriver then turned engine, noted if any fuel came out of injector fittings, it did not, closed decompression valve turned engine over, noted fuel flow out of injectors, still none.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #22  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

So still no go,,you havn't checked the injectors yet,to see if fuel is getting to them,through them,,I think thats what you said,,,but if your getting fuel out of the other end of injector line,,,you wouldn't think all three would be stopped up,,,,What kind of tractor is it,,,h.p. brand,,,it is a jinma right?How many hrs on it,,is it still under a warrenty,,,did you call the dealer if so? T he decompression lever is not there?but there is a decompression part on valve cover? Keep at it,,,I bet its nothing that will cost much to fix,,,,anyways you can pull it to level ground? thingy
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#23  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Richard,
I am afraid that it is not on level ground. It is pointed uphill with BB and FEL down on ground ARG!!! Otherwise I would yank it with the Ford 250 4x4. Maybe that is why there is no fuel flow. The tank is below the fuel filter.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #24  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

If your battery is still strong, you may be able to just spin the starter long enough to pump enough hydraulics to lift your implements off the ground and move your tractor.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#25  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Hmm that is a thought, how long would it take to spin up enough fluid to move the FEL. I probably can jack the BB and drop it from the 3pt. I hate to kill the starter, has anyone else tried this with positive results?
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #26  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Just another idea, You might try pumping the primer while you try to start the engine. do/did you have oil in the injector pump? There is a small dipstick on the rear of the pump. It is supposed to have 10w oil in there. Just a couple of ounces.

I would vote against using the starter to run the hydraulic pump. you don't want to crank a starter more than 20-30 seconds at a time or you could fry the windings. You might be able to use tie-down staps or a comealong or a hydraulic jack to raise the implements, then tie them up.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #27  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Yeah,where there is a will,,,,if you could get the box blade unhooked,,,by what ever means,,[the lift arms themselfs come off],,,than maybe you could drag it backwards with fel down,heck if its much up hill,you better be carefull when and if you remove the back blade,,,it might just coast down by itself,,,,if you get it on level ground,,,maybe you can than try and prime it,,maybe it will start. At least you will know that that wasn't it,,,I mow on some very steep spots,,,never noticed anything,course I have the r.p.ms up then,,,,the only thing that my hills do,is cause trans oil,[just a few drops],to leak into bell housing and out that little drain hole on the bottom of housing,,,this worried me for a while,,,but two years later it has not gotton worse,and just does it on the steepest hills[45 degrees,,or more,don't really know,but they are steep],clutch has never sliped from the oil in housing either,,,somebody said[[think it was on a web page which is no longer there,mike stuarts??] that this could happen,if trans is overfilled or going down steep long hill,,,after reading that,I felt better,,must be some kind of a hole or something at top of trans/creeper,that when on a steep enough slope leaks a few drops,,,if it was a seal,,you would think it would leak all the time,,unless bad spot is at top???anyways it just does it when on very steep hills,and than just a few drops,,,hasn't got worse,,,if it does,,than its got to be more serious,it never leaks enough to add any oil and I'm pretty certain its coming from trans side cause I took those inspection plates off and it seemed for sure that was the end it was coming from,,,,wonder if anybody elses has done this? Maybe I got the steepests hills?I'm hopeing that is it,,never really over fill trans,but always fill a tad above any line.... thingy
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #28  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

do not worrry about (flooding) on a diesel, as if it has AIR & FUEL it will RUN as long as the compression is up, it can get too much fuel it will get a FUEL LOCK and engine will not crank over, untill the decompression lever is pulled/turned.

there is a post here which has lots of trouble shooting on the Pump & Fuel problems on a 204. same system pretty much.


If you can crank it then spraying a bit of either/starting fluid in there is OK as long as you go very spareingly!!!

take the rubber intake hose loose, and do not spray dirrectly INTO the hose, but just at it... you can keep it running that way for several seconds with out much problems but it burns very HOT compaired to fuel so that is ONE way to get the hydraulics UP. use a bungie to HOLD levers up if need be or better yet put the wifie on there hold brakes on, and out of gear, hold FEL and 3 pt levers in UP/RAISE and start while you spray the fluid... this will get you going to raise then slowly un-brake to let tractor go down hill...


here is link to the fuel starting prob post
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Board/china/Number/464690/page/0/view/collapsed/sb/5/o/all/fpart/all

Mark M
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #29  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Hello All,
This sounds familiar, went 200 yards down the road and it died. It was till getting some fuel but not enough to run or start, I found the filter inside the fuel tank, which is in the inlet port of the fuel bowl housing was colapsed. Took a while to find that out, kept thinking it was something complicated.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#30  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Mark,
I unfortunately I have read that same post several times, I wish the guy would post a follow-up and let us know what was actually the problem and how he fixed it. There are some similarities but mine was running fine before it stalled. Now I am not getting fuel past injector pump. I am gong down to Sears today and getting a set of 21mm and larger open end wrenches to remove the hard lines at the injectors. Hopefully this will release the last bit of air in the system.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#31  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

This morning I went to sears and got larger open end wrenches. The hard lines leading to the injectors need a 21mm.
I unscrewed all 3, pumped the primer pump, no fuel came out. Since I don't have a decompression knob in the cab, I only have a the fitting on the valve cover end, seems it was never hooked up, I engaged it as best I could with a screwdriver. Engaged the starter, got the oil pressure up, then disengaged the decompression. Notice no change in sound or engine speed, and more importantly still no fuel out of hard lines.
Last ditch effort I removed the intake hose, engaged the starter and sparingly sprayed the starting fluid around the intake. It didn't have much effect, the engine knocked a couple of times and that was it. It did not catch and run.
What gives here? I am getting very frustrated and feel really bad that I just paid good money for a large yard ornament.
What am I missing? Is the decompression thing whacked, Is the injector pump broke, wow I give up!!!
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #32  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I engaged it as best I could with a screwdriver. )</font> </font><font color="blue" class="small">( Notice no change in sound or engine speed )</font> </font><font color="blue" class="small">( Is the decompression thing whacked )</font>

My compression release experience has been with Yanmars but the experience should be the same. You should be able to hear a noticeable difference in the engine speed when you have the compression release opened. The engine will spin faster and sound different.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #33  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Seven,,,I don't believe you ever said where you bought it,,,sounds like it is new,,,should have somekind of warrenty??,,,Did you ever get it off the hill? That would make things easyier maybe,,,,that decompression deal,,,it has got a spring,[course mines got a lever,,,but once you release it,,everhow you are doing it,,,it should not be holding valves open,,,,just did a valve lash setting last winter on mine,,,alls it does is hold open your intake valves,[think it was intake],,,,if you got a concern there,[other than yours ain't hooked up right],,its a easy job to take valve cover off,,,will probably need a new gasket,,before its over,,,but if your carefull,,,,but that probably ain't it,,,I wouldn't think,,it won't just decompress by itself,,,espeicially since yours ain't got no lever to begin with,,thingy
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#34  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Gosh I wish I knew what to do next, no one in my area will work on it, I called all the local dealers and they all said the same thing we only work on what we sell.... I am not sure how to proceed.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #35  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Lets get back to the basics.
Any smoke at all from exhaust when cranking?
probably not if no fuel.

Are you sure nothing is holding the fuel stop lever away from its normal fully forward on position? I have seen this, This is the lever on the pump that moves when you use the pull to stop knob . be sure it has returned to the ON position.

Did you try to pump it manually while cranking (takes 2 people)?

I'm not sure if the primer pump will pump past the pistons in the injector pump, I'll have to try it sometime but it will pumpthrough the line back into the tank.

You can take the round plate off the front of the timing cover in front of the injector pump and make sure the pump is turnning with the engine. Someone posted that a key failed or a bolt came off or something and the injector pump quit turning.

If your injector pump did not have oil in it, it may have gotten damaged in 10 hours of use and may not be putting out enough pressure now to pop the injectors, but I don't think that will be the case.

Best of luck and keep us posted,

Chip
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#36  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

All,
here is an update, I called Gary @ Emerybuilt and he had me take off the primer pump cover to see if the cam is turning. Its not, next he had me take off the pump assembly front cover to see if the nut was still on, it was but the gear was lose! probably a broken keyway, I am going to line up my marks then remove the gear and inspect for damage. I will be taking some pictures to document the process to help others in future. I was beginning to lose hope. I am still not out of the woods but now I have a clearer picture of what is happening. Check this link out for additional info on the pump assembly:
http://www.emerybuilt.com/fuelpump.htm
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#37  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Gosh this is going to be fun! I have to try and get this thing inside my garage it is a realy pain in the XXX working on it in the mud and rain. I think I am going to turn the starter to raise the fel. Any idea how long it should take to get it up a couple of feet? Everything is all muddy now, just my luck, The truck is going to tear up the lawn and the wifey will complain.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #38  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Well since you won't say,,,must be some kind of a put it together your self crate tractor with minus 1 day warrenty?? First thing I woulda done when mine was new would have been call nortrac,,,and let them figure it out for me,,,,still,hope you have solved the problem,,,,,my local john deere and massy ferg dealers both said they would work on my tractor if needed,,,course they are independant and need the money,,thingy
 
   / Won't Start after Stall
  • Thread Starter
#39  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Sorry Richard didn't mean to not answer, I bought it from a dealer in FL, I live in VA bad move on my part, learned only after reading boards that it is important to have dealer support. Anyway there are no dealers within 3 hour ride from me. There is a mechanic that works on my f-250 that said he could get it running but have to wait two weeks for opening. From what I gather it might not be that hard of a fix. If I could just get the darn thing off the hill and in my shop. We are getting hit by that tropical storm and it has dumped alot of water it will sure make it interesting trying to pull it up the hill.
 
   / Won't Start after Stall #40  
Re: Won\'t Start after Stall

Sounds like you got a handle on it. The big quesiton is will the Mrs. ever drive it again?
 

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