Zero Turn buying advice

/ Zero Turn buying advice #1  

Torvy

Super Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2021
Messages
7,620
Location
North East Texas
Tractor
TYM T574H
I don't have enough 'lawn' for this, but my neighbor is looking. He's got about 60 total acres, but maybe 5 or 6 that need mowing. He's got a CUT already.

Looking to get him some good options. Give me 2 choices. One where price doesn't matter and one where you get the most bang for your buck.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #2  
Diesel or gas?
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #3  
The best bang for your buck, when it comes to residential zero turn mowers, is the Gravely ZT HD.

But for 5 or 6 acres, you’ll definitely want a Commercial mower. The Gravely Pro Turn Series and the Hustler Super Z is excellent options.

A lot of your post depends on what’s being sold around your location. If going with a gas engine, get a Kawasaki. Get a Commercial machine with big hydro pumps. Buy a good name brand from a good reputable dealer.
In my area, I see the commercial guys mainly running Gravely, Hustler, Scag, and John Deere.

I personally would stay away from Bad Boy mowers. Prices are eye catching, but the quality just isn’t there yet, in my opinion.

Good luck and please post back what he decided to buy!

Have a Blessed Day!

Travis
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice
  • Thread Starter
#4  
Diesel or gas?
I dont know that he has a preference. We have a 'neighbor' group chat and so far the only advice he got was to get diesel. The tractor is, so he'll already have fuel. Nearest ethanol free is about 20 minutes away.

There's a Kubota dealer not far and JD is that same 20 minute drive. Lots of options within a hour or so (multiple directions).

He's retiring. They've had the place for as long as us, but have been just in from the city on weekends and such.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #5  
I'd suggest a Kubota or Deere diesel
Good parts & service
Really like my ZD-1211's so far
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #6  
I prefer diesels. The ease of fuel handling alone makes it worth the extra expense for me.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #7  
I prefer diesels. The ease of fuel handling alone makes it worth the extra expense for me.
Absolutely agree if he has access to on farm diesel. I sold a really great Ferris ZTR with a 30HP Vanguard engine. Great mower, but big mowers drink a lot of gas. Not worth the hassle.

I currently have a Bad Boy diesel that's 12 years old with the CAT/Perkins engine. Cruder than the Ferris, but heavily built. Only a couple of small repairs done in the farm shop (and some of those frankly operator error...). Also have a Kubota front deck mower which I bought because it has the same great small diesel my RTV1100 has in it. I did the first complete service on it - it is a very well built commercial machine - I went through it from one end to the other to bring it up to almost new standards (it only had 460 hrs on it).

You don't see commercial guys using Bad Boys around here though. I'm going to bet most commercial mower dealers aren't as good on diesels, either (they don't sell them in as great a number). A farm tractor dealer will be familiar with diesels and have quick access to manufacturer assistance.

All that means I would go with a Kubota dealer if close by. Pricey, but worth it. My neighbor has a Kubota diesel ZTR - he loves it.

As Hay Dude notes, John Deere may offer good diesel mowers as well. A lot of commercial guys around here use them. I just have no experience with them myself.

Grasshopper offers good diesel mowers as well (they used to use Kubota diesels).

Best of Luck.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice
  • Thread Starter
#8  
I dont know what his budget is. I also had no clue what a ZT would run. Those diesel ones are as much as a small CUT.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #9  
I dont know what his budget is. I also had no clue what a ZT would run. Those diesel ones are as much as a small CUT.
I’d buy a lightly used diesel before a new gas.
Big block gas is way too thirsty and gas is a PITA to haul around.
But might be good for on-site, non trailered use.
 
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/ Zero Turn buying advice #10  
If price doesn't matter, Kubota has front mount diesel mowers besides their diesel ZTRs, too.

Low price ZTR would be the 42" Cub Cadet at Tractor Supply that is $3,099 on sale now.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #11  
I would also go with a commercial unit over a residential. Any of the Deere 900 series would be top commercial quality. I have a friend with a 700 series and it is also a very nice mower, for quite a bit less money than the comparable size 900 series. John Deere mowers have about the best cut quality that I have personally experienced for the grass around me.

I just picked up a used Kubota ZD1211 in the last week. I've only mowed with it once so far, but I'm very happy with it based on that one experience. I'm not as familiar with the Kubota offering but I do know they are good mowers. I do see more Deere mowers on lawn service trailers than Kubota. But I do see Kubota's used commercially here and there as well.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #12  
Diesel will far outlast a gasser no matter what make the engine is and gassers are all guzzlers. Don't care if it's a Kowalski or a Briggs and Startem, they are all disposa engines.

I'd by a name brand with Hydro Gear pumps over any others and HG pumps with filter on them as well.

I'm partial to Kubota but any name brand will do actually. They all do the same thing, cut grass. How long they last is the important aspect. When making any large investment in any machine, longevity is paramount as well as parts availability like blades and belts and a good dealer as well.

One Kubota I'd never buy is a Kubota skid steer. For some reason, Kubota builds an issue prone skid.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #13  
I'm a Bota diesel fan but I must disagree about the Kawa engines. I have a JD 717A that is 25 years old and no telling how many hours. Runs as good as the day I bought it and is still the best cut quality of any mower I've ever had. Not too awfully bad on fuel either. But I do love my 1211.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #14  
I’d buy a lightly used diesel before a new gas.
Big block gas is way too thirsty and gas is a PITA to haul around.
But might be good for on-site, non trailered use.
Gasser is still mighty thirsty at home, figure about 1 gallon per acre in thick spring grass, tapering down to 0.7 gallons per acre as grass thins mid-summer. But on the flip side, a homeowner may never mow enough grass in their lifetime, to make up the added cost of a diesel ZTR, in fuel savings.

The Z994R diesel with 25hp and 60" deck runs $22k. Same configuration with gasoline runs $15k, literally $7k less. The difference grows even more when comparing the 35hp models.

Diesel fuel presently costs 20% more than gasoline locally, presently $3.11 and $3.79 per gallon at our local stations. Let's pretend you're averaging 0.8 gallons/acre in gasoline mowing 130 acres of your own land per year, and that diesels use half the fuel of gassers, which might actually be pretty close to reality. With these prices, it will take you 56 years to recoup the added cost of the diesel mower, in fuel savings... assuming either mower lasted even half that long.

This is why I don't understand anyone buying diesel for personal use, whether on-road vehicles or mowers, the economics just don't work for personal use. In order to get a reasonable 5 year break-even, you need to be mowing 1460 acres per year, at the above pricing. That's a full time job, not just mowing your own yard.

Diesel will far outlast a gasser no matter what make the engine is and gassers are all guzzlers. Don't care if it's a Kowalski or a Briggs and Startem, they are all disposa engines.
I'll never defend anything made by Briggs, but the Kawi's spec'd by Deere aren't terrible. The Kawi's spec'd by some other mower brands use their weaker breather design, which can blow out and force you to do a total teardown to replace, but Deere spec's a unique crankcase breather that's much more robust.

I have 1200 hours on my Kawi V-twin, and it's still running strong. It required a new ignition coil last year ($100?), and I went ahead and put new heads and head gaskets on it, since the valve guides were starting to slip, but that was totally discretionary spending. The reality is that I could put a brand new Kawi gasoline engine on that mower every 5th year before coming close to the lifetime cost of just one diesel ZTR.

The biggest killer of the gassers is compromised cooling, due to people not cleaning grass out of the cooling fins well enough. And that's not always the owner's fault, the design of these engines is absolutely terrible, with regard to being susceptible to grass impairing the cooling. You really need to pull all the shrounds off and blow them clean at least every 50 - 100 hours, and blow what you can from the outside between each mowing. I don't know if the diesels are better in this regard, but I have trouble imagining how they could be, all engines are susceptible to impaired cooling when the grass is flying.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #16  
Local Hustler rep told me I would never recoup cost of diesel engine for my residential lawn mowing.

I'm sure that's true for 99% of homeowners. When I did the math for my use of cutting about 1000 acres per year, diesel pays off... but not by much.
That said, if I were only cutting my 6 acres, I would still have a diesel for the easier fuel handling, quiet engine, and longevity.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #17  
Gasser is still mighty thirsty at home, figure about 1 gallon per acre in thick spring grass, tapering down to 0.7 gallons per acre as grass thins mid-summer. But on the flip side, a homeowner may never mow enough grass in their lifetime, to make up the added cost of a diesel ZTR, in fuel savings.

The Z994R diesel with 25hp and 60" deck runs $22k. Same configuration with gasoline runs $15k, literally $7k less. The difference grows even more when comparing the 35hp models.

Diesel fuel presently costs 20% more than gasoline locally, presently $3.11 and $3.79 per gallon at our local stations. Let's pretend you're averaging 0.8 gallons/acre in gasoline mowing 130 acres of your own land per year, and that diesels use half the fuel of gassers, which might actually be pretty close to reality. With these prices, it will take you 56 years to recoup the added cost of the diesel mower, in fuel savings... assuming either mower lasted even half that long.

This is why I don't understand anyone buying diesel for personal use, whether on-road vehicles or mowers, the economics just don't work for personal use. In order to get a reasonable 5 year break-even, you need to be mowing 1460 acres per year, at the above pricing. That's a full time job, not just mowing your own yard.
Red dyed diesel fuel is $2.99/G.
I am commercial use (I know you know that) and I am into like 10,000 gallons of diesel per year, so its much more convenient having diesel on hand.
A diesel is going to go way longer before tear down, and fetch higher resale, too.

I'll never defend anything made by Briggs, but the Kawi's spec'd by Deere aren't terrible. The Kawi's spec'd by some other mower brands use their weaker breather design, which can blow out and force you to do a total teardown to replace, but Deere spec's a unique crankcase breather that's much more robust.

I have 1200 hours on my Kawi V-twin, and it's still running strong. It required a new ignition coil last year ($100?), and I went ahead and put new heads and head gaskets on it, since the valve guides were starting to slip, but that was totally discretionary spending. The reality is that I could put a brand new Kawi gasoline engine on that mower every 5th year before coming close to the lifetime cost of just one diesel ZTR.

The biggest killer of the gassers is compromised cooling, due to people not cleaning grass out of the cooling fins well enough. And that's not always the owner's fault, the design of these engines is absolutely terrible, with regard to being susceptible to grass impairing the cooling. You really need to pull all the shrounds off and blow them clean at least every 50 - 100 hours, and blow what you can from the outside between each mowing. I don't know if the diesels are better in this regard, but I have trouble imagining how they could be, all engines are susceptible to impaired cooling when the grass is flying.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #18  
5 or 6 acres is a lot of mowing over a period of years.
 
/ Zero Turn buying advice #19  
Local Hustler rep told me I would never recoup cost of diesel engine for my residential lawn mowing.
Exactly why I went gas on my zero turn.
When I bought my Hustler Super Z in 2013 (35 HP Kawaski with 72" deck) a diesel was an additional $4500 if I remember correctly.

Lets say the Kawasaki gas engine on my commercial Hustler zero turn has a 2000 hour life span, I put 50 hours per year average, it would take me 40 years to reach 2000 hours.

As far as fuel savings gas vs diesel. I use 5 gallon of gas to mow my 8 acre lawn, lets say a diesel take 3 gallon to mow that same lawn, saving 2 gallon per mow, 25 mows per year.
50 gallon less fuel per year at $3.25/gallon for off road diesel it would take me 27 years to hit the break even point for upgrading to diesel engine.
So I went gas.
 
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/ Zero Turn buying advice #20  
I’m putting ~20 hours per week on my ZD-331’s, or about 400 hours per year.

I don’t even know if Kubota offers a 72” gasser.
 

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