Would you buy an electric truck?

[4570Man]

The issue is with the generator. The engine in a Prius is a relatively large, fuel injected, water cooled engine optimized for fuel efficiency which costs several thousand dollars new. The engine in a generator is a small, carbureted, air-cooled engine optimized for price which costs a few hundred dollars. From the start the generator engine will be less efficient.

The EU2000 has two other disadvantages on top of that. The first is that it's a low power generator. Bigger engines of the same type tend to be more fuel efficient and the 100 cc engine simply won't be as efficient as something bigger. Then there's the fact that the EU2000 is an inverter generator. Inverter generators are a great optimization for variable, often low, loads. It comes at an efficiency cost though. At full power an inverter will be less efficient than a conventional generator of the same size.

The EU2000 will get the job done, but for charging an EV a bigger, standard generator will give better MPG.

At least one person did the test with a good diesel generator and found a mileage of 4.2 l/100KM, or about 56 US MPG, but they don't say how they accounted for slow charging as the EV reaches 100%.

The couple hundred dollar engine was never an option. A Kubota diesel would do a fine job running a generator.

 

[5030]

Would I purchase an electric truck.................NEVER
If someone gave me one for free, I'd take it however.

 

[3930dave]

First Taste is Free......

Given how many pimped out golf-carts I see tooling around here (not a planned/closed community) the last 2 or 3 years.... it won't be long....

(Meaning..... before I see them on the road here. Not high enough on my Buy list to be near-future for me.....)

Rgds, D.

 

[crazyal]

EVs seam like a product that's not quite there yet. Lots of pluses but the negatives still are major hurdles. The biggest one is charging time. Sure you can plug it in at home and as long as you travel a limited range you'll most likely be fine. But some of us travel further than that and value their time and sitting watching a car charge isn't on my list of things I like doing. I don't see charging times dropping to close to the time it takes to fill a gas tank. The more power the bigger the power cable must be. That means some different way of charging is needed (or swapping batteries). I was hoping Tesla would move to a system where the driver just parks on top of a charger vs connecting a cable. Something could pop up on the screen and ask if you wanted to charge the car. I don't see a EV truck in my future any time soon. My truck is for towing things like my tractor. Unless real world results come back differently I expect the range to drop roughly in half just like a ICE truck dos when towing a heavy load.

I wish people would stop the nonsense about ICE longevity. Almost every modern engine will go 200k miles without a problem. Just simple oil changes and a few parts. Long before the engine is a problem other parts of the car are an issue. The interior is showing it's age. The body has lots of wear and tear. Bearings are going. I'm much more interested in something like the Rav4 plug in. 40 miles of battery only and then a gas engine to charge it or plug it in. Long trips require nothing extra.

But hydrogen is the future. It can easily be transported with pips and trucks. It can be made at the source and transported 1000s of miles. It can be combined with nitrogen to make safe and then split back apart. It can be stored without any loss. A solar farm near a large body of water can make both hydrogen and oxygen from sunrise to sunset almost fully automated. Trucks transporting it can be powered by it. That truly would be carbon neutral. But, like with EVs, the source isn't always the cleanest (fossil fuel power plants and nat gas for H2). A hybrid plug in fuel cell car seams like it would be the ideal solution.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

EVs seam like a product that's not quite there yet. Lots of pluses but the negatives still are major hurdles. The biggest one is charging time. Sure you can plug it in at home and as long as you travel a limited range you'll most likely be fine. But some of us travel further than that and value their time and sitting watching a car charge isn't on my list of things I like doing. I don't see charging times dropping to close to the time it takes to fill a gas tank. The more power the bigger the power cable must be. That means some different way of charging is needed (or swapping batteries). I was hoping Tesla would move to a system where the driver just parks on top of a charger vs connecting a cable. Something could pop up on the screen and ask if you wanted to charge the car. I don't see a EV truck in my future any time soon. My truck is for towing things like my tractor. Unless real world results come back differently I expect the range to drop roughly in half just like a ICE truck dos when towing a heavy load.

I wish people would stop the nonsense about ICE longevity. Almost every modern engine will go 200k miles without a problem. Just simple oil changes and a few parts. Long before the engine is a problem other parts of the car are an issue. The interior is showing it's age. The body has lots of wear and tear. Bearings are going. I'm much more interested in something like the Rav4 plug in. 40 miles of battery only and then a gas engine to charge it or plug it in. Long trips require nothing extra.

But hydrogen is the future. It can easily be transported with pips and trucks. It can be made at the source and transported 1000s of miles. It can be combined with nitrogen to make safe and then split back apart. It can be stored without any loss. A solar farm near a large body of water can make both hydrogen and oxygen from sunrise to sunset almost fully automated. Trucks transporting it can be powered by it. That truly would be carbon neutral. But, like with EVs, the source isn't always the cleanest (fossil fuel power plants and nat gas for H2). A hybrid plug in fuel cell car seams like it would be the ideal solution.

I agree solar energy will be a driver of transportation in the future. It's the up-front cost that slows new technology.

 

[crazyal]

Unless oil is our future we are going to have to do something. Our electrical grid is nowhere near where it needs to be if every vehicle was an EV. It alone will take trillions. Could you imagine what would happen if we had another blackout like the one NY had a couple decades ago or that ice storm in Canada and New England? The fools who would use their EVs to power their houses only to drain their car and now not only have no power but no transportation as well. Around here a standby generator is usually a portable one in the 5000w range since a house with AC (not a portable window one) is pretty rare and we don't heat with electricity. Most people assume that a power outage is going to be only a few hours at most. In the last 10 years I've had 3 at my house that were over 4 days.

 

[3930dave]

Cali can't seem to keep their grid up, at only somewhat-less-than The Best of Times......

(Not belittling the current loss of life in fires. But <- these events are tiny compared to The Big Quake or tsunami that are possible - no utilities will survive events of that scale intact).

Cali grid can't keep up with today's AC load....... I really can't see flipping over the State driving fleet to even 30% EV anytime soon.

Rgds, D.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Unless oil is our future we are going to have to do something. Our electrical grid is nowhere near where it needs to be if every vehicle was an EV. It alone will take trillions. Could you imagine what would happen if we had another blackout like the one NY had a couple decades ago or that ice storm in Canada and New England? The fools who would use their EVs to power their houses only to drain their car and now not only have no power but no transportation as well. Around here a standby generator is usually a portable one in the 5000w range since a house with AC (not a portable window one) is pretty rare and we don't heat with electricity. Most people assume that a power outage is going to be only a few hours at most. In the last 10 years I've had 3 at my house that were over 4 days.

I do not think the sun is going to stop shining? Power generation is moving to the point of need reducing loads for the current aging grid. Keep in mind Elon Musk is thinking of places like the Moon and Mars and how to power habitats there. Some think he is competing with Detroit building cars which is not the case per him. He just wants to show the world how to reduce the use of non-renewal energies by transportation industry.

Battery powered tractors may stay parked for months at a time earning no money but they can earn money 365 days out of the year if they become part of the power grid.

 

[grsthegreat]

Cali can't seem to keep their grid up, at only somewhat-less-than The Best of Times......

(Not belittling the current loss of life in fires. But <- these events are tiny compared to The Big Quake or tsunami that are possible - no utilities will survive events of that scale intact).

Cali grid can't keep up with today's AC load....... I really can't see flipping over the State driving fleet to even 30% EV anytime soon.

Rgds, D.

the reason they cant kerp the grid going is due to the decommissioning of nuclear plants and natural gas power plants. Add that to their wanting to decommission hydroelectric dams.... there left with wind and solar. Not working too good for them

 

[Grumpycat]

Something seems amiss there. I googled and found people saying that their teslas get (avg) 3-3.5 miles per kWh, twice what you quote. Granted that's output not input, and there will be charging losses, but a 100% disparity?

Your math is wrong.

My power hog 2013 Model S 85 is 0.380 kWh/mile from the power grid. Note the units. Now do math: 3 miles per 1 kWh is 0.333 kWh/mile. 3.5 miles per kWh is 0.287 kWh/mile. Tesla Model 3 is rated 0.260 kWh/mile from the power grid. My Model S will cruise at 0.280 kWh/mile out of the battery at 55-60 MPH.
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That seems excessive. And even if the disparity was eliminated, still only 24mpg? I would think that a small engine running constant RPM at rated load (right in its power band) would be more efficient. The little Honda generator + Tesla combination should be about the most efficient hybrid out there. I would expect it to beat prius' 50mpg without batting an eye. What is the issue? Is the Honda generator just a little turd or what? Surely the turd isn't the tesla?

A portable generator is a terribly inefficient engine relative to a modern automobile engine. The Prius engine is one of the most efficient internal combustion engines ever placed in production.

Chevrolet's original concept for the Volt was just as you suggest: engine drives generator, charges battery, battery drives electric motors to make the car go. Volt was several years late because this concept returned pathetic MPG. Chevrolet had to come up with a Rube Goldberg solution to couple the engine directly to drive wheels to keep from being laughed out of the market.

That didn't stop BMW. Germans never admit engineering mistakes. BMW i3 REx (the "range extended" version) is as you describe. 650cc engine drives generator. Little car gets 32 MPG and can not sustain reasonable speeds on some of the long interstate hills in California when the battery runs low. Some can't go 70 MPH on flat lands under engine-only.

I think BMW screwed up big with the i3. The REx range extender engine/generator should have been on a user-installable tray. Rather than sell 2 models of the car with and without the REx they should have made the REx an accessory. That one could buy the car without and add later. Or even rent for a weekend trip. Wouldn't take long before 3rd parties figure out how to build a battery which looks like the REx to the car. Provide the option of extended battery range, or even the option of a swappable battery pack.