Working in the Bucket

[JYH]

I just read the long thread about lifting with chains. Great to digest all views -- from the conservative to the cautious to the confident.

I've got another safety question. Does anyone out there use the bucket of their FEL as a stand for doing work?

The dealer just delivered our M5700 with the LA1002 loader (with chain hooks welded to the bucket by the way...). I read all the labels and warnings in the manual, but I thought I'd ask members of this forum for real-world opinions.

Would working in the bucket (for sawing limbs 10' off the ground, or painting, or cleaning gutters) be safer than working with a ladder? I like the idea of using angle iron cut to the length of the cylinder rod as protection against hose blow-out.

Thanks,
John

 

[Bird]

John, there's no doubt that working on any ladder, or working while standing in the loader bucket, is dangerous. I think that is something everyone has to decide for himself. I certainly don't recommend using the bucket for this (but my brother and I do it).

Bird

 

[Thomas]

John,
If you feel safe enough trying be careful,and maybe shut the tractor off also use the parking brake plus chalk a wheel.

Thomas..NH /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[Harv]

John -

Now you got me thinking again (I wish people would stop doing that).

The thread you referred to convinced me that the bucket was no place for humans, even when the tractor is powered down. But now that you brought up the subject of ladders, I'm caught in that awkward zone of relativity. That is, how dangerous is a bucket compared to a ladder?

I'm relatively new to the world of tractors, but I can recount (no, not in the electoral sense) at least a dozen horror stories involving ladders from people I have known personally. Have to admit, I've had a few close calls myself.

It seems that the main danger from a raised bucket centers on some kind of hydraulic failure (exploding hoses, etc.). As I think of it now, that seems less likely than having your extension ladder suddenly lose its footing or you missing a rung on the way up or down.

I'm not buying into the bucket-riding idea yet myself, but it seems like the angle-iron or split-pipe idea for bracing the cylinder is a reasonable precaution.

BTW - Maybe I'm just a bit dense here, but if your bucket is 10 feet up and the cylinder is braced, exactly how do you get into the bucket?

I'm drawing no conclusion yet, but I will be following this thread with renewed interest.

 

[MChalkley]

Harv - I think you're barking up the right tree there. I don't say too much about working from the bucket because I've worked out of the bucket, or worked the tractor while someone else did, many times.

Still, I'd be very reluctant to recommend the practice to others. For one thing, hydraulics are frequently very touchy (though the motion limiter on the joystick can help this a great deal) and, even if there's no malfunction, the operator could still move the lever the wrong way, too quickly, or make some other mistake that could cause a serious accident. The same could happen with the tractor's motion controls.

On the whole, though, potential operator error aside (it's not just an unknown factor, it's an unpredictable variable, and the potential exists with ladders, too), I'd say the bucket is a lot safer than the average ladder as a work platform. Just don't use it that way 'cause I said so. /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

MarkC

 

[RBManufacturing]

JYH,
Up until two yrs. ago, I use to help the small city where
I live hang christmas lights in the park, and wreaths on
all the street light poles, using a FEL. The rough
terrain, and trying to carry a wreath up a ladder made the
FEL method much safer. Plus, I could carry tape, stapler,
hammer, etc. in bucket. My present business partner was
the FEL operator. I trusted her to run FEL as much as I
trusted her to hold ladder on un-even surfaces.
Recommend it? Depends. Done it ? yes. Rick

Rick Hedgecock
R&B Manufacturing

 

[Billc]

I also work from the bucket and my wife drives the tractor...BUT, I am really, really, really, really, nice to her for at least 4 days before we do this. Lots of flowers, "I love yous", "Gosh, looks like you've lost a little weight, are you o.k.?", "Your hair looks great, what are you doing to it, coconut butter?", "You know, hun, you were terrific in your 30s, but now in your 40s your eyes sparkle like never before!", "Of course I want to go and see (whatever sappy woman movie is playing at the theaters, ususally starring with Barbara Streisand, of course) and let me hold your kleenex...I love it when you tear up at a movie!", "Sweetie, you've worked too hard today, let me make dinner, do the dishes, and give you a back rub!", "[censored] those insurance people, they say my term life insurance was cancelled yesterday. Please be really carful with the bucket, sweetheart, if I get hurt you'll be responsible for all of the bills. As soon as we're done I'll get the insurance mess straightened out."

So people do it, like me, but I wonder about their mental state, like mine, when they do it.

 

[MarkV]

Bill,

To funny!/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[bpence]

Being a safety freak, I'll say up front you really, really, really, really need to think about what you are going to do if/when you get into a FEL bucket and who your on-tractor operator is. Would I recommend you get into a bucket and go up? Never. Have I ever done it? Yep. But I was a lot younger and was indestructible.

If you are going to go up in a bucket, you need to consider safety harnesses and lines to ensure you don't come down out of the bucket using the shortest route. Nothing wrong with saftey harnesses and saftey lines.....remember it's you 8'-10' in the air and a bucket doesn't present much of a platform to stand on and doesn't have a lot of hand holds. Even sitting in the bucket should be done only with safety lines, if done at all.

Just think it over a whole lot before you decide to go up in the bucket.


Bob Pence

 

[gerard]

I work in the bucket and consider it as safe as any above ground operation. If you look at work platforms, cherry pickers etc there are a lot of hydraulic machines designed for hoisting humans up high. All are prone to a line blowing out and maybe coming down a lot faster than you would like. I guess you have to look at probabilities. I think a line blowing out is a lot less likley than a ladder slipping and when you consider the weight of you in the bucket is only a fraction of the rated capacity it makes a FEL failure even more unlikely. Harv - when by myself I use a ladder leaned gainst the bucket to get up into it.

 

[roysallis]

I work from my FEL bucket when necessary. My wife operates the tractor. After she raises the bucket she puts the tractor in park, cuts off the engine, and stays away form the joystick. I do not see this as being dangerous if all safety precautions are take. Electric power technicians, telephone technicians, tree trimmers, etc. use cherry pickers every day. So I believe that the hydraulics should not be something to be afraid of failing if yor equipment is well maintained.

 

[ddl]

After reading all the safety items here, it is amazing that I grew up working on the farm. The point most miss is that there is nothing completely safe. You need to seperate the people who grew up on the farm from the ones who made enough money to buy an acreage. Everything is not safe and again it is safe, it all depends on the type of person you are. If you go around afraid of everything, you are an accident waiting to happen. If you respect everything and everything you do with respect, you will not have a bad accident in your life. The thing I keep seeing as I read these articles, is Harv all bundled up like the kid in the movies with too many coats and can not move. Or in other words, buying the next item someone lists in the group. Treat everything with respect and you will not have problem.

Dan L

 

[RobertN]

Hey Rick!
Just a thought that might fit your situation. Does you Fire Dept have a aerial truck? We have placed holiday decorations around a town in our district, using our aerial truck company. I have seen other towns doing the same.

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[scruffy]

My main concern with those utilizing the bucket for a platform is a simple one. The hydraulics are NOT a major concern on a well maintained tractor, but the bucket itself is! It (by nature of design) has a curve or angles inside that are not conducive to good footing. A slight overbalancing of the body can cause a person to move their feet in an attempt to correct that problem, thus stepping on the curve or angle and excerbating the act of being over balanced. Any objects placed in the bucket for said overhead job can also create this problem. I would not be so concerned if some sort of railing was added to the bucket (which could easily be constructed out of pipe) to prevent accidental discharging of valuable commodities, such as bodies....and when it's my body, I've broken enough bones (to include neck) already thank you!

 

[RBManufacturing]

RobertN and scruffy,
We do have an aerial truck now, but our city council does
not like the idea of it being used for anything TRIVIAL.
A highway leading out of town has a curve in it with a
guard rail on outside of curce, and a bridge over the
highway. A couple of yrs. ago, a local woman lost control
and hit rail, and then bridge support. She was pinned in
car for over an hr. while we waited for a neighboring town
to send a fire truck with the "jaws of life." The
following week, we asked the council to purchase the jaws.
The response we got was."thats the first time and probably
the last time we would need them. REQUEST DENIED.
We are a town of 3013 people, with a RIVERBOAT for gabling.
We are one of the richest cities per capita in the U.S.
Same bunch of council members or members of their family
has run this town for over twenty yrs. I was a police
officer here and a fireman for 11 yrs. I worked two jobs
at the time. When I was told to let the mayors grand
daughter go for the third time for speeding, and minor in
possesion of alcohol, I QUIT. Miss it sometimes, but hated
the politics of a small town. HEY SCRUFFY, neck too ?????
I broke three vertebra in my neck in 1993. Hit in neck
with a forklift forks during a sand bagging effort during
the flood of 93. 16 wks. in rehab in braces, and partially
paralized now on left side. I don't notice it much anymore.
The paralysis that is. The pain is still there. At time,
surgery and success of surgery was not rated a good
percentage. Going for another MRI in two weeks. They tell
me surgery techniques are better now. I spent a life time
trying to keep anyone from cutting my throat, and now it
looks like i might ask someone to. Rick

Rick Hedgecock
R&B Manufacturing

 

[TomG]

Could be wrong, but I don't think I've seen crew on a construction site riding around in loader buckets. I imagine government safety folks and the company's insurance underwriters would throw fits. Of course, the same folks throw fits if ladders aren't tied off at the top.

I think the main accident risk is losing one's balance and missing, or not having, a handhold. With an extension ladder, there's always something above you to grab.

I wonder if anybody knows if cherry pickers lack fail-safes or not. Loss of hydraulic pressure could trigger a brake. I know that Otis invented an elevator safety device. If a cable snaps, dogs extend into notched tracks to prevent free fall of the elevator car. An Otis device is a requirement for elevators in most public buildings, but not for elevators used on high rise construction sites. Maybe same is true for cherry pickers. Sort of ironic; if you work at a dangerous job, you have less safety protection than regular folks.

 

[RobertN]

Small towns can be great, but also frustrating sometimes. It does amaze me how people will foresake safety items, even with proof of how well they have worked in a proven situation. You certainly don't expect disaster, but you can plan to deal with it. A Hurst tool is expensive, but what price a life saved versus lost. Some people just don't see that though.

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[RobertN]

Steve Carver has lifts and cherry pickers, maybe he could comment on how the safety system works?

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[gerard]

Just read an article related to this. headline was "FIRE DEPT SAVES MAN STUCK IN BUCKET TRUCK" "Pat Bechler, an electrician, said he was 30-40 feet in the air in the bucket when a hydraulic line burst, leaving him unable to descend." (The fire dept got him down with a ladder) Guess that answers the safety valve question!

 

[RBManufacturing]

RobertN
True about small towns. I received a phone call today I
just have to share. First, let me tell you that 3 wks. ago,
a street crew member in our town rolled his mower down a
steep bank behind our city hall. We just got a new mayor
last April. Old mayor had tiltmeters on both city tractors.
New tractors were bought in July. Mayor refused to buy
meters, and bought 2w.d. tractors instead of the 4w.d.
that we had. Said 4w.d. too expensive. Traded old tractors
without removing meters. Injured employee asked me to
participate in his law suit. Told him I would think about
it. Now to the phone call. Advised by city clerk, on order
from mayor that The zoning where I have my business may
not be zoned for my company. Gee, they said it was when I
got my city business license. Nice lady that mayor.
Extortion, black mail, call it what you may, it sucks.
Called mayor. I have to answer about participating in suit
By Dec.1. She says she will let me know Dec.2 what she
decides on zoning question. Everything I own is in this
company. Should I participate in suit. Probably not. Will
I participate? Most likely. I never did play well with the
other children. Another chapter in the life and times of
owning your own company. Already have a new location picked
anyway. Now about the finances of this town. Annual budget
is 1.3 million. Because of revenue from river boat, we now
have 28.1 million in bank. Can't afford those 4w.d. tractors
though. We did get a new wider street complete with curbs,
landscaping, etc. recently. The mayor lives on that street,
and owns 8 rental houses there also. Its good to be the
king. Rick


Rick Hedgecock
R&B Manufacturing